Escaping a 109 and trim [Archive] - The Air Tactical Assault Group - Team Fusion

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Anjelus

Jun-02-2014, 02:00

Robo.

Jun-02-2014, 03:28

Firstly, could someone link me to where I can learn about how to properly set trim at various stages of flight in a Spitfire Ia?

Secondly, I am new to all this and get bounced quite frequently. It's no fun! Operating under the assumption that I'll continue to be bounced, what's the best way to react, assuming I survive the initial attack? I've tried diving and running, but a 109 can just follow me down and it doesn't help much. Should I turn into him and try to out turn? The only problem with that is I'm complete fail at flying right now and my attempts at sharp turns in a Spitfire usually end in me stalling and losing altitude.

Tips? :)

Hello mate and wlcome to the game. Focus on the rudder trim and keep the slip indicator arrow vertical at all times during the cruise flight / climb, it helps a lot with speed and stability. In actual combat, trim is not as important, I personally tend to reset it back to neutral and work with my feet to have no slip, especially when shooting. But that is up to you. In Spitfire, I don't use elevator trim much in the RAF planes, but some pilots might do.

As for tactics when bounced - try to get some altitude and a buddy to help you check your surroundings. When you get bounced, you should use your maneuvrability to avoid being shot. It takes some practice but you need to stay and fight, you can't run away from the 109 that's higher than you. Practice some basic defensive maneuvres and combat turns, Spitfire excells as turn fighter so just use your feel to see how much you can push her - she will warn you when about to stall. As for the actual maneuver, try to focus on timing, start with shallow dive, make sure your arispeed is sufficient, start turning just slightly first, watch him come at you, then as he gets closer pull harder, as he flies past you, ease up and try to recover some altitude, don't just keep turning and turning.

It's easier said than done, I know. It takes some time to learn the basics, but it's not that difficult and you will pick it up quickly :thumbsup:

ATAG_Lewis

Jun-02-2014, 07:50

Welcome to the community and forums Anjelus....~S~

Checkout the 'Beginners Guide'...for info and tips...It should save you a heap of time in getting up to scratch.....and its a really fun learning curve anyway..

Beginners Guide Link Here (http://theairtacticalassaultgroup.com/forum/showthread.php?t=5058&p=52711)

Also try youtube for startup procedures on all the aircraft

Trimming....There's no getting away from it..trim works at different rates at different speeds...so will need to be adjusted at times when you feel the need to...I think most of us dont trim on takeoff as you will be putting some heavy influences into you stick anyway and its temporary...but once you are airbourne and at speed..say for gentle climb then trim.....You may need to trim again during your sortie but genereally not...and then maybe trim for landing once your airspeed is down and the aircraft is acting differently..

As for evading the 109 bounce...Well nothing but situation awareness will get you out of their initial attack...So make sure you are constatntly checking your surroundings when flying looking for contacts...Secondly once you have spotted them try not to lose visual on them as they will be dictating the fight...You have to react early when they are making their next attack...As they dive to you then turn hard into them and if you can make a second move as they get into firing distance then do so..My second manouvre whilst in the turn is to pulll up....This trick usually works...Once they are past you then gentle climb....DO NOT STEEP CLIMB...because you need to be able to manouvre at an instance so when you realise that he is coming for another diving attack lower your nose to get speed and turn into it again....wash and repeat

This wash and repeat method can work very well and can keep you there for the duration of the fight.....and when their pass is finished then gentle climb to regain alt keeping eyes on all the time....This takes practice to figure out and syncronise with them but you can do it all day if you master it....Regaining alt when they are not diving will give you back the precious alt to make the manouvre over and over.....While you are doing this you are bidding time and waiting for one of three eventualities...

1) They get frustrated and make a mistake..This happens to the best pilots out there..and when it does the tables are quickly turned and the hunter becomes the hunted.....You are looking for the 109 pilot that misses his shot and then in frustration tries to turn with you again....This is a big NONO for 109 pilots..They MUST return up to the perch..If they don't and they try to follow you they lose all that precious 'E' and get suckered into a turn fight which you will win..Your next move is to keep a hard turn which will eventually see you on their 6..They usually spot this soon and try to dive away..Then you have a chase on your hands..

