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ATAG_EvangelusE
Jan-10-2012, 08:45
Just a few observations on the current mission - not criticsms :)

1. Is there a possibility that when mission objectives are completed that the mission runs longer so that players can land, or if engaged otherwise, have a bit of extra time to complete that engagement - maybe 10 minutes? (maybe a screen message that informs "Mission End in 10 Minutes - disengage and RTB")

2. Originally the AI bombers were meant to encourage Player confrontations at altitude but is mission success now determined soley by Players bombing key targets?

If some of the AI bomber runs could contribut to partial success of a mission it would encourage players to escort them and generate more player v player combat at altitude. Most player objectives are conducted at low altitude. The bombers seem to be somewhat redundant other than target fodder.

ATAG_Torian
Jan-10-2012, 09:49
Good points. Would be good to have red AI bombers at least partially contribute to
attacking objectives as red is much more limited in only having the Blenhiem. Blues
have access to Stukas, 110s and Ju88s (is the E3B also available?).
There are not too many who have come to terms with the idiosyncracies of the
Blen. However AI also attacking the designated targets would certainly give an
impetus to scrambling for defence or escort for fighter only pilots on both sides.
I personally think 10 mins extra time is a bit long. 5 mins would be my preference
but I can see why 10mins would be helpful if u've spent so much time and effort in
getting some heavy almost onto target only to find it's all been for nothing.

ATAG_EvangelusE
Jan-10-2012, 10:26
Five minutes would be better!

I wasn't thinking of AI bombers attacking the same targets that Players should or prefer to attack. Maybe the AI could have their own objective that contribute to success. May be a specific ground unit/target placed at one or two inland locations (for both sides as there are currently quite a lot placed around the coast). If that ground unit(s) were to be destroyed by a successful AI bomber sortie it becomes a mission objective acheived and does not impact on the players who like the challenge of flying bombers.

Thinking out loud here, one of the interesting features of the scripting (that I used in SP missions) was the abilty to have ac spawn only when a player enters a specified radial zone on the map. I am just thinking of the possibilty where or if a team/player goes to a specific location to intercept bombers at or close to their spawn points a few AI fighters are spawned to give them a harder time. Maybe even let the teams dicate when to allow their bombers to spawn as they will be in close proximity to protect them.

I really like what you are doing with this server....brilliant!

ATAG_Bliss
Jan-10-2012, 13:08
Hi fellas - I hear you on all your points. The main reason the bombers were put in, was quite frankly, to give some people stuff to practice shooting at. At certain times of the day, it wouldn't be fun online with only a few people unless there was something to shoot at - if you see what I mean? 2ndly they were put there to encourage altitude combat/escort/protection. I know meeting a group of escorted bombers in a group of fighters coming to destroy is quite a good time. The last reason is they all pound the front line fields. I know many a pilot spawning in has had some bombs dropped on them :)

Anyhow, all the objectives are scripted, well, heck, the whole mission is scripted :Grin:, but the problem with the using the target radius trigger for say, spawning some AI flights in is there's no way to shut it off. If you set up a certain group of AI planes connected via script to run through that radius then only that certain group will spawn in say, AI fighters. But if you have it set to players, every single human player that gets inside the radius will spawn in w/e group of AI fighters/bombers you have scripted. It would get messy quite fast. With the current limitations of what we are dealing with game-wise, broken wise, bug wise, graphic wise, and resource wise, what we have going now is, as they say in the US, is "on kill" - meaning that we're really pushing it as far as how much people can handle with the current state of the game. I've just had some complaints on 1C for FPS problems here, there, etc., and just toned down some of my spawn point stuff. Adding in more objectives, at least right now, isn't going to fair well IMO.

But we are always figuring out new things with scripts, so who knows what will come out next. But before anything, we need a patch! Then we can finally get some of the bigger, more historical missions (longer flight times etc.) on the server. Until then, we're kinda stuck in this area of the map. The launcher crashes, amongst some other really annoying FMB/Dedi server stuff, needs to be addressed before we can actually start using those. But, soon enough, we'll actually have a decent round up of BoB missions. But the game has to get there first.

ChiefRedCloud
Jan-12-2012, 11:10
Thanks for your comment Bliss (and others here). I've reposted this over on New Wings ( http://newwings.site.nfoservers.com/news.php for the growing numbers that have become interested in CloD. If anyone pops over there you'll start to wonder if it's not an ATAG Fan club.

Well, as Detective Joe Friday would say, "just the facts mam". I call and post what I feel is importent for the people I work/fly with at New Wings. Not to give any of you guys the Big head, but ATAG is a great group that has and will continue to make differance in the CloD community. As we hope and I feel we have with New Wings in RoF beginners.

My goal once our New Wings RoF goals are met is to establish a begginers server for Clod. But this is a slow process that must be worked out carefully. Again thanks .... to you Bliss and ALL here .... :dthumb::salute:

[FFCW]Urizen
Jan-14-2012, 03:23
I've just had some complaints on 1C for FPS problems here, there, etc., and just toned down some of my spawn point stuff. Adding in more objectives, at least right now, isn't going to fair well IMO.

Just a Question? Can you see how many FPS your server is doing, especially when it hits the magical 60 players mark. Letґs say it does a fair 1000 fps with 50 players around and a tick rate of 30 (meaning every 30th frame is updated) going down to letґs say a 100 fps at 60 players, same tick rate. Maybe the client responds to that and lowers fps accordingly to stay synced. That would also account for people disconnecting from the server, simply because they get absolutely no response from your server and would also account for messages popping up later on as those messages are still being processed.

The reason i ask is simple: iґve seen those things happen to CS:Source servers, when the fps drop on those servers for whatever reason, most player experience serious lags, sometimes along with bad fps.

ATAG_Bliss
Jan-14-2012, 11:14
Urizen;6993']Just a Question? Can you see how many FPS your server is doing, especially when it hits the magical 60 players mark. Letґs say it does a fair 1000 fps with 50 players around and a tick rate of 30 (meaning every 30th frame is updated) going down to letґs say a 100 fps at 60 players, same tick rate. Maybe the client responds to that and lowers fps accordingly to stay synced. That would also account for people disconnecting from the server, simply because they get absolutely no response from your server and would also account for messages popping up later on as those messages are still being processed.

The reason i ask is simple: iґve seen those things happen to CS:Source servers, when the fps drop on those servers for whatever reason, most player experience serious lags, sometimes along with bad fps.

Hi Urizen,

I've wondered similar things myself, but we have no way of knowing what the server is doing. Currently, there is hardly any settings we can change at all. We can change netspeed, but I've tried a combination of that and it doesn't seem to matter. But other than that, the only options we have is to monitor cpu usage on the server (which never goes above 7-8%) and track bandwidth usage. The bandwidth with around 60 players is only around 7mbps total (upload/download). And the server has a 10gig per second connection (upload and download) - that's all fiber.

I'm afraid the only thing we can do is wait for a patch that addresses some of these things, or at the very least gives us some tools to monitor what is going on. We could run 10 instances of the game (full of players) on our dedi machine without much effort, so I don't know other than broken code somewhere.

[FFCW]Urizen
Jan-14-2012, 11:23
Thatґs what i feared, dang, without knowing whats happening, nailing the problem is hard work and not just for you Bliss, but for 1C as well.

III./ZG76_Keller
Jan-14-2012, 11:47
Sorry for the thread hijack, wasn't sure if this deserved its own.

Bliss, what are the chances of adding more objectives for both sides on the current mission? I've found that with an organized group of 3-4 pilots the objectives can be completed in just a couple sorties. We've had a running joke the last week or so of feigning anger towards the guy that completes the final objective and forces the mission to restart.

As it stands right now I can usually destroy the communications HQ with a single drop from a Stuka, and the radar stations take one large bomb for the towers, and a few 50kg bombs and some ground strafing to complete. It'd be cool to have say an airfield with several bombers spread out as well as buildings and fuel/ammo dumps to destroy. Having one big objective that requires multiple visits or multiple planes to complete might stretch out the mission a bit and provide some incentive for defending planes to loiter in the area.

I'm assuming that the vehicles in the buildings are there to be triggers because the buildings themselves are unable to trigger a completed objective. Where do fuel/ammo objects fit in to this? Are they considered buildings or are they objects that can have triggers attached to them?

ATAG_Bliss
Jan-14-2012, 13:41
Keller,

As someone that can't fly atm, I had no idea of this until now. The only way I know this stuff is through your guy's feedback as I can only test using AI atm. So with that said, if you notice a problem, please post it as early as possible or I can never fix it!

The next rotation should be much harder to complete the objectives. Please keep me informed!

Dutch
Jan-15-2012, 09:52
I've found that with an organized group of 3-4 pilots the objectives can be completed in just a couple sorties.

This is also true from the red perspective to an extent, although the fuel depot and the 88's can sometimes take a few strikes, and the flak is at an ideal level to make it tough. The Tanks can be easily taken out by 2x250lb bombs, so I'd say that one needs toughening up a touch.

It was fantastic last night to see 4 or 5 Blenheims taking off with escorts to take out the targets - Knuckles, Rush, Shrivey, Steam, Krupi and me all threw in multiple Blenheim sorties, although I'd joined the game with a lot of the work already done.

Evangeluse, JTDawg and I think Snapper also, got involved with the escort. Sorry if I've forgotten anyone!

At one point, only half the 88's were left for a win for the reds, so I air spawned at Eastchurch and flew in to Oye-Plage from the North at zero feet on a solo. Evangeluse followed with some height in hand to cover me.

A canny 109 pilot had been watching for just such a move and got onto my tail as I settled on the bomb run. He's shooting the sh** out of me as 'Vange is diving to stave off his attack. I bobbed and weaved as best I could on the bomb run, let go my eggs and immediately steep turned to the right.

The 109 followed - I only had to survive for 11 seconds until the bombs went up - had I dropped them well enough?

BOOM! - 'The Ju88's at Oye-Plage Have Been Destroyed'

Red Team win!

Result!

TS erupted into congratulations to the whole team for a well coordinated offensive, as my poor old Blenheim succumbed to the gentle ministrations of flak and 7.92mm and I crash landed in a French Field.

