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♣_Spiritus_♣
May-26-2017, 16:16
As May comes to a close, TFS is pushing closer and closer to finishing up the next patch for the community. As things start to come together and testing begins, we wanted to reach out and give everyone somewhat of a "change log" of sorts about what to expect with 4.5. This list isn't everything nor is it finalized (see last week's post) with things possibly being added if time allows.

The amount of work that has been done is impressive and the man hours involved countless. TFS sees 4.5 as what we hope will be a definitive and final version of the original Cliffs of Dover, with additional aircraft, bugfixes, and improvements which bring the game up to the level the original developers had hoped for.

That said, here is a sample of what to expect with patch 4.5.

CODE:

- Complete rewrite of TFS mods to the source code.

- Enabling DX11

- Aircraft mirrors enabled

CORRECTED BUGS:

- Distant rivers looking like lakes

- Flashing plexiglass from bombers, known as the “Christmas tree effect”.

- Drained the three gigantic flooded water areas (#590) in France, aka known as "The Swimming Pools” @ AV02, BC16, BD14

- Grandvillier Airdrome @ BC07 corrected to show all airfield hangers

- Relly Norrante Fontes @ BF17 corrected to show all blast pens and Isbergues rail station.

- Somewhere in France removed unconnected railway buffer.

- Marquise West @ BA20 corrected to show 49 new objects, on airfield and nearby village.

- Campagne Les Guines @ BB20 corrected to show all 64 objects instead of 2 at airfield.

- East of St Tricat, German camp discovered and now showing.

- Frethun, railway station discovered and now showing.

- Spitfire I/IA/IIA cockpit fix for radiator lever. 29118

- Blenheim cockpit and bombardier cabin switches added. 29119 29120

- Field modded Hurricane bomb switches added to cockpit.

- Hurricane wooden trim wheel corrected

EFFECTS: (Nearly all “particle effects” have been reworked, below are some)

- Engine damage smokes

- Exhaust flames

- Oil leaks

- Dust/Dirt

- Muzzle flashes

- Shell casings

- Weapon smoke

- Projectile impacts on all surfaces

- Tracer effects

- De Wilde impact flashes

- Bomb/Artillery explosions

- Vehicle explosions

- Flak effects

- Fuel fires

- Fuel explosions

- Aircraft crash explosions/fires

- Environmental smoke

- Chimney smoke

- Ship wakes


SOUND:

- Sound catalogs being worked to hopefully provide great improvements for 4.5


TERRAIN:

-New English landscape.

-New French landscape.

- New shaders

NEW FLYABLE AIRCRAFT:

- Beaufighter 1F Dayfighter (early) and 1NF Nightfighter (early) with Hercules III engine (The Beaufighter 1C with Hercules IX will not appear until TF 5.0).

- Bf-110C-6 anti-shipping and ground attack version, with 30mm cannon fuselage pod. 28426 28427

- Bf-110C-4B, (early ground attack) with low altitude optimized DB601Aa engines.

- Hurricane I Rotol Fighter-Bomber fitted with eight, 40 pound bombs. Note: This aircraft can be definitively confirmed to have been used in the Desert and from Malta... but so far there has been no confirmation it was used on the Channel Front. We decided to include it in TF 4.5 instead of TF 5.0 for two reasons... 1) It would probably be missed in all the excitement over the new aircraft in TF 5.0... (there will be a Fighter-Bomber version of the Hurri IIB in TF 5.0) and 2) It will give mission builders on the Channel map the opportunity to build campaigns with fighter-bombers on both sides. If users prefer not to include the aircraft, that is their choice. 28428

- Blenheim IV, IVF (Late) with twin Browning rear turret. Bomb load additions include eight, 40 pound fuselage mounted bombs. Blenheim IV also has the ability of caring at least 2, possibly 4 SBC’s in the main bay, each holding six 40 pound bombs. 28429
28430

- Armed Tiger Moths variants, one with four 25 lb bombs, one with wing-mount .303 Vickers, and one with cockpit mount Czech 7.92mm firing through prop. We included the version with the bombs because it was a historical BoB aircraft... a last resort to be used if the Germans landed. The other two are included because we believe players will enjoy the opportunity to dogfight with a biplane... we hope to see all Tiger Moth maps as short fun missions.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h6XSpOFWa0Q


FM/DM FIXES:

- Spitfire fire (or lack of) bug corrected

- Re-mapped power physics .dll which corrects the engine bug, Spit MkIIA brakes/windmilling prop/restart, Tiger moth rudder trim, and numerous, numerous other corrections!


MISCELLANEOUS:

- Tom's Air Force Bases/Maps

- New pilot uniforms and accessories

SKINS:

More than a handful of new skins for Channel aircraft. Here is one of the Beaufighter. (Reached my MB limit!)

28431

28432

BlueBirdX
May-26-2017, 16:56
WOW
Thanks a million, TF

Maru
May-26-2017, 17:04
Cant wait for this!! :thumbsup:

DUI
May-26-2017, 17:05
This is great news! Very much looking forward to TF 4.5 and its new content, features and bug fixes! :gourmet:

The only thing missing to make this Friday update even better would have been an estimated release date. Say "two weeks"..?

ATAG_Colander
May-26-2017, 17:09
an estimated release date.

Need to ask?
two weeks, for sure :)

69th_LazyE
May-26-2017, 17:33
This is so amazing! Love the extra aircraft/variants in this free 4.5 version! Looking very forward to the beufighter, hurricane fighter/bomber, and Blenheim upgrades. Well done!