2) They get frustrated and leave...The B'n'Zer is looking for easy targets..They don't want to waste precious ammo on an enemy that they can't hit....

3) Another aircraft turns up....This can be enemy or friendly...If its an enemy and you are alone then its best to get the 'Hell out of Dodge!'..Dive away in a gentle turns to check your 6 and dive for home or to your team mates..The B'nZer doesn't want to go to the deck so usually the deck is your 'Get out of jail free card' if anything goes pear shaped...If the aircraft that turns up is a friendly then you can change tactics again..My usual tactic is to allow this other aircraft to engage while I get alt above the fight..While the 109 is pre-occupied use this to get above the fight and then you have the initiative and the tables are turned..

Whilst you are doing all of this is is wise (if you have a wingman elsewhere on the map) to keep your wingman informed of what os happening...Given that you can keep this up for long periods your wingman should have plenty of time to come and find you...Let him know where you are and importantly the alt of the enemy...Even get him to delay his entrance to the fight in order to get the height advantage when he arrives..

Many of my videos show me in trouble with a higher 109...I use all of the above in these scenarios so you can see how it works....It is pure timing..so you WILL need lots of practice..so engage them when they turn up and keep trying it...Its a revelation when you suddenly have an enemy that has the hieght advantage and yet can't hit you...Its like a Bullfight..

The point here is that it can be really fun when you have this type of engagement sussed out..it just takes practice and experience...

Check these vids and count the passes as they happen....and also check my Youtube channel for more of the same

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TtCoLqV4z-g

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zKsFYOU9G4E

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cPRE2HV3X6E

Any questions then you've come to the right place....

Good to have you with us buddy...and remember its all about the Fun!!!

...Lew...

Anjelus

Jun-02-2014, 14:46

Those videos are very helpful! What's the purpose of having your cockpit canopy open sometimes when you're up there?

JG4_sKylon

Jun-02-2014, 15:50

Open canopy makes breathing easier:D

Bait

Jun-02-2014, 17:06

Open canopy makes breathing easier:D

Virtual Claustrophobia. Now that is something you don't think about. I have to admit my fear of heights doesn't bother me in game, but watching sky divers or cliff jumpers and the like on TV causes a definite reaction.

Airmailed from Switzerland.

ATAG_Dave

Jun-02-2014, 18:16

Lew is is opening his cockpit to improve his visibility - in particular his rearward visibility - try it you will see that you can see a lot more of your six with your cockpit open.

With regards to your original post about getting bounced - if you take the time to climb to a good altitude (20k or so) away from the combat zone in the first place you will not get bounced so much. Altitude is your friend regardless of whether you are in an RAF or LW fighter. You will then get the opportunity to be the one doing the bouncing. I appreciate bounces will still happen and you will sometimes need to be lower but it still a good discipline to try and have the altitude advantage where possible. There is no magic to why the 109s are generally higher - they just make the effort to climb, there is nothing to stop you doing so in an RAF fighter also.

Good luck :thumbsup:

ATAG_Endless

Jun-02-2014, 19:54

Just a few quick tips as a 109 pilot when I attack a spit or hurrie I want them to turn so I can get off the deflection shot its much easier to hit the full top exposure of the airframe than dead six small target but that doesn't mean don't turn

If you see a 109 diving in from a distance start a gentile dive yourself and a slight turn to try and match the dive of the 109 . The reason for this is the 109s controls become heavy at speed above 550kph when he gets closer start turning tighter and tighter the 109 will either

A: try and turn with you causing a big loss of energy for him

B: overshoot enderneath you giving you time to start climbing to get the advantage

C: he will climb up and try again

With point C if he keeps on diving and climbing he is probably to fixated on you to watch his altitude and if you start a dive every time he dives on you soon he will be under his safe zone 3000m or 10 000 ft under this altitude the spit 1a 100 oct is faster than the 109

Just remember the longer you you stay in the fight the better chance you are getting of surviving
It's extreemely difficult to fly the 109 with discipline

And flying experiance the longer you fly the longer you live

Fly high fly fast and never fly in a straight line

ATAG_Lewis

Jun-02-2014, 21:15

Those videos are very helpful! What's the purpose of having your cockpit canopy open sometimes when you're up there?

