ATAG and TF need your help!

[ATAG_Bliss]

Hi everyone,
With the growing popularity of Team Fusion, the costs associated with maintaining the bandwidth required for hosting the mods/patches keeps exponentially going up. This month's (month of August) TF patch hosting service costs were almost $600 alone :stunned:. This doesn't include the costs for the forums, or the 2 game servers/TS server we provide - That is $400 by itself, monthly, on top of the charges for hosting the TF patches/mods.

And last month's (month of July) TF patch hosting costs were almost $400. This cost has steadily increased over time. We've tried various hosting providers and virtually all of them (on any sort of monthly plan) will stop streaming bandwidth after a certain amount of data has been transferred. This is why, in the past, there were so many issues just being able to download the mod depending on the time of month (as the bandwidth for that month was already used up).

But now that we have a system that works 100% of the time that also allows patches to be downloaded at any time, the expense is constantly growing as more and more people download and try the mod.

So I'm asking for some help. To those out there that enjoy what Team Fusion is doing, any and all help in keeping this going is much appreciated. But without your help, there is no way we can support the costs associated with such an undertaking. As you can imagine, I've personally spent thousands out of my own pocket on this over the years, and the donations of those regular supporters over the years have kept this place going. Add in the fact that paypal/CC companies usually take 3% if not more depending on your location / currency etc., this has truly been a passion of mine to keep going.

But with the out of pocket costs constantly going higher month after month, I need your help. It's one thing to spend a couple hundred dollars out of your own pocket every month. It's completely different when that out of pocket costs is hitting close to $500 monthly. Add insult to injury (I've been too busy to even enjoy flight simming for quite a few months), so I'm paying for something I can't even enjoy! :(

So here's the TF patch hosting costs just for this month, the month of August to give you an idea. Add $250 for server 1, another $100 for server 2, and $50 for the hosting of the forums, and you can see this place is pretty expensive to keep around!

http://i.imgur.com/hJhine2.png

So I'm asking everyone, if you've enjoyed the efforts of TF, please help by clicking on the donate button and dropping off a few dollars in appreciation. Thanks in advance for any and all help in keeping this going. :salute:

PS - We are going to try to find a different route to hosting and will let everyone know once some sort of decision has been made.

Thanks again,

Bliss

[92 Sqn. Philstyle (QJ-P)]

[[Hi Bliss, I know we don't always see eye-to-eye, hopefully none of the below is considered prvocative in any way. It's not meant to be. This is a genuine attempt to offer some help/ thoughts.]]

My God that's a lot of money they're asking for!

The next TF patch absolutely has to be an "all-in-one" update that will take the vanilla game all the way to TF 5. By continuing to patch sequentially ATAG are having to host every single patch old and new. Only then are you going to be able to delete all the previous patches from your hosting and reduce costs.

ATAG can't afford to host all the patches. The game/ player base is still too small to bear the costs. There's not enough people playing this game to support $600 per month. This also means that funds which might be spread around a little bit to support variety int he game are also not making it throughout the community.

You've probably thought of all this, but here would be some suggestions for "trimming" down costs.

1. Change the TF patching system and streamline it all down to one single patch. Delete all the old patch versions to save storage costs.
2. Change the host for Server 1 to something a little cheaper. I know ATAG are proud of the speed of Server 1 but, to be honest, right now I seldom see a full server. I'll bet that 90% of the time there are less than 80 or so people online.
3. Shut down server 2. It is seldom patronized and there are a couple of other servers that do, essentially the same job.
4. Long shot - Contact steam/ 777 and see if TF can be allowed to patch through steam, maybe via the "workshop" system?

You've probably considered all the above already... apologies if this was unhelpful.

[ATAG_Bliss]

My God that's a lot of money they're asking for!

I don't think you understand fully. It's actually very inexpensive hosting. The patches are just being downloaded by many more people.


The next TF patch absolutely has to be an "all-in-one" update that will take the vanilla game all the way to TF 5. By continuing to patch sequentially ATAG are having to host every single patch old and new. Only then are you going to be able to delete all the previous patches from your hosting and reduce costs.