Suddenly a pretty French girl wearing a raincoat and a beret ran up and said 'M'sieur, please let me....'. No, No! - I'm getting carried away now, but the evening was fantastic none the less!

But the tanks need toughening up a bit please Bliss!

ATAG_Septic
Jan-15-2012, 10:13
A great time indeed. I flew red and blue bombers, intercept, CAP and escort. It was interesting to see how each side responded (or not) to the threat of human controlled bombers. The mission design has opened up all kind of team or individual challenges and entertainment. Credit and thanks to Bliss, Watchman and anyone else who contributes.

ATAG_Colander
Jan-15-2012, 12:10
A canny 109 pilot had been watching for just such a move...

I believe that was me, I ran out of canon shells and you where still flying!! That plane sure can take some hits.

I then started aiming my machine guns at the cockpit hoping for a pilot kill but it was too late, you where dropping bombs already.

S!
Colander

ATAG_JTDawg
Jan-15-2012, 12:44
:thumbsup: Yes good night for red! We protected ours (There targets)an covered bombers ,good missions an flights, had great fun!!!! 1 problem though===we were getting vulched hard at mansgate so we, ( Krupi an i ) spawned at rochester to get up, only to spawn on top of each other= spawning problem :inq: only 1 player at a time can spawn take off an has to roll or boom!!!! keep up the good work ATAG!! SALUTE================P.S. Krupi although you mostly fly blue you have a red heart lmao great flying with ya :dthumb:

ATAG_Snapper
Jan-15-2012, 12:46
I showed up late for the party, but at least I got some "sloppy seconds" covering the withdrawal (hmmm, maybe I could've worded that better......).

It was great hearing the colourful dialogue over Teamspeak as the Red Team worked together on the mission! :dthumb:

III./ZG76_Keller
Jan-15-2012, 16:45
I noticed today that the Target at G7 (South of Littlestone) was completely destroyed with no "Objective Completed"; towers gone, tents completely burnt and trenches empty. Do the flak positions now need to be destroyed as well to complete this objective?

ATAG_Bliss
Jan-15-2012, 17:35
The area that is the objective needs to have 40% of it's structure (objects) completely destroyed to get the objective. IL2COD had a damage model on it's ground units and objects. They can be damaged and not completely destroyed. I changed this based on your prior feedback of "the running joke" of how easy it was.

Do you now want it changed back?:confused!:

ATAG_EvangelusE
Jan-15-2012, 18:18
I think it was the level of organisation at the start of that particular mission that resulted in the speed at which the objectives were completed - not sure that will repeat itself but it was great fun for the Reds to end the mission so rapidly. It relied on a lot of good Blenheim pilots to enter the mission early which is also a rare event.

III./ZG76_Keller
Jan-15-2012, 22:28
The area that is the objective needs to have 40% of it's structure (objects) completely destroyed to get the objective. IL2COD had a damage model on it's ground units and objects. They can be damaged and not completely destroyed. I changed this based on your prior feedback of "the running joke" of how easy it was.

Do you now want it changed back?:confused!:

I flew pretty much all day today, and after repeated attempts on the targets they still wouldn't complete. Not a single objective was completed today for either side; something must not be working right. Don't get me wrong, I have no problem with the mission ending quickly, I just enjoy bombing stuff so much that I'd like more targets to hit. I'm sure the Blenheim guys would like more targets to hit too.

ATAG_Bliss
Jan-15-2012, 22:49
Hmm :inq:

Well it's probably something I've done in notepad with the .mis file that the game doesn't like. ;) I've set all the events to even numbers. Hopefully that'll fix it.

Just let me know how it turns out. Next rotation will have it applied.

Crushenator
Jan-17-2012, 04:36
Ive been playing a little bit and noticed that when I bombed the radar towers at I12 with the Stuka, they collapsed but did not trigger the objective. I flew black again in another Stuka and hit the general area again but still nothing.

Its understandable if it wasn't meant to be so easy that one yahoo can fly in there with a Stuka and save the day.. But maybe if the destruction of the main buildings only happened if enough damage was done to complete the objective.

This would solve another problem that I first encountered the first time I decided to go for the objectives. I flew over to G7 in a Stuka searching for radar towers and found none. I almost wanted to suggest the coordinates were wrong but after the experience at I12 it occurs to me that someone else may of taken the towers down but not done enough damage to get the objective.

Other than that the mission really is fun I can't get enough of it at the moment.

ATAG_Bliss
Jan-17-2012, 09:40
Hi Crushenator,

I've been constantly changing the objective's strength. If you get a chance, please let me know how they are today.

Thanks.

Also, I'll finally be updating some of the bad spawn points / areas today. Blues will have a further fighter base as well.

335th_GRAthos
Jan-17-2012, 11:56
someone else may of taken the towers down but not done enough damage to get the objective.

How much damage do we have to inflict in order to get the objective?

Last time I spread two 500 bombs and enjoyed watching all but two of the tall towers fall into rumbles but I did not get the objective.

~S~

ATAG_Bliss
Jan-18-2012, 15:34
It shouldn't take much! But the objective is triggered not only by the Radar installations, but by the stationary objects around them.

__________________________________________________ ______________________


The blue's now have a further fighter field. Rochester's airfield should hopefully be fixed for the reds. Also there is an additional Blue objective. If they go quick, the jabo fighters (109/B's) will probably be removed as these targets were designed to be hit from an actual bomber. It would be different if Reds had anything other than the blemmy to drop with.

Let me know of any other bugs please!

104th_MoGas
Jan-20-2012, 12:12
Hi Bliss and ATAG,

request much more targets, two times, Gravsend to Hawking (with spool up, lineup, SQN takeoff) mission over, you guys know that BLUE is always with more numbers then RED, they are able to fly with the fast 109E3B over the channel, plus 110`s.

In DCS we have for a dedicated server, 35-40 units for a trigger, and this six times, that means, for a full operation between 2,5-4h playtime. When all triggers been done, you had 15 minutes time for a RTB as well.

I know it is not DCS, and in CloD the mission editor is a pain, but we have more players in CloD then in FC2/DCS A-10C so in this case, we need more targets.

best regards

III./ZG76_Keller
Jan-20-2012, 13:31
I think percentages need to be higher for the Beaufighters at Ramsgate, only 2 planes need to be a total loss to trigger the objective. I'm sure the others took some moderate damage, but only 2 were burning.

IronMike
Jan-21-2012, 08:13
I think, what could help, would be to put more targets per objective, for instance an airport could have lots of stuff standing around, a bit spread also, so that even with great numbers of bombers (no matter what side), you HAVE to fly it twice to finish it. It happened several times to me, that I took a Ju88 or He111 from Tramecourt, I saw: I12 not finished, so I fly there and just on arrival after half hour flying or so, mission ends, someone was there already. And that is of course a bit of a "pita".. Therefore massed objectives would be appreciated, so that you have to arrive there to help to finish it and not fly a race to the targets to get any at all.

BTW also red, if equipped with enough Blenheims, can finish the mission in one run, espacially since red objectives are spread between Oye Plage and M2 - that is really hard to cover, the distances are so far, that you can slip through at many places, whereas the blue objectives are very close to fighter airports. Therefore I would either move M2 objective closer to Calais, or have a fighter base somewhere near M2 as well. Once we tried with Badger and some other guys and of course as we were on CAP station around M2, the Ju88s at Oye Plage fell, etc..

I am fairly new to the game, haven't looked at the editor yet (only heard about it) but I have some experience in mission building in Lock On / DCS and organizing large community events in the style of a red flag - which is a blast with 60 players on teamspeak, flying tactical and organized in flights to fullfill and win the mission objectives [including a none-flying commander and detailed mission plan and briefing]. And I see now, after I completely fell in love with ClOD and WWII AC, that this sim has even greater potential for such missions/ events, etc. For such event, the mission would be big enough, I guess, because aircover would be denser, communications would provide a net of CAP and attack possibilities, etc. But on daily server, with none-organized flying, imho I think it should be more challenging - also to enforce more organized/ coop flying to complete mission objectives.

So these are my 2 cents after my first 3 weeks on your server - which I btw enjoy very much! I hope the input is of some use to you guys. Thanks for the great effort and server you provide!:dthumb:

EDIT: I don't know if you could make that a mission objective, but I would love to bomb factories or docks or some larger amount of buildings in cities as well, like precision bombing a weapons factory and trying not to hit civilians around, kinda like in Memphis Belle:Grin:

ATAG_EvangelusE
Jan-21-2012, 08:49
Some good points there! It's great to see all the Blens on the deck at Ramsgate as you TO. However, they are very close to the Radar Towers at I12 and the 'Mansgate' area has become a hive of continual attacks even from players not totally concerned with the mission objectives - (no suprise with juicy ground targets and players spawning to be had).....:Grin:

Spreading them out is probably a good idea. But you are right, the Reds have worked out 'safe corridors' where interception is more likely during Bleny TO or when over the target - two of those are rarely defended and a good Bleny pilot will take them out. The JU88's are well defended because of their proximity to Calais Marque and usually involves a high level of activity.

There has yet to be enough players (Reds) to both escort/attack and defend so the general plan is to attack for one mission and defend on the next - it's been great fun I have to say (especially when the message says 'Congrats Red Team!')

IronMike
Jan-21-2012, 09:24
Tx for your reply Evangeluse! But what I basically mean with spreading out, is more the targets per objective as spreading out the objectives themselves. The mission could have one objective alone, but would last longer with some difficult units placement on the ground. For instance split up the Beaufighters at Ramsgate in groups of four(i.e) and have four or even more of them standing at different places, stack the objectives within themselves a bit more and make it more units on the ground per stack, so that never a bomb or four can be enough. Or imagine the only mission goal being a complete military base, just that, but you gotta clean it up for good - with tanks, train, hangars, planes, vehicles, towers, buildings etc such a base can become quite some work (not in favour of having only one objective, just to illustrate the idea behind larger amount of ground units and thus prolonging mission duration).

For the English ships I forgot to mention, that towards afternoon mission time, when they arrive at Dover the german mineboat is close enough to attack them - I don't know if that is on purpose, just that I have noticed that at twds the end of a mission there are a lot of french ships left and none English to attack. (I allways prefer humans do the job rather then AI, but that is just my point of view).