Purely visibility....Your pilot can see a whole lot more with the canopy open...Visibility is key when you are the prey....Only close it when I don't want to trade the speed..

busdriver

Jun-03-2014, 05:50

Those videos are very helpful! What's the purpose of having your cockpit canopy open sometimes when you're up there?

As you probably imagine, this game tactic was not found on RL. Can you imagine the contortions required to look over your shoulder whilst trying to find the controls to operate your canopy? Anything not secured to the airplane would get sucked out into the slipstream...your map if you have one. You can essentially forget about hearing anything on the radio whilst poking your cranium outside or over the cacophony of noise from the disrupted airflow and your engine.

Sincerely no disrespect to Lewis, you don't need to do this. He doesn't need to do this, his skill set is way beyond this. :salute: But once you have success with a method, it's a hard habit to break.

ATAG_Jeepy

Jun-03-2014, 06:25

Hi Anjelus.
Two good tips here, imo:
Get on teamspeak.
Form up with some one.

-then U'r in for a steep learning curve..
Good luck sir !
:salute:

ATAG_Lewis

Jun-03-2014, 07:48

Sincerely no disrespect to Lewis, you don't need to do this. He doesn't need to do this, his skill set is way beyond this. :salute: But once you have success with a method, it's a hard habit to break.

You are right in respect to the fact that in real life it would be difficult to do..However I read in one of my Battle of Britain books that many RAF pilots did do this in dogfights..but for different reasons...They had seen and heard son many stories of pilots burning that some pilots would dogfight with their canopy open in order for quick exit if they were on fire...It came from fear of burning

As for me...well it may be a habit...But I am consiously doing it for visibility...Often if I see the glare on the reflection inside the cockpit I will slide it back...Visibility is paramount in a dogfight...I would say that it trumps all.....If you have visibility you can counter and react...If you can't see the enemy you are meat..

Also in one of the documentaries on Youtube a few Battle of Britain pilots sat in their adversaries aircraft...The first thing the RAF pilots said about the 109 was that it was cramped and that there was a big blind spot in precisely the area that we are talking of here...

Another thing that most of you know is that ever since the Great War pilots had worn silk scarves...This was to better the chaffing due to the amount of head turning a pilot has to do in the combat zone..So make no mistake how much these fellas were looking around in real life...

I would also say that the biggest difference I have witnessed in this sim is the visibility gained by using a BIG monitor...I struggled for over a year with very poor distance visibility giving the enemy precious seconds to react to seeing me first...I got bounced a hell of a lot and was getting constantly killed by aircraft I had no idea were there...This all changed when I plugged in my 32inch TV monitor...Make no mistake this is not an expensive TV..Its simple a low budget flat screen..but because the pixels are bigger I can see aircraft when they come into view proper now...It has made a massive difference...and now its rare I get caught napping....although it does occasionally happen still...lol....

and also thanks for the compliment busDriver...~S~

JG4_sKylon

Jun-03-2014, 09:11

ATAG_Snapper

Jun-03-2014, 10:33

Hi Skylon,

Here's my current setup which I had also posted in the "Show us your cockpit" thread. We've had this Samsung 46" LCD TV for about 7 years now, so it's certainly not cutting edge specs anymore. It is rated as 1080p and its refresh rate is 60 Hz. Beside it to the left is the 27" Asus monitor (native 1920 x 1080p res, 120 Hz resolution) that I had been using as my Clod monitor until recently.

The crispness of the Asus monitor on it's smaller screen is inarguably superior to that of the larger-screened TV. Both support down sampling which further enhances the visual quality of the cockpit, clouds, terrain, other aircraft, etc. The only trouble with down sampling was that I got shot down a lot -- using both the Asus 27" and the Samsung 46"! The detail is finely-rendered with the extra info being processed by my PC and framerates remained acceptable (> 30 fps) for me in most situations. But the single-pixel dots of distant aircraft were difficult for me to pick up with either screen. But at native resolution, a huge difference was to be had between these screens:

At 1920 x 1080 res, single pixel contacts are still difficult for me to pick up on the 27" screen. I have eyeglasses specifically made for computer use: single prescription with a depth of field focus optimized for typical distance to the computer. (All you bi/tri-focal wearers using TrackIR: make note! Being single focus, no coatings, and cheap frames these glasses cost me under $100. Makes a HUGE difference with computer screen remaining in sharp focus no matter how you cant your head!). With the 46" screen at 1920 x 1080 res? Distant contacts are EASILY picked up within Clod's rendering distance. Night and day. If I get bounced now it's because I failed to check six.