Again, I don't think you are understanding. In your example, the costs would be significantly higher. Costs are associated with bandwidth. We are talking 1000's of terabytes. By having separate patches, the only patch needed to be downloaded is the latest one (for those that already have it). If the next patch included all the other patches, the bandwidth required to download all that data would be exponentially higher.


ATAG can't afford to host all the patches. The game/ player base is still too small to bear the costs. There's not enough people playing this game to support $600 per month. This also means that funds which might be spread around a little bit to support variety int he game are also not making it throughout the community.

Judging by the downloads, there's quite a few more people playing the game than you think. Simply turning steam in offline mode (as most offliners do) will make them never show up on any sort of activity list for the sim.


1. Change the TF patching system and streamline it all down to one single patch. Delete all the old patch versions to save storage costs.

Again, this would actually cause more data to flow as all patches grouped together would equal much more data to be downloaded.


2. Change the host for Server 1 to something a little cheaper. I know ATAG are proud of the speed of Server 1 but, to be honest, right now I seldom see a full server. I'll bet that 90% of the time there are less than 80 or so people online.

It was full today, yesterday, and the day before. It's full quite often and usually even throughout the week peaks well over 70 people a day for hours on end. As far as cheaper, you get what you pay for in the case of servers.


3. Shut down server 2. It is seldom patronized and there are a couple of other servers that do, essentially the same job.

We use this to test for TF in a real dedicated server environment. Shutting it down really isn't a good option.


4. Long shot - Contact steam/ 777 and see if TF can be allowed to patch through steam, maybe via the "workshop" system?

Steam workshop does not work this way. The costs of bandwidth still have to be paid for somehow.


You've probably considered all the above already... apologies if this was unhelpful.

Yes, as said above, we've tried many options, and the cheaper ones are the one's that always fail and have the forums filled with complaints because downloads won't work. But we are still looking.

[92 Sqn. Philstyle (QJ-P)]

Cheers Bliss.


I don't think you understand fully. It's actually very inexpensive hosting. The patches are just being downloaded by many more people.
In this case it seems you've not understood fully. I was not balking at the price "relative to other options" but rather I was balking at the price prima-facie. I did not realise how much was being spent on data transfer.

But it's great news that "many more people" are downloading the patch. I hope this transfers soon into player numbers online. It'd be great to see this current timezone pick up for sure (evening in Australia, morning in Europe).



Again, this would actually cause more data to flow as all patches grouped together would equal much more data to be downloaded.


Yes it seems I don't understand this one. I can't work out how a single patch would result in "much more" data being downloaded.
The zip files sizes for all patches to date are as follows.
TF 3.0 = 389 MB
TF 3.01 = 11 MB
TF 4.0 = 2100 MB
TF 4.3 = 550 MB
TF 4.312 = 127 MB

Total size of all patches to date = 3177 MB

If everyone downloads each patch once, they will draw (t least) 3177 MB of transfer.
If all the previous patches were combined into a single patch is it not logical that the total volume of data would be the same or less than 3177MB? Presumably there is some data that is repeated in the later patches that is redundant from the earlier ones (i.e. replaced files, updated files - flight models for example). So these duplicated files/ data would not need to be included twice (or more than twice). It seems to me that a combined patch would almost have to be smaller in size than the total weight of all the preceding patches. If that is the case, then download/ transfer of information would have to be less.

There are of course two caveats;
1. A single download might result in more people accessing the game, because the download/ installation complexity is reduced. So this might push costs back up again.
2. A single download might result in more disconnections during the long data transfer, and thus restarts - which would mean more data being moved. However, the existing patches already require long download-times to get them all completed anyways, with all the accompanying disconnections that this entails. Also browsers tend to be quite good at "resumptions" of broken downloads these days. The difference might be minimal/ negligible.


LATE UPDATE:
I've just re-read your explanation and I think I get it now. Will update this post shortly with the math.

OK I think I see what you're saying. I'm just paraphrasing here to get it clear in my head.

