British Bombers? on Axis v Allies

[9./JG52 Jamz Dackel]

Fellas..Im not noticing half as many British Bombers now on the servers, surely it cant be me? Have you restricted the numbers..I dont always like coming down and getting into grass cutting territory, never a problem before as id go Bomber hunting if that was the case but all im seeing and reading now is German formations :(

I never noticed this before..

Can we have some more please? or am I missing them in the map rotation because of my GMT timezone maybe?

[III./ZG76_Chasing Fear]

You probably just have bad timing!

In one of the missions, there are no British bombers. The German bombers attack several targets, and the only Red objective is to try to keep them from hitting those ground targets. Here is another thread with a more thorough discussion:

http://theairtacticalassaultgroup.com/forum/showthread.php?2001-Mission-Error-M2-5-M4-5-and-Oye-Plage-Red-Targets&p=18068#post18068

-Fear

[9./JG52 Jamz Dackel]

Cant we just run maps so both sides are doing the same :recon:

Its OK if your on the side whos got the action but if your not then you can have a long night...like the whole nights worth of flying

Dont really care about the map not changing for hours if at least both sides are trying to do the same thing... :)

[III./ZG76_Chasing Fear]

I don't control the map rotation ... but there is usually plenty of action to be found if there are a reasonable number of players on the server. The red fighters will naturally gravitate towards the blue bombers. Makes 'em easy to find if you are a blue fighter. :)

-Fear

[Doc]

We do! The problem is that one group of persons will ask for one thing and an equal set of persons ask for just the exact opposite. lol This was done because everyone was complaining about all the low on the deck turn fights that were so prevalent on the server a couple of months ago and for many months prior. This is a little more accurate where the offense was German and defense was England. I have missions I don't care for either. But I just make the most of them anyways. It's hard being all things to all people.

[9./JG52 Jamz Dackel]

We do! The problem is that one group of persons will ask for one thing and an equal set of persons ask for just the exact opposite. lol This was done because everyone was complaining about all the low on the deck turn fights that were so prevalent on the server a couple of months ago and for many months prior. This is a little more accurate where the offense was German and defense was England. I have missions I don't care for either. But I just make the most of them anyways. It's hard being all things to all people.

What was done?... Who suggested taking away the British bombers at high Alt? lol And it was done to discourage low level turn fights :doh:.. It may be a bit more accurate but not a lot of Reds go high to engage the bombers (or maybe im just having a bit of bad luck and everytime i escort its the time when no reds decide to venture up i dunno) namely because of high alt performace I guess but to be honest I hardly got to see any before latest patch, im seeing loads of deck fighting going on and if i want to see any action i have to join them..

Not for me.. :ind:

Its an observation thats all and from the replys at least I wasnt imagining it

~S~

[ATAG_Snapper]

I try to engage bombers whenever I can. Usually the bombers have at least one (usually two) 109's flying high escort -- which is cool. This means that the Red fighter must get at least 2000 or 3000 feet ABOVE the bombers to properly intercept. Anything less is to be cannon fodder for the 109's or, more recently, the improved aim of the bombers' AI gunners. This is all good and I love the challenge, BTW. It DOES mean some serious climbing to 17 - 20 angels which takes the Brit fighters a bit of time so as not to burn out a Merlin, preferably inland so as not to get bounced. I do this willingly because of the historical aspect, and I keep one eye on my gauges, one eye looking for 109's, and one eye monitoring the radar reports.

Not all Brit pilots have the patience or willingness to do this. And if the call is out that Hawkinge/Lympne/Manston/Ramsgate is being vulched by invaders, that means some 109 and/or 110 pilots didn't have the patience to fly escort. Hence the low level fights -- hey, the kids are having fun! :D And many times I've abandoned that 20-minute climbout to jump into the fray! LOL

What would be neat to see more of are squads that are focused on escort/high interception. If the FM's are tweaked a bit (ie radiator drag in the Spits are a bit tough) then the rate of climb will improve enough (I hope) to encourage Red pilots to take the fight to 20 angels! :)

[Wolf]

I think the mission designers are just testing the waters. We have to work within the boundaries of the patch, current flight models and always keeping in mind the likes and dislikes of all playing to find a balance that sees lots of people on the server at once.