I have no problem panning my head quickly side to side. The image remains good. I have VSync ON to prevent tearing. I would prefer my TV to be 120 Hz (like most new ones are) as is my Asus monitor since I feel it gives a slightly smoother (to the eye) movement and VSync is largely unneeded. But the effect of the huge screen 36" in front of you is absolutely awesome. The Spitfire cockpit is LIFE-SIZED!!!! It would be hard for me to go back to a smaller screen.

http://www.pbase.com/daverilstone/image/155639468.jpg

ATAG_Lewis

Jun-03-2014, 11:03

Hi Lew,

could you please tell what television you are using. I was checking for 27'' PC-Monitors. Compared with "small" TV´s they are fairly expensive.
I was thinking about buying a TV also, but thought it might not go well with fast movements etc.
Thank you :salute:

This is the TV I use now...:

SHARP
LCD COLOUR TV
MODEL LC-32SH130K
220-240V~50Hz
150W

I had a feeling my original monitor (ACER x233H - 23" screen) which I was using for CLOD was not performing...I was getting bounced by aircraft regularly and by E/A I hadn't seen which would have been consistent with an E/A spotting me and getting into position behind me before I could even spot them....Friends I flew with were also spotting aircraft before I did...I felt very vulnerable...I had the chance to experiment with my friends monitor when I visited him with my PC...We flew high and then flew straight level together for a while...then we turned slightly to give us a degree of about 30 degrees as we parted.....We watched each others aircraft and low and behold I he disappeared off my monitor a full 20 seconds before I vanished from his....This would give an enemy plenty of time to get in position behind me before I even knew they were there....No wonder I was being bounced and shot easily...

As I didn't have the money to buy a monitor like my buddies I decided to just try our lounge TV (details above)...Now my other wingman relies on my visibility to spot contacts...

So the moral is...If you are getting bounced by aircraft you haven't seen..try plugging in that big TV you have in your sitting room..you may be surprised...By the way my 32" Sharp TV was a low end budget TV...It cost £125 ($210)..I am convinced its not the quality of the TV that makes a difference..Its the pixel size you get with a bigger screen...

The only down side is I have to heave that big screen into the kitchen where I fly...and then heave it back again when I'm done..

busdriver

Jun-03-2014, 11:17

You are right in respect to the fact that in real life it would be difficult to do..However I read in one of my Battle of Britain books that many RAF pilots did do this in dogfights..but for different reasons...They had seen and heard son many stories of pilots burning that some pilots would dogfight with their canopy open in order for quick exit if they were on fire...It came from fear of burning

I recall reading something like that too, but never read a book that I can say the author did that. It does make sense for that reason. But for me it always came across as an anecdote. So if you do this so you can make a quick exit should your plate of flaming nachos fall onto your crotch. Well played sir!

I got a ride in the front seat of a WWII T-6 several years ago. I could barely tolerate 10-15 seconds of having the canopy open inflight at traffic pattern speeds. I know...I'm a wimp.

Your comments about cramped cockpits and lousy rear hemisphere visibility are well taken. Visibility in the Phantom was poor, not unlike the Hurricane with all its framework. Once I sat in the MiG-21 and MiG-23 cockpits and closed the canopy, then I felt pretty good about the Phantom. The F-16 is a lot like you in the Spitfire, you can turn your body to the right and be able to see all the way to the LEFT side of the tail.

I recently moved from a 20-something inch monitor to a 46" TV like Snapper, that has helped my old eyes pick up contacts you eagle-eyed young guys manage on smaller displays.

and also thanks for the compliment busDriver...~S~

My pleasure, you are a great ambassador for this sim and very talented, I envy the skill sets of many here. When I grow up, I'd hope to be as good, you make it look effortless.