IF TF 5 induced TF 5 PLUS all the previous data, anyone who already had TF 3.0 to 4.312 would then, subsequently end up "re-downloading" all that information again when patching up to TF5. IF TF5 was a standalone patch then ONLY those new-to-the-game players would have to catch up on all the previous data. The existing players would only need to get the TF 5.

SCENARIO A - a new TF5 patch comes out, with ALL previous data included in a mega-patch :
Existing player base with all patches = 100
Total data downloaded to date = 100 x 3177 = 317700

TF patch 5 comes out with all previous data, requiring 5000 MB of download in total.
25 new players join the game as a result.

Total new downloads = 125 x 5000 = 625000

Total historical data downloaded = 625000 + 317700 = 942700

SCENARIO B - a new TF5 patch comes out, but it is ONLY the new data :
Existing player base with all patches = 100
Total data downloaded to date = 100 x 3177 = 317700

TF patch 5 comes out with only new data, requiring 1800 MB of download in total.
25 new players join the game as a result.

Total new downloads = (100 x 1800) + (25 x 5000) = 305000

Total historical data downloaded = 305000 + 317700 = 622700

In scenario B the total transfer of data is considerably less than in scenario A. So yes, it makes sense in that case to keep the system as it is right now (only new data to be included in patches)

[ATAG_Lewis]

Done

[ATAG_Bliss]

Yes it seems I don't understand this one. I can't work out how a single patch would result in "much more" data being downloaded.
The zip files sizes for all patches to date are as follows.
TF 3.0 = 389 MB
TF 3.01 = 11 MB
TF 4.0 = 2100 MB
TF 4.3 = 550 MB
TF 4.312 = 127 MB

To make it real easy to understand. If the majority of current players already have TF4.0 (2100 MB) and all they need to be current is 4.3 and 4.312, by forcing them to download an all in one patch instead which is 3177MB (includes everything) vs 600MB (includes only what they need - the last patches) = LOTS more data that isn't needed. So you see, making someone download an all in one patch when they only need, say, the last 127MB patch instead, would be an exponentially higher amount of data being transferred.



If everyone downloads each patch once, they will draw (t least) 3177 MB of transfer.

Exactly my point. Especially when in reality they may only need a 127MB patch instead.


If all the previous patches were combined into a single patch is it not logical that the total volume of data would be the same or less than 3177MB? Presumably there is some data that is repeated in the later patches that is redundant from the earlier ones (i.e. replaced files, updated files - flight models for example). So these duplicated files/ data would not need to be included twice (or more than twice). It seems to me that a combined patch would almost have to be smaller in size than the total weight of all the preceding patches. If that is the case, then download/ transfer of information would have to be less.

There would be many redundant files, but the majority of those are all miniscule in size and don't amount to much data. That is why 4.0 is much larger than 4.312 for instance. It's filled with content.

Edit: I see you understand now. :thumbsup:

[PFT_Endy]

You may know the site but I think you should consider setting up a Patreon site for ATAG/TF donations: http://www.patreon.com/
If you're not familiar with it, the site is similar to kickstarter in that people pledge monthly donations, there are some goals to reach (incentives for backers) etc.

As an example, here's a quite successful one from one of the well known guys in the Arma community: http://www.patreon.com/dslyecxi

I think this would be a good solution for TF/ATAG, just an idea though.

[92 Sqn. Philstyle (QJ-P)]

How safe is the TF-patch download host from abuse?
If someone were ill-minded enough to queue up a thousand downloads, would the provider refund the transfer costs?
Could someone set up a bot to inflict financial damage on TF and/ or ATAG simply by setting up repeated downloads?

Does Hightail not have a service that will give you a flat-rate irrespective of how many downloads are made?
https://www.hightail.com/compare-plans

Seems that they are not protecting their customers from a pretty obvious abuse-path if they don't...

[Gladio]

4. Long shot - Contact steam/ 777 and see if TF can be allowed to patch through steam, maybe via the "workshop" system?

What does it mean ?

[92 Sqn. Philstyle (QJ-P)]

What does it mean ?