I may build a mission but have zero technical knowledge about the planes in game. But people play from all over the world and all of them range from noobs to real pilots and they all expect a different experience. You can imagine the requests, demands and other emails I get. Why this, why have you done that, why don't you do everything.....lol

Bomber groups are down cause the multi player code at the moment creates ghosts when lots of people get online.

So u have to build scaled missions or cap the Ai or work out just the right timing for them to spawn in and out so you don't overload the server with ai and create ghosts.

Take this: build a mission and say to spawn in 15 bombers every 30 mins from both sides. So in a normal flight you would have up to 4 groups or 60 ai bombers. That is fine with 3 or 4 people on line. Add 20+ humans all doing different things in game. Suddenly 60 bombers is way to many and ghosts all the time.

So in my mission now I have a scale system. This does two things. First keeps the focus on human v human and second keeps the AI at a safe level.
How does it work?

Every 5 mins there is a check to see how many humans are online. As the count goes up or down. The max ai limit changes and removes any ai that spawn above the limit.

0-12 people = max ai limit of 35 blue and 25 red. Total = 60
13-15 people = max ai limit of 25 blue and 20 red. Total = 45
16-20 people = max ai limit of 15 blue and 15 red. Total = 30
21+ people = max ai limit of 12 blue and 12 red. Total = 24

. It takes time and tweaking to get the right balance. Once the balance is in, we can then add more bomber flights of the type u like.

Thats how I work anyway. hope this helps

It's great to have the feedback as this helps to make it better, just not all requests can be done.

[Doc]

Jamz its a single mission in a rotation of several. They are not gone. The next mission will be with red bombers. :thumbsup: At least that is the way it has always been before. I see lots of Blens in my revi. :PP

[Catseye]

I try to engage bombers whenever I can. Usually the bombers have at least one (usually two) 109's flying high escort -- which is cool. This means that the Red fighter must get at least 2000 or 3000 feet ABOVE the bombers to properly intercept. Anything less is to be cannon fodder for the 109's or, more recently, the improved aim of the bombers' AI gunners. This is all good and I love the challenge, BTW. It DOES mean some serious climbing to 17 - 20 angels which takes the Brit fighters a bit of time so as not to burn out a Merlin, preferably inland so as not to get bounced. I do this willingly because of the historical aspect, and I keep one eye on my gauges, one eye looking for 109's, and one eye monitoring the radar reports.

Not all Brit pilots have the patience or willingness to do this. And if the call is out that Hawkinge/Lympne/Manston/Ramsgate is being vulched by invaders, that means some 109 and/or 110 pilots didn't have the patience to fly escort. Hence the low level fights -- hey, the kids are having fun! :D And many times I've abandoned that 20-minute climbout to jump into the fray! LOL

What would be neat to see more of are squads that are focused on escort/high interception. If the FM's are tweaked a bit (ie radiator drag in the Spits are a bit tough) then the rate of climb will improve enough (I hope) to encourage Red pilots to take the fight to 20 angels! :)

Snapper,
I like it with just me up there. Fresh pickin's. Even some 111 chaps. Sneaked up on an escort tonight - I think he was escort fixated and didn't see me. Those 109 jocks don't look behind when they're over France. :) Then I had some dancing to do with the bombers. Lovely glide down at 300 mph. to Re & Re. Hope to see you up there escorting. Watch out for the chum in the sun! :)
cheers

[9./JG52 Jamz Dackel]

Jamz its a single mission in a rotation of several. They are not gone. The next mission will be with red bombers. :thumbsup: At least that is the way it has always been before. I see lots of Blens in my revi. :PP

Like I said I'm just being unlucky then because these last couple of weeks flying again I'm not seeing hardly any...before that I was seeing formations all the time, same timezone, same server..

Can't stand having to come down low so I dont fall asleep in my chair, oh well I'll keep flying as usual but I have to say, pushing escape button and giving up is becoming more frequent :/

S Doc for the explanation

[Dutch]

I sort of know how you feel Jamz.

As it happens, my usual 'modus operandii' is to climb up to about 16,000ft and patrol up and down waiting for bomber formations to be 'announced' by 'Henry'.

Sometimes I can fly around for ages waiting for something to happen, sometimes I just don't find the buggers even when I've been told where they are. Sometimes I get bored and finally dive down toward Hawkinge, as usually there'll be something going on there, but sometimes not.

But as I said to a chap the other day, in reality any pilot would've been glad of an action free sortie, and we are 'simulating' the real experience to an extent. Far more than in old IL2 because of the size and scale of the map.