:thumbsup:

JG4_sKylon

Jun-03-2014, 11:22

Hey Snapper,

thanks for this post. Nice setup though i am wondering what happened to your WT stick.
46'' is pretty big, i was thinking about 32'' or maximum 40''. I sit about 40 cm away from my 24'' monitor now, have to wear glasses to see closer things and thought it might be easier now to have a bigger screen.

:salute:

Edit: sorry, did not refresh this thread and have overseen Lews answer. Thanks buddy for your detailed answer. I am happy that "only" 32'' can make a big difference too, i was not prepared to sit in front of a screen which is bigger than my desk ;-)

Edit 2: when i move into my new castle i´ll buy 3 of these : http://www.amazon.de/Sharp-Electronics-LC90LE757E-LED-Backlight-Fernseher/dp/B00DJ4SIUI/ref=sr_1_14?ie=UTF8&qid=1401826387&sr=8-14&keywords=sharp+tv

Edit 3: works on my castle are delayed, so i ordered this one in the meantime: http://www.amazon.de/gp/product/B00BGNF7CG/ref=oh_details_o00_s00_i00?ie=UTF8&psc=1
I will report how it works.

Thanks again for helping!

ATAG_Dave

Jun-03-2014, 18:41

Edit 3: works on my castle are delayed, so i ordered this one in the meantime: http://www.amazon.de/gp/product/B00BGNF7CG/ref=oh_details_o00_s00_i00?ie=UTF8&psc=1
I will report how it works.

Thanks again for helping!

Id be really interested in hearing how you get on with your new purchase. Like you I have a 24" PC monitor at the moment - Ive already decided im going to upgrade & go down the LED TV route - and im not sure whether to go 32" or pay a bit more & get a 40" (a 46" like snapper would i fear end up with Mrs Dave disemboweling me in my sleep lol) so Id love to hear your impressions of your new fancy-pants screen when you get it :thumbsup:

ATAG_Lewis

Jun-03-2014, 18:54

The biggest problem I had with plugging in such a big monitor (32") was the TrackIR location....I have since lowered my TrackIR camera by sticking a small square of Velcro on the back like this...

http://i.imgur.com/e2H3o99.jpg?1

I have a feeling with a larger screen than 32 you will have to figure out something else to get that TrackIR lower....I found issues when it was perched on the top...Moving towards the screen made the TrackIR think I was looking down onto my dash...

ATAG_Dave

Jun-03-2014, 19:10

JG4_sKylon

Jun-03-2014, 20:25

Id be really interested in hearing how you get on with your new purchase. Like you I have a 24" PC monitor at the moment - Ive already decided im going to upgrade & go down the LED TV route - and im not sure whether to go 32" or pay a bit more & get a 40" (a 46" like snapper would i fear end up with Mrs Dave disemboweling me in my sleep lol) so Id love to hear your impressions of your new fancy-pants screen when you get it :thumbsup:

I decided to go with a 32'' because i sit really near to it and 40'' seems too big for this distance.
If money is not the relevant factor and if you have enough room to build a simpit of some kind then maybe go for the 40'' or more.... Only wife is the limit:D

Anjelus

Jun-03-2014, 23:09

Could you guys help me out with the zoom controls? I use a TrackIR and have tried zooming with field of view 30, but every time I try it centers me to the left of my cockpit and then I have a hard time zooming back out, the view basically locks to that fov and the "reset fov" control doesn't seem to work. I've taken to using + and - to incrementally raise and lower the fov, but that requires me to take my hands off the HOTAS and is a bit unweildy.

Also, how can I bank/hard turn my Spitfire to break or pursue a target without stalling it? I missed out on some nice kills today because I kept stalling during a hard turn, and about 50 percent of the time I stall the plane when a 109 is behind me and lose sight of him, then have to waste valuable time reacquiring.

In general, I'm having a hard time keeping eyes on all the planes around me and am considering getting a higher resolution monitor. I have a 22" ACER at 1080p, but I need more resolution for pixel hunting!