Some games (skyrim for example) allow mods to be uploaded to steam. Users can then pick and chose the mods they want. Steam will install the mods. It is called the "workshop".

http://steamcommunity.com/workshop/

[Chuck_Owl]

Some games (skyrim for example) allow mods to be uploaded to steam. Users can then pick and chose the mods they want. Steam will install the mods. It is called the "workshop".

http://steamcommunity.com/workshop/

This could be a great idea!

[SorcererDave]

Yeah, I agree. Putting it up on the steam workshop would be a great idea. That way you don't have to pay a penny to host it, and it gets more exposure to new players simply by virtue of the fact that the TF patches will appear on peoples' steam library screen in the mods section. It would also greatly simplify the install process.

[ATAG_Lolsav]

The STEAM solution was always the pot at the end of the rainbow, but for now its a "non solution", desirable, but it depends on a company who is launching another sim game. If you were in that company would you say "yes"?

So its desirable, but not realistic achievable. Thats where we stand, as far as i know.

[DUI]

As the bandwith for the patches produce the highest costs, I think this is something that the community (especially some squadrons) can help with. Of course, besides from donating direct money.

Some months ago our webmaster already proposed to host the patches on our squadron-server as well. I posted the proposal here in the forum and for some reason was sure that it did not get a reply. But I just saw now that it only took Buzzsaw three hours to respond (http://theairtacticalassaultgroup.com/forum/showthread.php?t=10861&p=119171&viewfull=1#post119171). My excuses that I did not act sooner. I will speak with our webmaster right away and ask him to put the patches on our webspace.

According to him we do have unlimited traffic. But even if it is reduced after a specific amount this might bring the costs for ATAG down a bit. In any case we will have a try!

[farley]

How about using a torrent program to download.

I have used them here and on IL 2 with success.

Yes, it takes a while, but in the end the product is delivered.

I realise that that would help with only a small portion of the overall costs, but every little bit helps.

If that isn't the answer, then i like the monthly donation idea.

I hate to admit it, but I've been "going to donate" and haven't yet, although in my case, I know it is only because i procrastinate! :sorry:

If it was an automatic, monthly donation, it would be easy for people like me who just don't get around to it....

[farley]

If that isn't the answer, then i like the monthly donation idea.

I hate to admit it, but I've been "going to donate" and haven't yet, although in my case, I know it is only because i procrastinate! :sorry:

If it was an automatic, monthly donation, it would be easy for people like me who just don't get around to it....



Oops! This is embarrassing..... :doh:

Went to donate and right at the top is a monthly donation box.

At least for me, problem solved!

[92 Sqn. Philstyle (QJ-P)]

As the bandwith for the patches produce the highest costs, I think this is something that the community (especially some squadrons) can help with. Of course, besides from donating direct money.


This is a very good idea. Why not share the hosting around?
92 Sqn. could certainly host one of the smaller patches at least, free of charge.

Sure, it means that the links to download will have to be updated. But if it means that TF's futrure is more secure, then it's a small amount of effort.

[ATAG_Colander]

Well, ideally sharing the patches via torrent would be great if the direct download is left for special cases.
Sadly this would mean that many people would have to be feeding the torrent at all times.

[farley]

Well, ideally sharing the patches via torrent would be great if the direct download is left for special cases.
Sadly this would mean that many people would have to be feeding the torrent at all times.


Think you are correct there Colander.

I readily admit to not knowing much about these sorts of things. When i did download patches using a torrent file, it took several hours, or maybe it was a full day; but then i just left the computer on for a couple of days to help with seeding, which, i believe, helps others who are downloading.

Maybe some others with a lot more knowledge than i can comment on this as well.

[EG14_Marcast]

Done

+1

[92 Sqn. Philstyle (QJ-P)]

Well, ideally sharing the patches via torrent would be great if the direct download is left for special cases.
Sadly this would mean that many people would have to be feeding the torrent at all times.

Patches 3.1 and 4.312 are both small enough (<250mb file size) to be hosted for free on hightail.
If each is hosted by other parties that will reduce the existing paid ATAG-hosted data by 4% (~138/3177)
This should equate to around $25.00 (4% of $600) per month saved. Not much... but it's still something.