So, tune your radio (media player) to the station of your choice and hum along. I find that playing 1940s music in the background is immensely 'immersive'. Be careful though, it can lose you your life if you stop checking your six. :D

For the German side, try something like this;

[9./JG52 Jamz Dackel]

To be honest mate if i were flying the spit then i wouldnt have much of an issue asid be on the deck if i didnt find any bombers..and repeat :D

Im not going down deck hugging in a 109, i take this ride because of my style of flying not because its my fav bird...P-51 was my AC in 46 so im not a Blue/Axis everyone else is nerved guy lool...Its the plane (at the moment) that suits my flying and thats that :)

I guess we have a repetitive theme with this game at the mo..i dont really care for dogfight servers or arcade servers so im trying to enjoy the game for what it is untill were allowed to explore its potential so if no ones up high then so be it il take down some bombers, escorting is ok but i dont get to see much action when i do it and when youve got only 2 hours or so play time its not really the pinacle of excitment

[Dutch]

Thet's why I like the 'Channel Command' mission so much. There's tons going on, and you can call up missions as required to an extent. It's running now actually, so I might have to dash to the shops quick and get stuck in! :D

[9./JG52 Jamz Dackel]

Thet's why I like the 'Channel Command' mission so much. There's tons going on, and you can call up missions as required to an extent. It's running now actually, so I might have to dash to the shops quick and get stuck in! :D

Beer time for me..Unfortunately I live in one of the busiest streets in my City, the Pub is calling

[9./JG52 Hans Gruber]

I have to say that the mission with the large waves of German bombers is my favorite on ATAG. Yesterday myself & Vogler escorted a flight of DO-17's from start to finish and had to fight off about a dozen attackers and it was probably one of the better experiences I've ever had on the server. The only problem is the bombers seem to loiter forever over England after dropping their bombs. Everytime we thought they would be making the turn home they went the other way, Im thinking there might be an error in their flight path.

Also, it would be great if there was more time between bomber waves so those who like to escort could land & rearm/refuel before the next wave arrives. As it is now the next wave is announced while the previous is still deep over England.

[Doc]

I agree I love the mission. I will coordinate getting together to get up and escort the next flight out as the one out over England should have time to come back, land, rearm and refuel and take a leak. Then you can have time to form up with a fresh thermos of coffee and escort the next as we come back and do the same. Then its a process of rinse and repeat. :thumbsup:

[ATAG_Bliss]

I have to say that the mission with the large waves of German bombers is my favorite on ATAG. Yesterday myself & Vogler escorted a flight of DO-17's from start to finish and had to fight off about a dozen attackers and it was probably one of the better experiences I've ever had on the server. The only problem is the bombers seem to loiter forever over England after dropping their bombs. Everytime we thought they would be making the turn home they went the other way, Im thinking there might be an error in their flight path.

Also, it would be great if there was more time between bomber waves so those who like to escort could land & rearm/refuel before the next wave arrives. As it is now the next wave is announced while the previous is still deep over England.

Damn - they are still loitering :(. I thought I had that fixed. Any chance you happen to remember what target your escorted group went after? It would help in finding the bad group.

As far as the frequency of escorting I was thing the same. Started of at every 30 minutes having a wave comer over. What do you think would be a good time - every 45 minutes instead?

Thanks for the feedback!

Edit: The smart people in the group are working on a way to do an I game rearm/refuel. So that might actually be possible soon :D - we'll make an announcement on the command to use / how to do it at a later date if all goes well.

[III./ZG76_Keller]

I'm not sure that they are loitering the way they used to, from what you told me Biss they drop their bombs then make a wide turn to head for home.

For example; if the bombers are heading to F9 they fly direct Wissant to Folkestone, turn for target, drop, head further West, make a gradual left turn, fly back over Folkestone and head for home.

[9./JG52 Hans Gruber]

From what I could tell they all were bombing Hawkinge or at least that was the point at which they turned. The JU-88's would turn west down to Ashford, loop around and come back up the coast from Littlestone to Dover before finally turning to France. The DO-17's would turn east at Hawkinge to Dover then Manston, out over the North Sea, then head south back over Manston to Dover before turning home. If their flight paths were a little more direct I think a wave every 45 minutes or hour would be fine. Maybe experiment and bump their numbers up to 16 to see if the new graphics engine can handle it.