RAF74_Buzzsaw

Jun-03-2014, 23:50

...how can I bank/hard turn my Spitfire to break or pursue a target without stalling it? I missed out on some nice kills today because I kept stalling during a hard turn, and about 50 percent of the time I stall the plane when a 109 is behind me and lose sight of him, then have to waste valuable time reacquiring.

You are pulling too hard on your elevator. (back stick)

You need to have a more gentle hand on the stick... the Spitfire can be pulled right down to stall very easily, but you are best to back off, and maintain your speed higher.

You should keep your speed to 160 mph at minimum. At full throttle, a Spitfire can turn very fast at 160-180 mph and not lose any speed. It will turn faster at these speeds than it will at 140-150 mph.

Listen to the 'buffet' sound of the wind against your cockpit... this is your guide as to whether you are turning too sharply... the buffet sound should be just audible, not noisy.

Turn up your sound if you can't hear it. :salute:

Anjelus

Jun-04-2014, 01:21

trademe900

Jun-04-2014, 01:48

The Spitfire has that massive 242 sq ft wing area which gives it a very low wing loading whereas a 109 comes in at a much smaller 176 sq ft. Hurricane is even better with it's 258 sq ft wing! This low wing loading gives a Hurri\Spit a huge turn advantage and energy conservation in the turn, as it pulls a lower angle of attack for the same turn angle. Make sure you practice learning to use this to your advantage and escape! If he tries to turn hard with you he will skid through the air at high angle of attack and bleed off his energy and airspeed... it is then that you can perhaps even get around on his 6 and be on the attack!

JG4_sKylon

Jun-04-2014, 02:01

I have a 22" ACER at 1080p, but I need more resolution for pixel hunting!

Hi Anjelus,

higher resolution means that the single pixel is smaller when screen size stays the same, so your problem will become worse.
Check the previous posts of ATAG_Snapper and ATAG_Lewis.

ATAG_Lewis

Jun-04-2014, 08:35

I see. Thanks for all the advice gents!

This afternoon I was attacked by three 109s that I saw well in advance, but opted to break for home since I was alone. I dove for the deck and ran, but still ended up getting caught down on the deck and having to bail.

Is diving and running just 100 percent not viable???

This is the only option if you are on your own and outnumbered at high alt....and..It is 100% viable...

You are outnumbered and you CAN NOT keep eyes on all E/A (even if there were only 2) so there will be a time in the dogfight that you will be under attack from one you didn't see if you stay up there...Given that the 109 only needs one short pass to finish you then your best option is to start flying defensively pretty soon...Nosing down and heading for home gives you initial lead on your pursuers..They will eventually catch you but you have some advantage as you are the one diving first...
.
so..2 things here

a) There is a chance the 109s will not follow you down as you are taking them out of their comfort zone..they don't want to go low...You are desperate so you will do what it takes..going to the deck is not a good tactic for anyone but it is your best option in that scenario...A B'n'Zer wants to keep high to stop himself getting B'n'Zed..A lot of vets won't be lured down to the deck..They know better...so you maybe being chased by inexperienced pilots...At least you will sometimes lose one or two pursuers when you dive for the deck...

b) The allied aircraft perform better than the 109 on the deck

So..Given that's what you are going to do then make the best out of it....So here's what you do..

1) Shallow dive to keep speed without ripping off body parts...

2) Head for allied territory, friendlies, friendly shipping (this will create flak which will also get the attention of team mates)...or cloud cover (Clouds are a usefull source of cover now so stay close to them if possible in retreat)...

3) Keep checking 6 CONSTANTLY as they will be coming for you and now you KNOW where they will be attacking you from so you KNOW where to look..Thats a big positive because it means that you have narrowed down the window for spotting them..you are not having to scan the sky for contacts anymore..All you are doing is looking at your 6 and waiting for them to catch up

4) Fly in a gentle zigzag..This will keep you fast and will give you more rear visibility..