If anyone could find hosts that would give 500MB file size limits...then 3.0 could be added to the list also.

[ATAG_Lolsav]

For a quite some time i have available a personnal backup for whoever needs it. Dont ask me whats the available bandwith per month because i dont know. But if anyone wants to get 16GB of free space in europe (portugal) let me know :)

Link for backup: https://meocloud.pt/link/87d345b8-2c11-4297-90de-24931b6e4552/Team%20Fusion/

[Otyg]

Do dropbox have a limit of data sent?

I could seed torrent no problem I have my computer on almost 24/7 but of course some downtimes here and there and have 100/60 mb fiber.

Edit I also have the patches on my computer and USB if anyone needs :)

[Itafolgore]

First of all let me say that i will contribute as soon as i'll recharge my CC because i like and appreciate what you guys offering us even if i dont play it as much as i want it.

Let me add a personal note.

Currently there are lots of games/aerial simulation that requires to the users willing to buy it a good deal of money often to buy products still in Beta. Everyone is free to think whatever he/she likes and to spend his/her money as it deems best, however I cant stop myself thinking that Team Fusion offers a MOD for free which is in fact a standalone product in continuos development granting us a pleasant game experience. Among other things the vanilla game can be purchased for less than 5 € …
Is well established that things offered for free are not appreciated, people needs to spend a good deal of moneys to be satisfied and feel they bought a “real simulation” and not just another free MOD, lets make them pay then!
You rent a server granting the access only to those users who bought the game giving them among other things the auto-updates.
Doing this you wont need donations anymore sustaining the expenses with TF work avoinding the risk to stop the development because you lack of founds.
We just need to say that starting from version 5.0 you need to pay the MOD and who doesn’t want to contribute con keep playing version 4.X on their or Group servers … Problem solved


My 2 cent

[Chuck_Owl]

Isn't dropbox free of charge? I know the 15th MEU in Arma host some of their patches on it, and they are quite big in file size (500+ mbit)

[ATAG_Lolsav]

We just need to say that starting from version 5.0 you need to pay the MOD and who doesn’t want to contribute con keep playing version 4.X on their or Group servers … Problem solved


My 2 cent


No. That would be doing business. Not allowed. Thanks for the 2 cent tough :)

[ATAG_Naz]

TF cant charge or accept any money for their work on Cliffs of Dover I believe mate...legals and all that.

:salute:

EDIT: SNAP! Lolsav
:)

[ATAG_Snapper]

Done

+1

[HaJa]

Done :thumbsup:

[JG27-Gaidin]

Salute and Howdy, Bliss!

Sorry, Brother, slipped my mind, this month. I'l take care of it when I get home from work.

[hnbdgr]

Isn't dropbox free of charge? I know the 15th MEU in Arma host some of their patches on it, and they are quite big in file size (500+ mbit)

I believe a free Dropbox account has 10GB bandwith per day and a paid one 250GB. You would have to set up several paid ones to see some efficiency....

[hnbdgr]

If I said I know of a reliable hosting solution based in europe that has a 180-200 GB monthly bandwith for £25/yearly would anybody be interested?

EDIT: ok, i don't know if it's daily or monthly now. I'm hoping for the earlier. I'll be back with more info.

[ATAG_Bliss]

If I said I know of a reliable hosting solution based in europe that has a 180-200 GB monthly bandwith for £25/monthly would anybody be interested?

Well, what we are trying to do is make it so one link goes to all the patches. IMO the worst thing that can happen is you click to download and you can't.

To give you an idea, with the current usage, 200GB total availability would only last a few hours time. What we need and may have a solution for (more on that later) is streaming around 10000 GB-30000 GB per month. So you can see how quickly a couple hundred GB would be gone through (in a matter of hours).

[ATAG_Bliss]

And holy cow!! :stunned:Look at all the support!! Wow guys. Thanks so much. It's the 1st day of the month and the goal is 75% there already. WOW!!! :salute:


Thanks again everyone. Simply amazing :salute:

[hnbdgr]

Well, what we are trying to do is make it so one link goes to all the patches. IMO the worst thing that can happen is you click to download and you can't.