Once again, many thanks for the marvellous server!

ATAG_Knuckles
Jan-21-2012, 10:02
Actually the "Red" Targets have become a little ummmm simple?? 3 Blenheims flown correctly can trigger the map within 20 minutes.

As ships are secondary perhaps a certain amount of ships sunk might also be included in the trigger


Knuckles

III./ZG76_Keller
Jan-21-2012, 12:15
Actually the "Red" Targets have become a little ummmm simple?? 3 Blenheims flown correctly can trigger the map within 20 minutes.

As ships are secondary perhaps a certain amount of ships sunk might also be included in the trigger


Knuckles

And at the same time the Blue targets have become exceedingly difficult. I destroyed all but 2 Beaufighters with a Stuka and spent all my MG bullets strafing the other two and still couldn't get it to complete. Doc and I managed to complete the G7 radar tower last night so that objective seems to be working properly. I would guess by the amount of damage that we did to G7 the completion percentage seems to be around 50-60%.

Dutch
Jan-21-2012, 12:48
I'm not sure that this to-ing and fro-ing of 'it's too easy/it's too hard' is the way to go here.

I know that on one gratifying occasion, I took out a previously untouched fuel depot with 2 x 250lb bombs only. Last night it took me three sorties, but I don't know if this target's 'destroyability' has been altered in any way. Maybe it's a question of simply hitting it right. (Bliss?)

I'm assuming that there are a number of destroyable objects at each target location, and taking out a % of these then triggers the target destroyed messages.

If this is the case, I'm sure it's been worked out fairly for both sides in terms of the number of objects per target per side, so that when sometimes it seems easy, sometimes it seems hard, may simply be down to how accurate we've been with our bombs, but I'd be happy to stand corrected. :happy

Is it simply the Beaufighters which need to be destroyed or are there other objects in there which maybe haven't been noticed?

ATAG_Knuckles
Jan-21-2012, 15:33
I'm not sure that this to-ing and fro-ing of 'it's too easy/it's too hard' is the way to go here.

and I agree: as It might seem like we are "nit-Picking" my point is sharing info for Bliss and others to pawn over !!

The one thing I dont want to conver is the thought that this map isn't fun or interesting, I'm having a blast, I think we all are Blue and Red so again hats off to those that white this stuff

Knuckles

Jimbop
Jan-22-2012, 07:05
Back in the air after being away for a while. ATAG_spinfx and I just lit up the Panzer division at M2 (practically everything burning) but didn't clear the objective. Seriously, I couldn't see what else we were meant to hit! But then earlier in the day I managed to clear it with Torian.

My sense is that the targets are too difficult to clear. Perhaps a better way of toughening the targets is to have a couple of groups at each objective, each with a slightly lower destruction threshold as mentioned above? Or perhaps just more tinkering with the current figures. I guess you just can't please everyone!

ATAG_Knuckles
Jan-22-2012, 09:55
[ I guess you just can't please everyone![/QUOTE]

I think everyone is enjoying this, as its stated before, " a work in progress" that way it wont get stale.

Jim: the tanks, same with me, blown everything clear and no trigger, other times it does: in one pose I asked if maybee the AA guns need to go as well.

Probably not though, glad your back I'll be looking for you


Knuckles

III./ZG76_Keller
Jan-22-2012, 11:48
I hope I don't sound like I'm complaining, I'm just trying to give feedback so that WatchMan and Bliss have something to go on. This is the greatest Cliffs of Dover server going and like everybody who flies here I just want to see it get even better. :thumbsup:

ATAG_Snapper
Jan-22-2012, 12:08
@Keller & everyone: This is all good input and much appreciated for just that reason. Keep it coming!

Personally, I like the periodic updates in the chat/server window now on the status of the target objectives. :thumbsup:

ATAG_JTDawg
Jan-22-2012, 13:37
Several of us flew cover for torian last night at M 2.5 ,after 2 or 3 bomb runs no joy!!! then pope an i started straifing targets by buildings ,which were destroyed(buildings) with on some halftracs after 2 passes we got target complete, think some are just not getting all thats needed to complete objective== so it came down to a few halftracs or trucks to complete :salute:

ATAG_Snapper
Jan-22-2012, 14:12
This is good to know -- Red fighters can actually contribute directly in achieving the objectives. Useful in that escorting fighters can possibly do a "mop up" after the bombers have dropped their loads and no "Objective Completed" notification appears.

Tongue in cheek here:

Of course, after watching Redtails last night in which four P-40's completely destroyed a major Luftwaffe airbase through multiple strafing passes I began to realize that bombers are really not needed anyway.....:xwing

Of course, one Redtail pilot (Raygun) took several AAA hits in the cockpit, severely wounding him in his right eye and shattering his left femur -- taking him off ops for a full 23 minutes (measured) in the movie. This indicates that losses must certainly be anticipated.

What I never realized is that Blue pilots all have duelling scars and tend to foam at the mouth when provoked! Quite a factual documentary, that Redtails movie! :thumbsup:

(Actually it was entertaining. My 29-year old daughter was visiting and wanted to spend some "father-daughter quality time", so off we went! I enjoyed Redtails despite some flaws. Tons of air combat.)

ATAG_Knuckles
Jan-22-2012, 15:13
J.T. very good intel, I myself have had a hard time with the fuel depot, 4 X 250 and no trigger.

as for Red Tails a movie we have all been eagerly waiting for has had nothing but terrible reviews, too bad as I had high hopes


Knuckles

Jimbop
Jan-22-2012, 15:30
I guess you just can't please everyone!

I should have been clearer since I wasn't criticizing you guys when I wrote this.

There is discussion about this on other forums and it seems that some want numerous, extremely tough targets whereas others (like me) want relatively easy targets. It will be difficult/impossible for Bliss et al. to please both sides on the same server.

ATAG_Snapper
Jan-22-2012, 15:58
No worries, jimbop!

You're absolutely right. Everyone, myself included, has different wishes and expectations. It's good if everyone has their say, since the mission objectives and success parameters change on the server periodically and Bliss, Watchman & Co try to incorporate where possible the different ideas expressed here.

As Cliffs of Dover continues to improve with patches, sequels, hot fixes, etc. hopefully more features will become available to broaden the online air combat experience. Thanks go to you and the others above and on the server via Teamspeak for the continuous flow of ideas and suggestions! :thumbsup:

ATAG_JTDawg
Jan-22-2012, 16:09
:eek: Was not takin like that m8!!! just my observation :thumbsup: just letting others know to look ,just couse it looks destroyed dont mean it is .

Jimbop
Jan-22-2012, 16:14
Yes, I think that's what is happening, Dawg. Smoking doesn't always mean destroyed. I'm going to start playing with 500 lb bombs instead of 250s. I can usually hit the target (well, sometimes anyway ;)) so maybe the extra damage will do the job.

Jimbop
Feb-02-2012, 05:49
Is this what was meant by the disappearing buildings discussion a while ago? This is the server 1 G7 target. It has not been destroyed (not even hit) but the radar towers are nowhere to be seen. Makes it difficult to spot the target from a distance. I can see the towers at other times.

http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7161/6806096989_5aaef7bb6c_m.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/61319592@N06/6806096989/)

ATAG_WatchMan
Feb-02-2012, 08:40
Well jimbop, the radar towers could very well get destroyed, no longer be visible and at the same time not clear the objective. Radar towers are not able to be kept track of as being destroyed, just like a table, or a bicycle etc. A radar installation being destroyed is based on "countable" objects being destroyed within the radius of the objective. As far as disappearing buildings that was in reference to a different bug in this game and as far as I know has nothing to do with radar towers.I hope that helps answer your question.

ATAG_WatchMan.

ATAG_EvangelusE
Feb-02-2012, 08:58
From a RED perspective, the problem is lack of Bombers. There are few Bleny pilots or players prepared to use it- it's a pig to fly reliably and flying solo in one is a suicide mission........:uhoh

Which may answer Kellers mocking question that he sent over 'Chat' - "Don't you REDs ever attack?" having wiped out all our targets (with gross impetuosity).............:laugh1

Anyway, not to worry - the RAF is supposed to defend not attack - that's my excuse and I will stick to it rather then get into that friggin' Bleny again only to die (frequently!")

ATAG_Knuckles
Feb-02-2012, 09:47
Very Well said EvangelusE

I personally am hoping to change this "Lack of Belnheims" by offering training any time I see someone I dont know in one. They usually are NOT on TS. I have invited several over and at date are doing well.

A "Pig" good lord YES !! but its the only pig we have

a little frustrating though as the reds are up againts HE 111, JU 88 JU 87,

and we have a pig. That actually just makes me more determined:

Here's the deal when I can get enough bombers (say minimum of 4) we will start kickin butt Then you fighter guys will have something "Live" to escort.

The "Pigs" will be able to pull out some 109 that will have to fly slow to destroy us, and they will be all yours

Knuckles (as he steps down from his soapbox)

Dutch
Feb-02-2012, 09:51
From a RED perspective, the problem is lack of Bombers. There are few Bleny pilots or players prepared to use it- it's a pig to fly reliably and flying solo in one is a suicide mission........:uhoh

Which may answer Kellers mocking question that he sent over 'Chat' - "Don't you REDs ever attack?" having wiped out all our targets (with gross impetuosity).............:laugh1

Anyway, not to worry - the RAF is supposed to defend not attack - that's my excuse and I will stick to it rather then get into that friggin' Bleny again only to die (frequently!")

Naaaah! One simply has to rekindle one's 'Bulldog Spirit', old boy!

Three Blenheims or even two are all it takes to win the round in a few sorties! We just need more pilots prepared to fly it. Once you're off the ground, coarse pitch, +4 boost and cowl flaps about a third open and it'll fly all day with no temp probs. Wizzing accross the channel at zero feet and then 'Enemy coast Ahead' is such a buzz. :Grin:

ATAG_EvangelusE
Feb-02-2012, 10:37
Count me in for a Training session! I just went against my own advice and got killed (twice in the same Blenny because I switched to rear gunner view - bad mistake........:). Well what a waste of time that was!

There I was, dead chuffed that I hadn't blown a gasket only to get swiped by some miserable BF. How the hell do you bail out?