5) When they catch you and come for their first pass..then you react and are forced to turn...They will be fast so you should be able to make them miss..then they will usually go up for another pass....If you still have alt at this point then nose down and try to keep eyes on and regain your trajectory to home or friendlies....wash and repeat until you are on the deck

6) If you are on the deck you have less options...This is the last resort...If you are with enemy that won't let you go then you are in a dogfight and your first priority is to out manoeuvre them and fight..You now have the benefit that you can out turn them and that your aircraft performs better....Their tactic is usually the trademark slashing attack up and down with more energy so keep eyes on if you can...and importantly DO NOT GIVE UP!..Your objective is to keep them busy and not get hit, delay them....Important: If there is more than one do not be tempted to try to climb after one unless you have eyes on where the others are and are sure you can make it without getting tagged..Its a high risk so do not be tempted if you are unsure....Delay tactics DO work...So use them......Make it as hard for them as you can and don't give up....They are already out of their comfort zone..If they fire and miss too this will deplete their guns...so keep them busy on the deck...and make sure you DO NOT give them that easy high alt kill that they want..

Key here is to stay alive as long as you can..Sometimes this can be 10 minutes or more which gives friendlies time to spot you..especially if you are in home territory..

and finally...for future...Get a wingman or two!

As with all advice..It is what I do that I know works...Other folks will do other things...Try them all and see what works for you..But do not think you are out of options..because you are not...

and..Never give in....

busdriver

Jun-04-2014, 13:56

Lots of good gouge here. To add to Lewis' latest excellent post...WRT to his advice to zigzag, this is only when you are NOT engaged, and not to be confused with whether or not to reverse the direction of your turn when engaged.

If you do get "tied up," or are "in the phone booth," or in a "knife fight" with a 109 or two, resist the urge to simply pull on the stick trying to get a max performance turn ALL of the time. If the bandit's nose is not pointing at you or in lead (nose off he's not an immediate threat), that provides an opportunity to relax back pressure on the stick and regain some airspeed. It may only be 10 or 20 mph until you have to pull into your max performance turn again.

Resist the urge to automatically reverse your turn when you see the bandit overshoot. I see this frequently online and in videos guys make. It will take practice watching an overshoot, here are two considerations.

1) RANGE of the overshoot: How far back is the bandit overshooting? He may be going after another target, continuing the turn or reversing are both options if he's outside of your turn circle.

2) RATE of the overshoot.

2a) If the bandit is slowly overshooting (you probably only see some of his upper wing, or just his nose, or any part of his belly) he presents a low line of sight change...DO NOT REVERSE, you'll solve his gunnery problem. A rolling pull (you're pulling back on the stick and rolling the airplane) toward the deck is appropriate if he's shooting or he has aligned his fuselage with yours (looks like he's in formation on your tail).

2b) If he's crossing at a very high rate (you probably see the tops of his wings) he can't hack your turn and will probably opt to zoom up. Reversing is an option for you, and if he didn't zoom still trying to turn...upon reversing you'll find yourself offensive (aft of his 3-9 line) or neutral, you can then either extend out his six o'clock or lead turn to align your fuselage with his and KILL HIM.

Not all 109 drivers are aces. A truism often uttered in RL fighter squadrons when asked "what's the best way to defeat X threat?" The answer..."it depends..."

Check Six:thumbsup:

blackshark

Jun-05-2014, 10:10

Edit 3: works on my castle are delayed, so i ordered this one in the meantime: http://www.amazon.de/gp/product/B00BGNF7CG/ref=oh_details_o00_s00_i00?ie=UTF8&psc=1
I will report how it works.

just to ask you if it works fine ... i had a sony 46 full hd but had problem using it with the pc, so just asking you it this one works fine as a pc monitor for CoD

JG4_sKylon

Jun-05-2014, 13:12

just to ask you if it works fine ... i had a sony 46 full hd but had problem using it with the pc, so just asking you it this one works fine as a pc monitor for CoD

TV arrived today. Simply connected it via HDMI, no problem with recognition. I only had to go into the TV menue to change picture format to "original", with default settings the desktop was kind of zoomed in a little bit so i was not able to see the start button.
Adjusted color, brightness etc and tested with a screenshot from CloD which shows a lot of contacts that are far away (single pixel).
Is was so much easier to identify the contacts because the pixels are bigger now...amazing.