To give you an idea, with the current usage, 200GB total availability would only last a few hours time. What we need and may have a solution for (more on that later) is streaming around 10000 GB-30000 GB per month. So you can see how quickly a couple hundred GB would be gone through (in a matter of hours).

That is a lot, I did query with the host i use (https://www.websupport.sk/) about roughly 25K GB per month I'll see what they say.

[RAF74_Buzzsaw]

Thanks to everyone who supported the site.

Your help is much appreciated. :thumbsup:

[Chuck_Owl]

I'm very short on money these days, but I thought I'd help a bit anyway.

I know it's not much... but it's still something.

[ATAG_Snapper]

Everybody's circumstances are different. Every donation is gratefully appreciated. :salute:

[Vlerkies]

With the growing popularity of Team Fusion, the costs associated with maintaining the bandwidth required for hosting the mods/patches keeps exponentially going up.

Well 'Congratulations to TF', you guys are clearly doing something right :salute:


What we need and may have a solution for (more on that later) is streaming around 10000 GB-30000 GB per month

:gulp: Dammit where are all these RAF noobs that require some slapping down? :D
How can we entice them and other courageous Luftwaffe pilots into the online environment? They are all clearly missing out on the fun.
Without crunching numbers logic tells me that the current online player base would require a fraction of that bandwidth, so the next step must be how to somehow draw in the other offline enthusiast online as such, or at least into the active community on ATAG.

Register to DL maybe?

[Marmus]

I'm very short on money these days, but I thought I'd help a bit anyway.

I know it's not much... but it's still something.

I am with you, Chuck......but just donated a bit. Every bit counts!

[DUI]

All TF patches have been uploaded to our webserver. Please feel free to include these links (maybe as alternative download-sources) in your installation posts (edit: ...or whereever you want to):

http://jagdgeschwader4.de/TFMODS/TF-Patch-3.0.zip
http://jagdgeschwader4.de/TFMODS/TF-Patch-3.01.zip
http://jagdgeschwader4.de/TFMODS/TF-Patch-4.0.rar
http://jagdgeschwader4.de/TFMODS/TF-Patch-4.3.zip
http://jagdgeschwader4.de/TFMODS/TF-Patch-4.312.zip

According to our webhosting contract there is no bandwith-limit. But we might find out soon and in the meantime take-over one or two GB of ATAG's up to 30.000 GB traffic. :faint:

In the next days we will make a landing page for the patches on our website (maybe only in German).

[ATAG_Colander]

http://teamfusion.theairtacticalassaultgroup.com/

This one is located on server 1 but hopefully we can spread the downloads among different places and don't hit the limit.

[ATAG_Colander]

All TF patches have been uploaded to our webserver. Please feel free to include these links (maybe as alternative download-sources) in your installation posts:

http://jagdgeschwader4.de/TFMODS/TF-Patch-3.0.zip
http://jagdgeschwader4.de/TFMODS/TF-Patch-3.01.zip
http://jagdgeschwader4.de/TFMODS/TF-Patch-4.0.rar
http://jagdgeschwader4.de/TFMODS/TF-Patch-4.3.zip
http://jagdgeschwader4.de/TFMODS/TF-Patch-4.312.zip

According to our webhosting contract there is no bandwith-limit. But we might find out soon and in the meantime take-over one or two GB of ATAG's up to 30.000 GB traffic. :faint:

In the next days we will make a landing page for the patches on our website (maybe only in German).

DUI,

Do you mind if we put those links on the teamfusion.theairtacticalassaultgroup.com page?

[ATAG_Lolsav]

http://teamfusion.theairtacticalassaultgroup.com/

This one is located on server 1 but hopefully we can spread the downloads among different places and don't hit the limit.

Neat! One advice/request - put the size of the download +- in front of each file. You know Colander, some guys have slow connections ;)

[DUI]

DUI,

Do you mind if we put those links on the teamfusion.theairtacticalassaultgroup.com page?