I cannot get the Blenny at altitude even with Carb Heating on when the engine starts going nuts over 5K? As for top speed? Jeez, A crawl at 130mph at 5K is the best I can do without cooking the damned engine - so yes!.......Pig Training required and escorts!

Dutch
Feb-02-2012, 11:08
Count me in for a Training session!

Yeeees! Knuckles, we got some work to do!

Seriously EvangelusE, once you get the hang of it, it adds a whole new dimension to the game.

If Rush, Jimbop, Shrivey or Timboy are on, ask them also. There are other blokes who can fly Blenheims, but some of them will keep on flying blue.:0:

P.S. I regularly get 240mph out of the Blenny at sea level, but my G940 pitch wheel seems to lock full coarse at just below 2000rpm contrary to what Knuckles gets. It needs lots of down trim to stay level at this speed.

As for bailing out, you need to open the canopy first, then ctrl/E as usual.

ATAG_Septic
Feb-02-2012, 13:47
I'll happily assist anyone in flying the Blemmy, I'm not very good at bomb aiming other than skip/dive though.

Cheers Chaps,

Septic.

Jimbop
Feb-02-2012, 16:17
Thanks Watchman, good to know.

I've been playing around in the HE-111 lately and it is a whole other world of bombing goodness. Given the state of the game you wouldn't be surprised to learn that the bomb release timing is bugged but there is a workaround and I hit targets from 5,000 m. I can't reliably hit targets in the Blenheim from 5,000 feet, let alone meters.

What you need for a successful, low risk, Blenheim sortie is at least three Blenheims. The first run (one or two planes) would go after the flak at the objective and would level bomb from as high as the pilot can reliably go. The second run, a couple of minutes behind, would either dive or level bomb the target with reduced flak risk.

Don't get me wrong - I can take out the M4 target in a single run but it is suicide since I have to go low and the flak gets me every time. Great fun but I wish the level bombing was easier (either a horizontal stabilizer or 6DOF vision in the bombardier's seat). It is some consolation that the HE-111 bomber doesn't have 6-DOF either but then again he doesn't need it!

Chalk me down as a trainer.

ATAG_Knuckles
Feb-02-2012, 16:36
Dont know a thing about them German type aeroplanes !!

I certainly agree with you statement on the Blenheim, 3 aircraft would be great, just as Jimbop describes.

as for all the Blue Flying you do :no:no Haa all for fun !!! mate i would be honored to loose my Blenheim to the likes of you ??

Dutch
Feb-02-2012, 23:13
Heh! I think we can safely say that EvangelusE is now a Blenheim convert!

There were a few technical server probs, and then a great deal of flak probs, but EvangelusE just dropped the two bombs that finally took out the fuel depot, then went on to drop his remaining two bombs on the tanks and destroyed them too!:Grin:

With help and support from JT, Catseye and Wolverine (with a bit of Snapper too!) the 88s were taken out by me and Red won the round.

You've just got to love this game! :laugh1

Doc
Feb-03-2012, 00:12
I have to hand it to the red team you handed our asses to us last night. Good job. :dthumb:

ATAG_Knuckles
Feb-03-2012, 09:33
I broke into the conversation yesterday, especially when I saw EvalgelusE on the "Bomber Channel"

Quite a trooper that one, defines the term "gettin back on the Horse" . Congrats EvangelusE , you will enjoy many hours of working with that ole pig::::::<> err I mean Blenheim.

And a Royal pat on the back to ATAG_Dutch who tirelessly passes on his knowledge to those that "want to know"


Knuckles

that bomber formation is certainly growing

III./ZG76_Keller
Feb-04-2012, 18:44
You Reds got lucky last night; Doc, fastfed, Blackbeard and I had 4 HE 111's loaded up and headed for England. Unfortunately, the party was ended before the 3rd 111 got off the ground when the launcher crash bug decided that we weren't allowed to bring that kind of assault to England.

@EvangelusE

My comment was intended to "motivate" the Reds to learn to fly the Blenheim; sure she may be a tough plane to fly but the HE 111 certainly takes time and patience to use effectively. I've spent hours and countless unsuccessful drops learning the beast and I've finally got her figured out. I am actively training people to fly the 111 so you Blenny pilots better catch up. Dutch, Knuckles and others get their Blenheims to target all the time, so it's not like it can't be done. :thumbsup:

Dutch
Feb-04-2012, 19:28
My comment was intended to "motivate" the Reds to learn to fly the Blenheim; sure she may be a tough plane to fly but the HE 111 certainly takes time and patience to use effectively. I've spent hours and countless unsuccessful drops learning the beast and I've finally got her figured out. I am actively training people to fly the 111 so you Blenny pilots better catch up.

We're working on it mate! Thanks to you and others, people do seem to be catching on that there's far more to this game than dogfighting.

You 'motivate' the Red blokes as much as you want. Seems to have got EvangulusE fired up at any rate (hope you don't mind me saying that EvangelusE!).

It's all for the good whichever way you fly. ;)

ATAG_Knuckles
Feb-04-2012, 20:56
This is the kind of "banter" I was hoping to see months ago. I can really start to see some changes around the corner thats gonna be a hoot !!!

Keller you and I are destined to meet mid channel He-111 to Blenheim

(good god someone will have to get film of that??)

Good update and encouragement Keller


Knuckles (where's the life raft in the Blenheim?? just askin )

Jimbop
Feb-04-2012, 21:01
Yesterday I saw two Blenheims heading toward M2 as I was on my way to G7 in a HE-111 so not at all far-fetched. I went in further south than usual to avoid fighters. Didn't work...

RAAF_Magpie
Feb-06-2012, 19:21
Greetings ATAGers!

Have found the fuel depot in M2.5 but cannot find the Panzers in M4.5! Any clues? I circled around Desvres area and checked out the two airfields in close proximity but no joy. Lot of flak between the western airfield and the town, presume it maybe there somewhere! Is is possible to put a "recce" photo in the Briefing page to spice things up?

BTW Put two 500lbers into the fuel depot but didn't take it out as an objective, two building in the northern end still in tact.

thx

ATAG_Knuckles
Feb-06-2012, 19:29
Maggpie

That target is indeed very hard to find: I do believe I have posted a photo, probably in the "Planes Planes Planes.

If I see you on comms Ill give you a ride over


Knuckles

Jimbop
Feb-06-2012, 19:36
Cross the coast just south of Boulogne at the intersection of the map grids (K3/4 from memory?) and head on a bearing about 80 degrees. You should have both Samer and Desvres aligned ahead of you. The target is between these two airfields. Watch for the flak clusters surrounding it - these are not the target.

ATAG_EvangelusE
Feb-06-2012, 23:00
I have really enjoyed the sorties in the 'pig' - many thanks to Dutch and Knuckles for their much needed advice. As for spotting the targets - I prefer to fly the Bleny at altitude as it makes navigation very simple for someone who has never used the nav tools and I can see the ground targets from way off.

The funniest moment was shortly after Dutch pointed out that the rear gunner will inform you if there are any bad boys about. Shortly after taking the tanks out I decided to land on an enemy base close to Boulogne due fuel shortage. As I was landing, my rear gunner ID'd an enemy plane - I looked everywhere but couldn't see it - untill I was coasting down the runway and an enemy bomber went whistling past me in the opposite direction with rear AI gunners popping at each other......:)

Jimbop
Feb-09-2012, 06:56
More great fun tonight (Aussie time) in the Blenheim. We had five bombers on TS with some fighters escorting. A couple of us had managed to take out the Panzer division earlier so we split up, three for the fuel depot and two for the JU88s at Oye Plage. Simultaneous destruction! Within 30 seconds we completed both objectives and game over.

It's really good to see so many people starting to bomb in red. A good way to finish the evening after some 109 hunting with MoGas and jaydee so thanks all.

MajorBorris
Feb-09-2012, 11:22
Good job red!

Its good to hear that the red bomber wing is comming together.

cheers! :alcohol:

335th_GRAthos
Feb-10-2012, 07:01
I forsee interesting mission aspects coming soon:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QArJnYGoO9A&feature=player_embedded

:Grin:

http://forum.1cpublishing.eu/showthread.php?t=29662

~S~

III./ZG76_Keller
Feb-10-2012, 08:24
Interesting.

A new JU88? Boris will be thrilled!

Biggus
Feb-28-2012, 05:37
Not sure whether this was the appropriate place to ask about it, or whether I should have started a new thread, but anyway...

I've spent few hours on the new/revised/awesome server 1 map, taking off at dawn in the Blenheim. First two sorties netted some German tankers. Now, there's some disagreement between what I saw with my own eyes and what the game thinks happened.

First sortie presented me with a pretty good bombing run (4x250lb, Everready pistols, 11sec delay), the results of which were this:
http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh3/Biggus_album/2012-02-28_00003-1.jpg

I was credited with these kills in due course (the first message coming up just as I was about to make my landing approach and the second about five minutes after I landed). All good so far.

Second sortie, I managed to hit and sink another. It was on fire, I was out of exploding things to drop on the poor bugger, and so I set off for home once more. No kill message, though. Okay, fair enough. It looked pretty dire for the crew, but they must have put the fire out. Good for them. I must have hit Germany's only ship to be made out of kevlar and titanium, because I would have bet several body parts that it was 'game over' for that tanker.

Third sortie, I head back to the boats, expecting to find three remaining tankers. There is one. The one I had attacked on my prior sortie was now no longer to be found. The map status messages still say Reds have killed 2/5 boats.

Of course, this one remaining boat frustratingly survived this sortie, plus two others, before finally succumbing to another Blenheim. So now, we've killed 3/5 boats, and as far as I can tell, there are no more boats to sink.

I've got two theories at the moment. The first is that 1C have managed to include the Bermuda Triangle in a small section of the Channel map. The second theory is that the Royal Navy sank them. The first boat I sank was a joint credit between me and an RN boat, so this might be what's going on.

Anyway, I just thought I'd share my first experience of the new mission. For most of my time on that map, I was the only Blenheim, and two others came in later on fairly briefly. It just didn't seem right that those boats disappeared without crediting the Red side.