Started CloD quick and dirty single player mission over the channel and
WOOOOOOOOOAAAAAH :)

Cockpit looks almost as it was real regarding its size. Turning close over the water gives you the feeling as if the water is pulling you down.
Its a big increase in immersion for me.
I managed to light up a Spit, fuel tank fire...and it looks amazing.

I already mentioned that spotting contacts from far distance is much easier now, in fact i have to get used to it because when i saw a contact with my old monitor it was relatively close. Now i see them and i still think they are close but now they are far away.

Only negative aspect is following: now that i can see everything better (bigger), i can also see better that antialiasing is not working perfectly.

verdict: i never go back, i love it.

Thanks Lew and Snapper for bringing this to my attention :thumbsup:

ATAG_Snapper

Jun-05-2014, 13:23

Glad it worked for you, Sky! :thumbsup:

Actually, I got inspired by Lewis' suggestion to go Big TV, too! DCS P51D looks awesome, as well!

:)

Anjelus

Jun-05-2014, 14:00

This is a good discussion. What do you chaps think about a smaller TV like this (http://www.amazon.com/Samsung-UN22F5000-22-Inch-1080p-60Hz/dp/B00BCGRX9M/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1401991005&sr=8-1&keywords=tv+24+inch)?

I also sit close to my "cockpit" and don't necessarily want something bigger. A 22" TV like that one would presumably match my 22" monitor and not look terribly out of place on my desk.

Alternately I can get something like this (http://www.amazon.com/ViewSonic-VX2703MH-LED-27-Inch-LED-Lit-Speakers/dp/B008A3KFB8/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1401991208&sr=8-2&keywords=tv+27+inch+1080p) and have it match the 27" monitor I intend to get sometime in the future.

Decisions, decisions...

implicit A

Jun-05-2014, 15:47

I have the LCD TV too ... just behind my computer desk and ...off.
Just because this Fu...g Desk have a up part to put the printer, the gap inside is not enough big to place the LCD TV.

just wait ... where did i place my saw ....
as soon as possible i'll tune it... and my wife will really become to think i'm mad. but anyway it doesnt matter l'll do it soon.:):-)

Oups she arrives here ... :angel:

'll do it later

Steve D

Jun-24-2014, 06:36

There's not really anything I can add to the good advice given above by the likes of Lewis, Busdriver, and others, regarding dealing with attacking 109's, except perhaps on the subject of elevator trim in combat. The simple rule is the faster you are going, the more your plane wants to climb, and therefore the more you have to push forward on the stick to counteract this to maintain level flight. As it relates to combat the problem neutral trim causes me is that when maneuvering at speed, say to get a shot, I'm having to fight the stick while also trying to position the aircraft. Don't want to have to do that. The second problem I find is more relevant to reacting to an attack. While trying to keep your speed up to be able to evade, you're also trying keep eyes on your opponent - if you're plane is trimmed neutral and you're going some, as you should be, it will tend to want to climb and this can go unnoticed, by me at any rate, while I'm looking up into the sky to see what my tormentor is going to do next - before you know it you can find yourself in a sharp nose up attitude, bleeding speed rapidy. Although the 109 pilot will thank you for it, you generally don't want to be doing that. Therefore, when at speed I set my elevator trim nose down so that the aircraft flies neutrally or thereabouts, that way in evasive maneuvers with eyes on the enemy the plane won't tend to climb unless I ask it to. Because trim is speed dependent, I bind a pair of +/- buttons easy to operate while 'hands on' in the same was as I have prop pitch control easily to hand.

That said, I read that some pilots used to set their elevator trim deliberately nose up so that if bounced, the plane would react faster...109's did this, I think.

Cheers!

ATAG_Snapper

Jun-24-2014, 09:33

"Trim is your friend" -oft repeated by the much-missed JTDawg. If anyone wants to eke out a few more mph in a chase or evade situation, trim your aircraft to zero out any joystick input you're applying to maintain your course heading. I have trim assigned to two axis on my CH Quadrant which I frequently adjust for any change in engine/prop settings and plane attitude (dive, turn, climb, level fight, etc). As Steve D. says, you're not fighting your stick if you're properly trimmed and you're minimising control surface drag which exerts a speed penalty (and fuel if you're down to 3 gallons halfway back across the Channel!).