Colander, publish the download links whereever you want to! :thumbsup:

[ATAG_Colander]

Thanks DUI

I changed the link in the top menu to point to this new page.
The page will randomize the links between the (now) 3 different possible places for download.

[DUI]

The page will randomize the links between the (now) 3 different possible places for download.

Looking at a possible bandwith limit occuring unpredictably, it might also be an option to display all 3 sources at once (maybe with a random position of the sources). In this case, if the download speed of one source gets slow the user would be able to select another one. But totally up to you, of course.

I keep the fingers crossed that our webserver can handle the requests with a comfortable bandwith.

[Vadr]

I'm very short on money these days, but I thought I'd help a bit anyway.

I know it's not much... but it's still something.

+1

[ATAG_Colander]

The amounts don't matter, in fact, we should probably make the donations anonymous.

[ATAG_Lolsav]

on the TF site:

MOD 4.3... 571GB
MOD 4.312... 130GB

:goofy:glaughter:

[Artist]

And another small typo: "Please select a download from bellow."

[ATAG_Colander]

Corrected. Thanks folks!

[ATAG_Slot]

Done.
A small price to pay for all the great work.
I only ever fly offline but am more than happy to help contribute to keep TF flying.
Money well spent.
:thumbsup:

[9./JG52 Mindle]

Big salute to all new contributors. ~S~

[LARRY69]

..Done!

LARRY69

[Vulgar]

I believe a free Dropbox account has 10GB bandwith per day and a paid one 250GB. You would have to set up several paid ones to see some efficiency....

Dropbox is Amazon AWS S3, dropbox is only a client that uses Amazon AWS S3, while dropbox adds fee's on top of normal Amazon AWS fee's. Since Amazon AWS is being used directly, it is going to be very difficult to find cheaper bandwidth. The actual cost shown for storage is but 0.01, that's one cent per month.

I have been using Amazon AWS for 4 years, professionally, and you are going to be hard pressed to find any cheaper storage, or what is really important bandwidth, while maintaining the level of safety that they provide. In other words file corruption.

If you read the fine print, of any company claiming unlimited bandwith, or storage, you will find that it is not true. There are always limits, usually with unlimited storage, it is the number of inodes that is limited, number of inodes and disk space go hand in hand, unlimited is nothing more than a marketing gimmick, to lure those that really do not understand all the aspects.

For the price, delivery speed/bandwidth, multiple locations around the world, with the level of reliability and file safety inherent in Amazon AWS S3. The best delivery system is already being used. Amazon is so far ahead of everyone else its is not even funny, that is why two thirds of the worlds websites are hosted there. As the cloud war grows, that may change in the future, but for right now, nothing else compares.

I have been away for a long time, thinking of getting back, though will have to see if I can still get into my steam account, have not had time to play. If I start playing again, will certainly throw a bit of money in the pot. There simply is no free lunch, never has been, never will be. Great to see that so many people have thrown in to keep this sim alive, last of the ww2 cfs's left.

Well there is aces high, even though their gameplay is nice, the arcade way of the aircraft management, just does not do it for me, what do they charge now, $10-15 USD per month, when I first played aces high it was $30 per month, a bargain, before that online games were charging by the minute. Many people ran up bills in the hundreds in one month. Gaming, hosting, content delivery, has never been so cheap, if you play simply throw a few paltry peso's, dollars, lira, rubles, credits, or what have you towards keeping it alive!

[Vulgar]

I just downloaded, the patches, guess I am going to try to get it all working again, will have to do a donation now! My download speed was 18-19 MBs, which was the limit of my connection, with is 150Mbs. With that kind of delivery speed, even if it cost a few dollars more a month, it is well worth it. The 4.0 patch which is 2.2 GB's, took roughly two minutes, beats the hell out of waiting 45 minutes and getting a broken connection and having to restart, which, by the way, would increase bandwidth costs. I will re-iterate, you will be hard pressed to find a better content delivery system, other than Amazon AWS S3.

[LuseKofte]

The man Asker for money, I trust it means he need money, I give money when payday.
It is cheap fun clod is and great Value for the money

[♣_Spiritus_♣]

What we need and may have a solution for (more on that later) is streaming around 10000 GB-30000 GB per month.