ATAG_Knuckles
Feb-28-2012, 09:05
Biggus:

I do know that at times I hit a ship, see an explosion, but I have noticed some explosions aren't that big and die out quickly. I assume I haven't hit solid enough to sink. Yesterday I cleared all 5 in about 35 minutes. Certainly wish I had other Blenheims as the supply dump at L 5.3 is impossible for only 1.

another note (just an oddity) as with you I hit a ship and it takes well over 5 minutes to register. I watched a JU-88 hit a red ship and get immediate credit.

Not an issue we are all getting credit just odd

I'd like to hear from the blue bomber team !!! Keller: Borris ?????

Knucks

Doc
Feb-28-2012, 09:14
Same with me. 110 drops 1 at a time on 2 passes the ship takes a few minutes to register. It isn't abandoned yet I suppose. Will test in the Ju-88 next time and use a string length of 4 and see what it says. :thumbsup:

ATAG_Colander
Feb-28-2012, 14:39
The status messages over chat are not immediate. They only pop every couple of minutes.
So what you are seeing might be the time span between, hit, sink, updated message appears.

Biggus
Feb-28-2012, 19:45
I'm not too worried about the time between hits and the message that the ship is destroyed. If anything, it's more realistic. My confusion is coming from ships disappeearing without kill messages. There are five ships, Red had credit for sinking three (including one joint claim with a RN ship) and yet there was only one more remaining ship on the Blue side. So if I didn't sink that ship, and neither did any other red pilots or ships, what happened?

Do ships sink if they hit underwater obstacles?

As it turned out, Red couldn't achieve the ship destruction goal because one destroyed ship wasn't attributed to any Red force aircraft of ship.

ATAG_Bliss
Feb-29-2012, 00:47
Hi Biggus,

Thanks for letting us know. I've been on a few times and have seen all 5 ships being recorded as sunk. It must be an intermittent problem :)

I'll keep an eye on it and see if I can't get it to act up.

Thanks.

Biggus
Feb-29-2012, 07:35
Hi Biggus,

Thanks for letting us know. I've been on a few times and have seen all 5 ships being recorded as sunk. It must be an intermittent problem :)

I'll keep an eye on it and see if I can't get it to act up.

Thanks.

Any time. I must admit that I'm tempted to take an empty Blen with full fuel up to watch the tankers slug it out. I did see a "Medium Tanker killed by Medium Tanker" message flash up on my last sortie. I had no idea that they were armed!

The flak is fantastic over the ships, too. The previous mission made anti shipping missions feel a bit like stealing candy from a baby, but now it's much better.

ATAG_Knuckles
Feb-29-2012, 08:52
Yes Yes

Last night I realized the bloody ships were firing at my, very well done



Knucks

Biggus
Mar-01-2012, 08:32
Tried my hand at flying spits tonight, but only managed to hit a Stuka gunner. When I realised that I actually manage to get the Blenheim going a bit faster, I realised that I'm destined to forever drive the lumbering giant.

Took off, headed for the German ships.

On my run in, I saw this:

http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh3/Biggus_album/2012-03-02_00001.jpg

See those dots just sticking out of the water? I'm pretty sure that's a tanker that nobody on the Red team had hit. Flying alongside it revealed nothing more than those dots. I know none of the Red guys had hit it, because when I landed (after completely missing everything with my bombing run), I saw this server message pop up:

http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh3/Biggus_album/2012-03-02_00002.jpg

0 out of 5 ships sunk.

After seeing that, I've started to think that I'm not crazy after all.

It might be worth putting that group of German tankers up on the other side of Calais, which is probably out of range of the Royal Navy boats.

ATAG_Bliss
Mar-01-2012, 11:35
Thanks for the bug reporting!

I might have put the boats to close to the coastline. Strange that this only happens sometimes :inq:

I'll do some testing and hopefully I can get it to act up!

ATAG_Knuckles
Mar-01-2012, 20:49
Bliss

Another observation tonight March 1st. Notafinger and myself destroyed 4 ships in one run got credit on the screen, but when the "completed Objectives" came up it stated 0 out of 5 ships eliminated.

Also we did 2 runs on the Supply Depot, no trigger. I would like to see if anyone has triggered that ?? Again dont want it too easy

Knuckles

ATAG_Bliss
Mar-01-2012, 20:56
Strange. :angry: I'm about to hop on and will have a look.

Can you look at the next time the objectives are displayed and see if it still displays 0 out of 5?

The reason I ask, which may or may not be related, is that the objects in IL2COD can burn for a long time without actually being destroyed. Don't get me wrong, if you got the explosion/huge fireball after dropping on your ship it will be destroyed. It's just sometimes it takes another 15-20 minutes before the object is actually deemed destroyed. It's as if the damage model is multistage, and the ship goes through several stages of physical damage/appearance before it's final destruction stage.

That's another reason the ground targets are so hard (and hard for me to get just the right amount) because you can have damage and not total destruction. And the only thing the trigger cares about to fire off the objective is total damage/total destruction/loss.

ATAG_Knuckles
Mar-02-2012, 08:50
When Notafinger flew back over to L 5.3 we verified the ships were gone. There was only one left.As for the supply depot, I really wasn't thinking "Total Destruction"

which is the way it should be, I'm sure if we would have looked, we would have seen several buildings still standing.

Next time I will make a point and to others we need to bomb everything.

That would be realistic to me !

Knucks

Slingn
Mar-02-2012, 12:23
Hey guys, great fun last night. Thanks again for the server. I did have one suggestion if it's possible. We had some trouble finding the secondary blue target, so it might be helpful if we could get a little better description of what and where in the briefing. Not too big of an issue, as we did eventually find it. And i know once everyone does see it, it won't be a problem, but for any new players, a better description of it may help.


Thanks again for the great servers. And a big thank you to those two British fighter pilots that let me shoot them down. Oh, and sorry about your bomber, looks like his engine didn;t like those armor piercing bullets too much ;)

ATAG_Bliss
Mar-02-2012, 16:25
Yep, that was fun stuff Slingn. Better be ready for tonight! I plan on doing some recon photos etc., for missions in the future. But with the issues at hand, it's better to do that legwork after the mission actually works than before. Sometimes there's 100 versions before we get something that works as intented.

@Knuckles/all - I found some errors in the .mis file and within my code. Tested with AI - everything triggers good / works. Next restart will have the additions.

Please keep me updated on any other problems!

ATAG_Colander
Mar-02-2012, 16:32
Great Bliss.

Anything related to my change on the code?

Colander

ATAG_Bliss
Mar-02-2012, 16:37
Nah, it was me. A "t" should have been a "T".. I know - sad eh? lol

Now reds can actually complete all the objectives/win the map... :runaway:

Tonka
Mar-02-2012, 23:50
Do the ships traverse the sea's at all during the mission, or are they stationary?

Cheers.

Dutch
Mar-05-2012, 09:35
Now reds can actually complete all the objectives/win the map... :runaway:

Confirmed!

Just came off server one having bombed all objectives with Torian and Biggus (they did the big job with the supply depot).

Red won and server cycled to new mission, which was the same mission in brighter sunshine.

Last time I was on, the server cycled to different missions, where'd they go? Or have I lost my marbles completely?:hiding:

ATAG_Colander
Mar-05-2012, 10:21
Last time I was on, the server cycled to different missions, where'd they go? Or have I lost my marbles completely?:hiding:

Dutch,

You might be confused with Server 2.
We are testing mission rotations on server 2 but is not installed (yet) on 1.

Colander.

Dutch
Mar-05-2012, 10:28
You might be confused with Server 2.


Ah, so it was a marbles issue then. :happy

Dutch
Mar-05-2012, 15:07
There still seems to be a problem re ships. I just sank all 5 of them, but targets completed report said 0 out of 5.

???:sshocked!:

ATAG_Bliss
Mar-05-2012, 17:25
Hmm - that makes no sense. I'm wondering if the ships still have to be moving or they don't work. In other words, if they reach the last waypoint, I wonder if there's some sort of problem with them no longer talking to the trigger or something.

That's about the only thing I can think of as the code is fairly straight forward, but obviously the game's code is a little, hmm, buggy to say the least.

ATAG_Knuckles
Mar-05-2012, 17:48
I actually reported the same issue. Even flew over to verify they were gone

ATAG_Bliss
Mar-05-2012, 20:09
Very odd. I've seen them all got hit multiple times (with the messages for red and blue). I guess I'm just going to have to keep the way points going and see if that's what the problem is. It wouldn't surprise me that there's some strange bug if the ships reach their destination, they end up not being active anymore, not sinkable, etc.. That would make sense for the problems of unsinkable ships as well.

Next time this happens can you let me know how much time is left in the mission?

Furious
Mar-06-2012, 02:19
2 hours left on mission,

3 ships out of 5 sunk (sunk them off the point). Searched but could not find the other 2, which remained in mission objectives as not completed... looked for them up and down the coast, not a sausage...

Slingn
Mar-06-2012, 09:26
I think the reds were down to 1/2 of a ship last night but they just couldn't get it to do down. They bombed and they bombed, but she just stuck her bottom up and gave them the moon.


I do think you're on to something Bliss. I seem remember a similar issue in il2 when they completed their all way points. Maybe when they finish their route, their mission is considered complete, and they drop out of the trigger for mission end. I dunno though. Either way, mission complete or not, it was a blast.

Dutch
Mar-06-2012, 09:34
Yep I was there. That ship was hit by at least eight bombs, if it'd've gone down, Reds would've won the round.

I circled the wreck for ages whilst others came in and bombed, and still it sat there.

Then some opportunistic cad in a 109 shot me down whilst I was contemplating this mysterious turn of events. Tut.

I even took some screenshots with the prtscrn button, but god knows where they went, coz they ain't in the folder, or on steam. Weird.

Slingn
Mar-06-2012, 09:38
Yep I was there. That ship was hit by at least eight bombs, if it'd've gone down, Reds would've won the round.

I circled the wreck for ages whilst others came in and bombed, and still it sat there.

Then some opportunistic cad in a 109 shot me down whilst I was contemplating this mysterious turn of events. Tut.

I even took some screenshots with the prtscrn button, but god knows where they went, coz they ain't in the folder, or on steam. Weird.




lol, yeah, sorry about that. Did you really need that section of your wing? But hey, doc got away. (although, I think he got a little tired of our dance and decided to go for a swim. )

Dutch
Mar-06-2012, 09:51
lol, yeah, sorry about that. Did you really need that section of your wing? But hey, doc got away. (although, I think he got a little tired of our dance and decided to go for a swim. )

Heh heh! It was good fun trying to dogfight a Blenny for sure!! :bgsmile:

ATAG_Knuckles
Mar-06-2012, 13:29
Hey Dutch

I noticed last night you had credit for 1.78 Kill. Who did you shoot down ??????



Knucks

Dutch
Mar-06-2012, 13:38
Oh, I flew a couple of fighter sorties before jumping in the Blenny.

Although another interesting bit was when a cheeky Stuka was being chased by a Hurri over Littlestone just after I took off. The Hurri crashed and I gave chase in the Blen.

I got a few meagre shots into him, but then the cheeky Stuka landed in an English field (the Cad! The Bounder!) so I dropped a bomb on him and got a pilot kill! The Stuka was intact though and I wasn't credited with a kill! :(

Wish I'd got a screenshot of the crater next to the Stuka! :bgsmile:

ATAG_Bliss
Mar-06-2012, 14:42
Well,

Bug# 1,234,003 - The ships aren't supposed to reach their final destination until about 12 hours into the mission. The mission can only last a total of 6 hours, but from what I've seen the ships must be moving warp speed and actually getting to their final locations early. I guess I'll try to time them out a bit through the waypoints and see if that doesn't help.

Furious
Mar-07-2012, 08:14
Had the ship-arse sticking out of water thinggy yesterday, but after 6(?) bomb hits, it finally went under completely and completed objective.

Tonka
Mar-08-2012, 15:06
Can some kind chap please write a short list of the mission objectives for each map please?

One of the maps at the moment has no briefing, so i think it would be great to have a list of the maps and their objectives for easy reference.

Cheers!

ATAG_Bliss
Mar-08-2012, 16:39
Tonka - are you sure?

I know there's a bug that the briefing will be blank if you haven't chose a side yet? I'll doublecheck to be sure as well.

Tonka
Mar-08-2012, 17:04
Yep, I'm in a Blenheim now, so I've definitely chosen a side.

531

I am new though, so could be wrong.

Feel free to remove the attachment once you've seen it.

ATAG_Colander
Mar-08-2012, 17:12
Strange....Can you see the briefing on the airfield selection screen?

ATAG_Bliss
Mar-08-2012, 17:28
Ok - It's all fixed now.

Thanks for letting me know Tonka! :thumbsup:

For w/e reason the briefing file was corrupt and couldn't be opened. Strange as it's just a simple text document. Anyways, the next time that mission cycles through it will have a briefing! :hpyclp:

ATAG_Bliss
Mar-08-2012, 17:35
Here's so you can go bomby bomb things on the current mission until it's rotated out :)

For Red




Primary:

M4.5 - Panzer Tank Division (sw of Desvres)
M2.5 - Fuel Depot near Estree
N7.9 - Ju88's at Oye Plage

Secondary

Destroy any enemy ships found in the channel.
Destroy enemy bombers before they can drop their payload!



And for Blue


Primary:

J12.2 - Beaufighters at Ramsgate
G7 - Radar Station
G10.3 - Communications Headquarters near Stelling Minnis
I12 - Radar Station

Secondary:

Destroy enemy bombers before they can drop their payload!
Destroy any enemy ships found in the channel.

Tonka
Mar-08-2012, 17:42
Awesome, thanks Bliss, appreciate it.

:salute:

Doc
Mar-08-2012, 18:16
Patch out tomorrow? :bgsmile:

Jimbop
Mar-08-2012, 18:21
Yeah sure! :roflmao:

ATAG_Knuckles
Mar-08-2012, 18:26
I got a bridge for sale :hiding:

Dutch
Mar-08-2012, 20:22
London Bridge? I'm in! How much?? :happy

Tonka
Mar-08-2012, 22:00
Free to anyone who can get it out of Littlestone without being vulched! :!sad!:

ATAG_Bliss
Mar-09-2012, 01:20
Have you tried taking off further south?

There be no 109's there (unless they're lost :Grin:)

ATAG_Colander
Mar-09-2012, 10:55
And/or get fighter cover.

Tonka
Mar-09-2012, 11:10
Yes Bliss, i do frequently. But, its a bloody boring exercise. Even less chance of fighter escort, 30 minutes of flying over water with no one else, and all to get brought down by the masses of Flak on the French side.

I fly for fun, and while a well planned and heavy attack on Littlestone is fun to be a part of, having people circle the airport waiting for you to respawn so they can shoot you again isn't. Especially when there are two objectives within a few miles that need to be hit by the blue's for them to win the map. If they were serious about winning the map, i think the objectives would be bombed very soon. Circling an airport a few miles from the objective just shows that people only want to take down defenceless people who can't fight back, with little regard for the objectives. Maybe its all about those stats?

There is a clear divide between people who team up on comms and are good at the game, and those who just want to jump in and fly a Spitfire and dogfight without going on comms and being part of planned attack. Unfortunately, last night, the ATAG guys were in the first camp, at the expense of the fun of some of the red guys, in my opinion.

Going back to the flak, is it normal for the Flak on the French coast to be able to bring down a bomber within seconds of going feet dry, while the blue bombers can circle around over the airfields and flak batteries on the English side for minutes on end without going down? Maybe the Blue aircraft can take more damage, or maybe the flak is more efficient on the French coast?

Cheers! :thumbsup:

edit; Colander, refer to my bit about the divide between people who get together in a group with strong pilots and strong communication, and the guys who jump online to dogfight in a Spitfire. I don't disagree with you, but more often than not the bomber's requests for escort fall on deaf ears, and there is little i can do to change that. Also, bear in mind that to get fighter cover at Wilmington, the fighters have to expend a good proportion of their fuel covering the 40 miles to get there.

I'm all for groups of strong players getting together to meet the objectives and win the map in an efficient and well planned manor, but it has to be fair for it to be fun for everyone.

Dutch
Mar-09-2012, 12:15
Hello Tonka Mate!

If Littlestone is getting vulched, it's a good idea to airspawn at Eastchurch and fly down the North coast of the Foreland, requesting escort along the way, and heading for the 88s at Oye-Plage.

You'll overfly Ramsgate and Manston en route, which gives the fighter boys every chance to lend a hand with escort. Most of the regular Red chaps are only too willing to help out.

Personally, I quite enjoy flying solos out of Wilmington too. At least it's peaceful!

See ya! :dthumb:

ATAG_Colander
Mar-09-2012, 12:45
Just to add...

I've found in more than one occasion, a Welly escorted by 2 or 3 fighters. I can tell you that attacking the bomber gets a lot harder but also a lot more fun for everyone.

Colander.

Tonka
Mar-09-2012, 14:07
I've found in more than one occasion, a Welly escorted by 2 or 3 fighters. I can tell you that attacking the bomber gets a lot harder but also a lot more fun for everyone.


Absolutely agree! Escorting, or being escorted, brings a new dimension to the game on this excellent demanding server. Can't wait to see bigger formations!

Hooves
Mar-10-2012, 00:57
Problem is when the only thing Blue does is vulch no one can take off to go escort the bombers, and the bomber just get raped out of Littelstone all day. So you'll say next "take off from another base" well you know that any other base mean 35 minute trip one way to hit attemp to hit a target that is wrapped in a flak blanket. While the UK Britian bases have such little flak that Blue fighters can just orbit waiting to hit the next bomber that pops up.


There is a balance that has to be struck and right now its not even close. What ends up happening is no Blue actually defends the objectives. They just go straight to vulch the other team. while people think this is be "Realistic", (which it isnt) or thats what the vulchers tell them selves. All this does is piss off the players wanting to at least take off. Then, they leave the server.

My suggestion. Triple the amount of flak at Britian bases so the fight can take place in the air rather than 4 seconds after a player spawns at base.

Hooves
Mar-10-2012, 01:01
Well,

Bug# 1,234,003 - The ships aren't supposed to reach their final destination until about 12 hours into the mission. The mission can only last a total of 6 hours, but from what I've seen the ships must be moving warp speed and actually getting to their final locations early. I guess I'll try to time them out a bit through the waypoints and see if that doesn't help.



What makes them "immortal" is that the clients aren't seeing the same location of the ships, and when they try to bomb ( if they are lucky enough to take off after getting vulched 8-10 times) the ship really isnt where they see it, so it looks like a good "hit" but the ship is really some where else. Happened to me and Evil. I bombed a ship and he was like "WHy are you bombing there?" Then he bombed the correct location ( empty water to me) and we got the credit.

ATAG_Colander
Mar-10-2012, 11:52
I bombed a ship and he was like "WHy are you bombing there?" Then he bombed the correct location ( empty water to me) and we got the credit.

Bug #723965 ? :sad!: :sad!:

But it does make sense... We've all seen how the ships suddenly warp to a new location. It seems like their position is not updated constantly as with the planes.

Good find!

Hooves
Mar-10-2012, 14:43
Bug #723965 ? :sad!: :sad!:

But it does make sense... We've all seen how the ships suddenly warp to a new location. It seems like their position is not updated constantly as with the planes.

Good find!

in 1946 making targets move also caused a crap ton of lag on the server. it better to make them static, there isnt really a big difference in gameplay.


But After I did some research i found that historically speaking the way the mission is set upis 100% wrong. The brits shouldnt be out bombing anything. they were mainly defending targets During the pre cursory German operation Sea Lion.

So all those targets need to be moved to the Brit side of the channel, you need to open up double the air fields and increase the flak on the Brit side 3 fold. Then you'll have a more "realistic" mission and the Brits wont HAVE to use the ONE crappy bomber they have.

Dutch
Mar-10-2012, 14:49
The brits shouldnt be out bombing anything.

Hmmm, actually that's not so, Hooves mate. The Blenny Bomber squadrons did a lot of minelaying, bombing of invasion barges in the ports, anti-shipping strikes, oil terminals, bombing Luftwaffe airfields, plus railway junctions, canal barges. Loads of stuff (also the Wellington, Hampden, Whitley Sqdrns!).