What ever happened with this? Are things still being sorted out or did things get solved?

I have a powerball ticket AND megamillions ticket in my wallet... perhaps greener pastures are on the way?

[JimmyBlonde]

I kind of agree that you guys should consider the "Team Daidalos" route of becoming official curators of CloD. Goodness knows you've earned it.

Maybe the guys making percentage from the sales of CloD because of your hard work could offer a bit of bandwidth in return?

[Throweight]

Can you sell advertising? Will Trackir and CH pay to display ads?

[Incog]

Wouldn't it be possible to host a torrent for all the TF patches?

Here, I made one : http://api.viglink.com/api/click?format=go&jsonp=vglnk_jsonp_14115059961096&drKey=1082&libId=0dc4e474-f2a0-46a2-9f57-94259207124d&loc=http%3A%2F%2Fs15.zetaboards.com%2FA414A_clan%2 Ftopic%2F6763660%2F1%2F%23new&v=1&out=http%3A%2F%2Fz4.ifrm.com%2F12414%2F111%2F0%2Fp 1074611%2Fall.zip.torrent&ref=http%3A%2F%2Fs15.zetaboards.com%2FA414A_clan%2 Fpost%2F&title=Semi-Finals&txt=%3Cimg%20src%3D%22http%3A%2F%2Fz4.ifrm.com%2Fs tatic%2F1%2Fattach.png%22%20alt%3D%22Attachments%3 A%22%3E%20all.zip.torrent%20(16.1%20KB)

[ATAG_Colander]

Wouldn't it be possible to host a torrent for all the TF patches?


Could be but the problem with torrents is that you need people sharing it and many people sharing it if you want a faster download.

[Incog]

Could be but the problem with torrents is that you need people sharing it and many people sharing it if you want a faster download.

Well yeah but then again the title of the thread is "ATAG and TF need your help". Just seeding that torrent can help relieve server load if everyone pitches in.

[II/JG77_RC]

I kind of agree that you guys should consider the "Team Daidalos" route of becoming official curators of CloD. Goodness knows you've earned it.

Maybe the guys making percentage from the sales of CloD because of your hard work could offer a bit of bandwidth in return?

+1

This is a great Idea, Team Fusion is the "Team Daidalos" of CLOD.

With out a doubt thanks to the great work TF has done, you guys have helped them sell many more copy's of Cliffs of Dover that otherwise would have never been sold since you stopped "the end of the game" with your MOD. You guys have essentially been making them money with no expectation of anything in return.

Has 1C ever been approached with this idea ?

[Continu0]

+1

This is a great Idea, Team Fusion is the "Team Daidalos" of CLOD.

With out a doubt thanks to the great work TF has done, you guys have helped them sell many more copy's of Cliffs of Dover that otherwise would have never been sold since you stopped "the end of the game" with your MOD. You guys have essentially been making them money with no expectation of anything in return.

Has 1C ever been approached with this idea ?

1C is still developing BoS. I don`t think they will set themselfes up another competitor as long as they are not absolutely sure that BoS will be sucessfull...:ind:

[Buddy]

Hi Bliss,

as a 65 year old, I have lapses of memory. I instructed PAYPAL to send a monthly donation to ATAG.

I suggest to you that there be a link to PAYPAL on the forum main page with instructions. This is to remind visitors they can donate through a secure and familiar service, PAYPAL.

Regards,

Buddy

[pjmack15]

Blood donated!

[PenGun]

Well, ideally sharing the patches via torrent would be great if the direct download is left for special cases.
Sadly this would mean that many people would have to be feeding the torrent at all times.

I leave my client up when I have something other than a movie on it. My Slackware64 14.2 iso has been up for quite a while, and I'd happily feed a torrent for the patches. It's a cheap way to contribute. I take a lot of my larger files that way.

I have noticed though, that DCS has a torrent that has no seeds and you are forced to use a direct DL. I gave up actually. ;)

How about a sticker for Torrent Support as well as Financial Support, or some other, basically free, incentive.