Bomber Command's contribution to the Battle is still pretty much the 'untold story' of the BoB. 9180 sorties between July and October! :thumbsup:

Jimbop
Mar-10-2012, 18:04
Some of us like flying 'the ONE crappy bomber' we have...

ATAG_Knuckles
Mar-10-2012, 19:14
Just read a book written by a Blenheim Gunner: A lot of off the wall targets, very similar to what we have. Not the big "Berlin" like later in the war but, Train yards, Werehouses, Depots.

and shipping


Knuckles

Hooves
Mar-10-2012, 21:03
Hmmm, actually that's not so, Hooves mate. The Blenny Bomber squadrons did a lot of minelaying, bombing of invasion barges in the ports, anti-shipping strikes, oil terminals, bombing Luftwaffe airfields, plus railway junctions, canal barges. Loads of stuff (also the Wellington, Hampden, Whitley Sqdrns!).

Bomber Command's contribution to the Battle is still pretty much the 'untold story' of the BoB. 9180 sorties between July and October! :thumbsup:


Ok so why do the only Brits have the bombing missions? Why are you being historically selective? The Germans did bombing missions nearly exclusivley at the onset. But yet there are no inland bombing missions for red to defend.

The fact that the Germans have 3 seperaate bombers to fly you think would lend the missions to have at least more targets than some ships. Hell at least then you'd actually have a proper excuse to vulch.

ATAG_Bliss
Mar-10-2012, 21:11
Ok so why do the only Brits have the bombing missions? Why are you being historically selective? The Germans did bombing missions nearly exclusivley at the onset. But yet there are no inland bombing missions for red to defend.

The fact that the Germans have 3 seperaate bombers to fly you think would lend the missions to have at least more targets than some ships. Hell at least then you'd actually have a proper excuse to vulch.

Huh?

The targets for blues not only take many more sorties and bombs to complete but also have plenty of inland targets for reds to defend. For instance, one of the missions has 4 inland targets for blue to bomb and red to defend.


J12.2 - Beaufighters at Ramsgate
G7 - Radar Station
G10.3 - Communications Headquarters near Stelling Minnis
I12 - Radar Station

And if you're getting vulched then you should take off at a different airfield. If you take off at Eastchurch or further south you probably will never see a 109 unless you want to run into one. But if you spawn close to the forward fields then I don't know what to tell you. That's where the action is. For instance, we in Ju88's spawn at Tramecourt. That field is both fairly far east and south of the french point. To give you an idea, that's a 20 minute flight just to get to the coast of France. Then it will take another 20 minutes to cross the channel.

Do you not know about the other blemmy fields?

Dutch
Mar-10-2012, 21:14
Edit: Sorry Bliss, you got in before me!

Huh? They don't.

There are usually 4 bombing objectives for the blue blokes as opposed to the red's three, presumably owing to the fact that the blues have six bomb carriers as opposed to one.

It's just that the blue blokes mostly choose to fly 109s as far as I can gather. When Keller, Borris, Doc and others get up in the air with bomb carriers, we need to watch out!

But let's not argue mate, we're on the same side!

(I'm not being historically selective, just fighting bomber and coastal command's corner! Fighter command flew 80,000 sorties in the same period!). :thumbsup:

ATAG_Snapper
Mar-10-2012, 22:08
Hi Hooves, and welcome to the ATAG Forum! Opinions here are always welcome, so don't hold back! :Grin:

As one of many bloodthirsty Red pilots, I can only urge you to jump on Teamspeak and let us know when the dastardly Blues are beating up Littlestone. Then grab a pop, wait a bit, then enjoy the show. If you can, you can also act as a Forward Air Controller -- broadcasting a running update on what maneuvres the 109's are doing from your vantage point. For example, if I'm in a responding Hurricane Rotol fast approaching Littlestone, it's helpful to hear that "one 109 is zooming upwards south of the airfield". Makes it easy to see which speck that is and set up an attack run accordingly.

For a long time I cursed out Blue vulchers, but then changed my tactics to adapt and now welcome them as low level targets of opportunity. Not easy targets, by any stretch, but they can be vulnerable to a fast moving RAF fighter in a superior e state!

Doc
Mar-11-2012, 00:07
Trust me - I know very well. The RAF can take care of that airspace in and around Littlestone whenever they want. Just coordinate.

Hooves
Mar-11-2012, 00:15
I just cant see why on earth you wouldnt just increase the flak at the manned aircraft bases. its an easy fix and it solves the vulching problem, or at least makes it a difficult proposition.

Go to another base you say. yes Its a 35 minute 1 way trip in a Blen, and I for one don't have the time to fly an Hour for 1 mission. Whilst blue players are up and vulching Littlestone in 5 mins. Is it possible to create more Blen bases that arent 30 minute flights away from anything? I did notice there is an unflyable Blen base in between Eastchurch and Hawkings.

If you increase the flak at the air bases you might actually have the Blue go after the objectives rather than orbit the fields waiting for targets to magically appear.

This goes for BOTH Blue and Red bases. All you are doing is allowing the lower brow players piss off the rest of the player base who came to actually dog fight, not get raped 4 seconds after spawning.


Last night vulching got SO bad that you lost 10 player just because of that. I imagine you would liek to have all your players have fun or at least get an attempt to have fun by getting to take off. Again on both Blue and RED teams.

Doc
Mar-11-2012, 00:55
You still have to get to the target.

And surely you do not expect the Luftwaffe to just open an air corridor for your safe passage in your bomber.

I know of sadistic pilots that will follow you the entire time you are on your merry way only to end up downing you at the last possible second.

Now I ask you isn't this equally frustrating?

I submit to you that it makes absolutely no difference where it happens.

Doc


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8dNdQ3mMx90

Dutch
Mar-11-2012, 09:01
You still have to get to the target.

I submit to you that it makes absolutely no difference where it happens.

True. In fact, for me it's double the frustration getting shot down outward bound and within sight of the French coast than it is being vulched.

Another antidote to Littlestone being vulched is to immediately hop into a Hurri at Lympne and go get 'em, whilst calling out the info to the rest of the fighter jocks. If everyone trying to fly out of Littlestone did this as a matter of course, maybe the Blue Guys might think twice.

I really don't have a problem with the ground strafers, it's just a question of dealing with it in some way. Preferably with 8 brownings! :50cal

But for experiments sake, I'll hop into a blue (cough!) bomber and try out the targets in England for a flak barrage comparison. I've no doubt the missions have been designed to be 'fair' in this respect. :thumbsup:

ATAG_Snapper
Mar-11-2012, 09:15
Hey Dutch, don't forget to unfasten the top button of your tunic before taking on the Luftwaffe over Littlestone! :bgsmile:

Dutch
Mar-11-2012, 09:18
Hey Dutch, don't forget to unfasten the top button of your tunic before taking on the Luftwaffe over Littlestone! :bgsmile:

Don't worry mate, I'm only on a temporary transfer to Bomber Command. The top button is as free as it always was! :Grin:

Dutch
Mar-11-2012, 09:27
P.S. Isn't it interesting that recently the Blenheim has become the new 'Spit II' and the focus of attention for the vulchers?

Wonder why that should be?

Mark of success, perhaps? :hiding2:

ATAG_Snapper
Mar-11-2012, 09:48
P.S. Isn't it interesting that recently the Blenheim has become the new 'Spit II' and the focus of attention for the vulchers?

Wonder why that should be?

Mark of success, perhaps? :hiding2:

Definitely!!!

You're completing more Mission Objectives which gets a lot of attention, plus there are more of you now which makes Littlestone more tempting as a target.

For us Red fighter jocks, Littlestone is a very worthwhile airfield to CAP. Jack Morris described a technique which has yielded excellent results for him with the recent sunrise/sunset Server rotations. I'm going to call it The Great White Shark Attack. He simply takes advantage of the gloom and cruises at 260 mph on the deck inland of the RAF coastal airfields. Not only are the low level marauding aircraft easier to spot against the less-dark sky (with AAA puffs as rough markers), but he can frequently get close enough to zoom up undetected and pour rounds into 'em from underneath. Sounds like fun! ;)

Dutch
Mar-11-2012, 10:01
Jack Morris described a technique which has yielded excellent results for him recently with the recent sunrise/sunset Server rotations. I'm going to call it The Great White Shark Attack.

Love it! Nice one Jack, I say! :hpyclp:

ATAG_Knuckles
Mar-11-2012, 10:21
Dutch: !! Youre gonna go fly a blue bomber ??????

I wanna divorce !!!!!! :shocked:


Knucks !!!

Fried
Mar-11-2012, 10:23
Came on the server for the first time last night and have to say I totally enjoyed myself, didnt get involved in much action as I was learning the ropes so to speak.

what I did do when first joining and getting "vulced" was move to a different airfield, no more problems, unlike some that just seemed to whine whine whine and swear at each other, I am a complete noob but its not rocket science.

Whilst talking noobness I had to laugh at myself after spawning in spit II's a few times, seeing the message the plane will be disabled in 10 secs and then crashing trying to take off, didnt realise it was MY plane being disabled until a few hours later :bgsmile:

ATAG_Snapper
Mar-11-2012, 10:33
We've ALL been caught trying to take off in a Spit IIa which has no control surfaces. LOL (Those ATAG Admin guys have a VERY quirky sense of humour at times. ;))

Sounds like you're getting things figured out very quickly, Fried. Glad it's working out and look forward to meeting up with you soon on Teamspeak! :thumbsup:

ATAG_Knuckles
Mar-11-2012, 10:35
Welcome Fried:

Yep limited spit IIa did the same thing Thought I got one, then got a little pissed caused someone forgot to attach the control surfaces Ha

So !!! there are unlimited Blenheims: if you want to have a go at one let us know , so we can join on comms and get up checked out.


Knuckles

Dutch
Mar-11-2012, 11:42
Well folks, I just flew a Ju88 out of Tramecourt on a recce of 'Archie' (AAA) over England (no idea how it stayed in the air, couldn't get it to climb or go over 250kph).

I flew to the radar station in G7 and circled it twice, encountering no ack-ack whatsoever other than some distant black puffs of smoke. I then flew over Littlestone airfield and circled that twice, even overflying the battery at the western end of the airfield twice, and wasn't hit once as far as i'm aware.

I then headed northeast over Lympne, again very little archie, but then things got hotter around Hawkinge and I suffered a few light hits.

I was calling out 'Ju88 heading north is friendly!' messages to our brave heroes in order to obtain more intel before my demise. I was hit lightly a few times by AAA around the Deal area, but before I could circle the Ramsgate Beaufighter Target, one of our valiant fighter boys filled my arse full of lead and I crashed on Ramsgate.

Compared to the Flak we Blenny Drivers experience over France, the English Anti-aircraft fire is nothing, repeat nothing.

End of Intel report. :salute:

But as an aside, how do the 88 pilots put up with looking at this bloke?!

532

ATAG_Snapper
Mar-11-2012, 12:02
Hmmmmm, perhaps the Bofors crews were having tea at the time?

Seriously, I know Bliss and Watchman have wrestled with this from Day 1. Maybe we should shanghai some 88's & crews and change their "Team" from Blue to Red? ;) (for all I know -- which admittedly ain't much -- this HAS been tried already!)

Dutch
Mar-11-2012, 12:28
Hmmmmm, perhaps the Bofors crews were having tea at the time?

That would seem the most likely explanation! But here's the thing;

This is possibly 'historically accurate' as far as the Brits' ack-ack defense is concerned. Lots of stuff was left behind at Dunkirk of course.

I don't have a problem with it, in fact it makes all the Blenny pilots (real and virtual!) worthy of even more respect, but it also begs the question 'why don't the Blue Team go for the targets like the Reds do?'.

They certainly have a much easier time AAA-wise! :2guns

Doc
Mar-11-2012, 13:50
But as an aside, how do the 88 pilots put up with looking at this bloke?!


Oh you got stuck with him. Creepy isn't it? I swear that guy looks at everyone that way. I think its due to MajorBorris yelling at him so much he is expecting it from others.

Shall we have an event one day where all usually blue guys switch to red and reds to blue? That could be comic gold. I'd be on your comms asking how do I open these rads??

Dutch
Mar-11-2012, 14:09
Oh you got stuck with him. Creepy isn't it? I swear that guy looks at everyone that way. I think its due to MajorBorris yelling at him so much he is expecting it from others.

Shall we have an event one day where all usually blue guys switch to red and reds to blue? That could be comic gold. I'd be on your comms asking how do I open these rads??

First time I looked to my right and saw that bloke, his face was about an inch from mine. I jumped out of my chair and almost soiled myself. Very embarassing.

Like the idea of the event! Imagine the chatbox - 'How the hell do you.....?' - over and over.

Heh!

III./ZG76_Keller
Mar-11-2012, 16:37
I think we need to tweak the mission with the ships as an objective, Blue target G7 will be almost completely destroyed and not complete the objective; all 17 ships can be sunk (server says 17 of 17) and the objective will not be completed.

ATAG_Knuckles
Mar-11-2012, 16:59
GAWD i'm laughing my arse off:

NOW on the subject of Red flying Blue (which I know is off topic here) :hiding:

I actually plan on having Keller,Boris (the or several others)to check me out in the various German aircraft Because:::: if an event ever occurs where ATAG is challenged to compete against another Squad, and (Lord forgive us all) that ATAG is given the blue team, I most likely would NOT be able to join in. Which a challenge like that would be an absolute HOOT !!!



The Knucks

Doc
Mar-11-2012, 17:29
Yeah I am going to be flying with the RAF now and then. Starting with that bomber. Follow me I will get you in safely. :bgsmile: Time to learn the queens English.

III./ZG76_Keller
Mar-11-2012, 18:12
If I have to fly Red I'll just be someone's gunner, you can't make me fly those carbureted plywood monstrosities. :Grin:

III./ZG76_Keller
Mar-11-2012, 18:24
lol

ATAG_Knuckles
Mar-11-2012, 18:26
If I have to fly Red I'll just be someone's gunner, you can't make me fly those carbureted plywood monstrosities. :Grin:


535

Dutch
Mar-11-2012, 19:18
Time to learn the queens English.

That's the King's English mate. England is a nation of Kings, not a nation of queens.

Although if you read 'The Guardian', sometimes it's easy to get the wrong idea.:shocked:

Doc
Mar-11-2012, 19:25
That's the King's English mate. England is a nation of Kings, not a nation of queens.

Although if you read 'The Guardian', sometimes it's easy to get the wrong idea.:shocked:

Ok got it! Land of kings! :bgsmile:

Doc
Mar-12-2012, 00:52
GAWD i'm laughing my arse off:

NOW on the subject of Red flying Blue (which I know is off topic here) :hiding:

I actually plan on having Keller,Boris (the or several others)to check me out in the various German aircraft Because:::: if an event ever occurs where ATAG is challenged to compete against another Squad, and (Lord forgive us all) that ATAG is given the blue team, I most likely would NOT be able to join in. Which a challenge like that would be an absolute HOOT !!!



The Knucks

Ju-88, He-111, Bf-110 and Ju-87 awaits you! Whenever you're ready. :thumbsup:

Hooves
Mar-13-2012, 00:19
Great time tonight those slight changes made the mission much more enjoyable. GG all. And good work Bliss.

Hooves
Mar-13-2012, 00:24
Came on the server for the first time last night and have to say I totally enjoyed myself, didnt get involved in much action as I was learning the ropes so to speak.

what I did do when first joining and getting "vulced" was move to a different airfield, no more problems, unlike some that just seemed to whine whine whine and swear at each other, I am a complete noob but its not rocket science.

Whilst talking noobness I had to laugh at myself after spawning in spit II's a few times, seeing the message the plane will be disabled in 10 secs and then crashing trying to take off, didnt realise it was MY plane being disabled until a few hours later :bgsmile:



Most of the Vulching headaches were coming from us Bombers jocks. Our "
other airfield" was an additional 30 min flight, effectivley removing us from the fight all together. But it has been remedied and I for one appreciate the effort Bliss put in to help square up the fights a little bit.

Dutch
Mar-13-2012, 10:45
I noticed last night that the intensity of Flak over France seemed less than usual.

For instance, when attacking the fuel depot at Estree, there was no Flak to speak of until I'd dropped my first two bombs. This seemed to trigger the flak and up it came.

Also the barrage coming up from Oye-Plage seemed less intense.

Have some adjustments been made?

ATAG_Bliss
Mar-14-2012, 18:41
Nope. It's the same amount. But what I've found with regards to how the flak works is that if you have a particular group of planes with you the flak is much more spread out as it's constantly trying to decide what target to aim at. Or heck, they probably all fell asleep :bgsmile:

Wolf
Mar-14-2012, 18:50
Hi all, I agree with point 2. I have been working hard on mission scripting for Bliss and have a fix that will provide moving target objectives for both air and ground. Also Grouped target objectives for moving targets (eg. Both columns or both air groups must be destroyed to meet objectives)

I am providing Bliss with the scripting and assistance to get this in ATAG Server testing ASAP. There are zero FPS hit to game and no identifiable increase in CPU usage.

So something of a new dynamic to the server to look forward to.

I would be happy to take suggestions of objective types you may like to see

Examples of grouped objectives:
Column A and Column B must survive travelling from Cantabury to Dover

Bomber group A & group B must be 50% destroyed

AI fighter patrol group 109 A & 110 group B must be 50% destroyed


Feedback??


Just a few observations on the current mission - not criticsms :)

1. Is there a possibility that when mission objectives are completed that the mission runs longer so that players can land, or if engaged otherwise, have a bit of extra time to complete that engagement - maybe 10 minutes? (maybe a screen message that informs "Mission End in 10 Minutes - disengage and RTB")

2. Originally the AI bombers were meant to encourage Player confrontations at altitude but is mission success now determined soley by Players bombing key targets?

If some of the AI bomber runs could contribut to partial success of a mission it would encourage players to escort them and generate more player v player combat at altitude. Most player objectives are conducted at low altitude. The bombers seem to be somewhat redundant other than target fodder.

ATAG_Bliss
Mar-14-2012, 18:54
Hi Wolf,

I would start a new thread for your suggestions. It's just be a nice clean slate for scripting posibilites etc. Something with the words "feedback" in it will hopefully churn up some ideas from the folks.

Thanks again for your help :hpyclp:

Wolf
Mar-14-2012, 18:58
Nope. It's the same amount. But what I've found with regards to how the flak works is that if you have a particular group of planes with you the flak is much more spread out as it's constantly trying to decide what target to aim at. Or heck, they probably all fell asleep :bgsmile:

I have found that some vehicles like the brittish Tank.Guy_Mk_IA if in a small group of 3 or more can be leathal to any low flying planes up to 1km. Very good for escorts or roaming protection around bases. They put a stop to vulching pretty damn quick

ATAG_Knuckles
Mar-14-2012, 19:38
They put a stop to vulching pretty damn quick


Hey I buy a coupel of those for Littlestone:hpyclp:


Knucks

Wolf
Mar-14-2012, 19:58
They put a stop to vulching pretty damn quick


Hey I buy a coupel of those for Littlestone:hpyclp:


Knucks

Here put these in a little mission and try flying around them for more then 60 sec without dying or losing controls in your aircraft.

[CustomChiefs]
Armor.custom_chief47 $core/icons/tank.mma

[Armor.custom_chief47]
Tank.Guy_Mk_IA
Tank.Guy_Mk_IA
Tank.LPTB_Type_ST
Tank.LPTB_Type_ST
Tank.Guy_Mk_IA
Tank.Valentine_I
Tank.Valentine_I


[Chiefs]
0_Chief Armor.custom_chief47 gb

[20_Chief_Road]
205842.95 256467.97 38.40 6 4 1

Wolf
Mar-18-2012, 04:14
I think we need to tweak the mission with the ships as an objective, Blue target G7 will be almost completely destroyed and not complete the objective; all 17 ships can be sunk (server says 17 of 17) and the objective will not be completed.


Yeah I have all the coding to make this possible. ATAG has the coding now and a land based version of this is been tested as we speak.

ie. destroy maultiple land units or objectives before Objective 1 is complete.

The testers are busy with external job demands now and if testing is ok then I will write the code for the ships if there is agreement.