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

Kendy for the State
May-26-2017, 17:34
Waiting with bated breath!

Sent from my XT1635-01 using Tapatalk

ATAG_Vampire
May-26-2017, 17:47
Thanks for the update SM and what an update!

The list of new things just gets better.

Hurrie bombers, Bf110s with 30mm cannon, Blennies with many more bombs and the Beaufigher 1F & 1NF to name but a few.

"Keeping the Dream Alive" is just about to be "Making the Dream Come True".

Thanks to everyone at TFS for the hard work and dedication and for everything that you give to this community. :dthumb:

o7 :salute:

rel4y
May-26-2017, 17:58
Beaufighter and BF 110 C-6, awesome!! You TF guys are simply badass! :salute:

69th_Zeb
May-26-2017, 18:01
Beaufighters early! Yes!

Just finished up Andrew Thomas' Beaufighter Aces of WW2 to get amped up.

Along the lines of the book, I noticed a large chunk of operations both in the channel and north Africa were night-time.
Sooo....for 6.0 Wishes...if I may be so rude.
Any chance we will see in the far distant future a brutal, unmarketable to the masses, hardcore mode that adds night radar ops (Beau/BF110s)? It would be rather sadistic, but with spectacular night-time explosions after hard work (accounts being quite dramatic), it might prove to be interesting.

Some of the thoughts I had were:

-Teaming up with GCI (Ground Control Intercept) stations
-Flying scattered night-time IFR with steam gauges
-Running an onboard AI (Air Intercept) radar.

Maybe it has already been discussed. Anyways, don't want to push or anything.

Very grateful for the hard work so far. No problem from my end if ya'll charge for the update either. :thumbsup:

9./JG52_Meyer
May-26-2017, 18:17
Great update many thanks, can't wait especially for the density bug to be fixed

Hals und beinbruch

ATAG_Ribbs
May-26-2017, 18:25
Just amazing!! This content you are planning to include will change the way the current game and maps play out! I can't wait! Great update SM!

Don_Quijote
May-26-2017, 18:26
Thank you so much!This must be the result of countless hours of work !:salute:

GERMANWOLF
May-26-2017, 18:44
Great job! But what about the BF109F ?? Was it not planned?:recon:

JG4_Thorwald
May-26-2017, 18:48
This reads really great, Spiritus.:thumbsup:
Thanks to the whole TeamFusion team. I'm really curious ...
I hope it does not take too long...

ATAG_Flare
May-26-2017, 18:55
Great job! But what about the BF109F ?? Was it not planned?:recon:

For 5.0 probably.

This update looks awesome! Can't wait to try it out. Will that 30mm be able to take out the medium tankers? I'm excited for this! And the beaufighter! Finally we will be able to use 20mm cannons as the RAF! Thanks a lot for the update, SM!

ATAG_Ezzie
May-26-2017, 19:12
Excellent update - thanks SM and TFS

Ezzie

Lythronax
May-26-2017, 19:30
When I first read the article I was still excited that 4.5 is nearing completion, but it seemed a bit boring with what I thought were just new variants of pre-existing aircraft... but I read the Beaufighter IF as the Blenheim IF at first XD. I am incredibly excited, and a HUGE thanks to TFS for keeping the dream alive :)

ATAG_Freya
May-26-2017, 19:54
Wow! I am exite! Great update. Really love that top b-fighter skin, cheers to the creator. Thanks TFS!

:bravo:

:thumbsup:

QB.Creep
May-26-2017, 20:35
This sounds really awesome!! Probably a dumb question, but I have seen talk of 5.0 - is that still something that is in the works, or is 4.5 going to be the final release for CLOD? If 5.0 is still a thing, what is the planned feature set for that release?

Again, sorry if this is a dumb question that has been answered elsewhere.

Sent from my A0001 using Tapatalk

ATAG_Lewis
May-26-2017, 20:52
Thanks fellas....

I'm going weak at the knees and I've started dribbling...

Always a pleasure and an emotional experience when I read an update...

Top Bananas!

and thanks again fellas for your commitment and hard work...~S~

...Lew...

Bonditaria
May-26-2017, 21:12
Fabulous!

Suggestion: a new option in confuser.ini...

[MOD]
ZoomSpeed=8
GameLanguage=
ExtendCloudsDistance=yes
MineBlockchainCoinsForTeamFusionSimulations=yes

Also, please add Hurricane bombers to 'New Dawn Fades' as soon as possible!

:thumbsup:

Ohms
May-26-2017, 21:20
This sounds really awesome!! Probably a dumb question, but I have seen talk of 5.0 - is that still something that is in the works, or is 4.5 going to be the final release for CLOD? If 5.0 is still a thing, what is the planned feature set for that release?

Again, sorry if this is a dumb question that has been answered elsewhere.

Sent from my A0001 using Tapatalk

5.0 is coming later ,4.5 is to hold us over until 5.0 arrives.:)

RAF74_Buzzsaw
May-26-2017, 21:57
This sounds really awesome!! Probably a dumb question, but I have seen talk of 5.0 - is that still something that is in the works, or is 4.5 going to be the final release for CLOD? If 5.0 is still a thing, what is the planned feature set for that release?

Again, sorry if this is a dumb question that has been answered elsewhere.

Sent from my A0001 using Tapatalk

TF 4.5 is the re-working and re-issue of CLIFFS OF DOVER.

TF 5.0 will introduce an entirely new Theater... North Africa 1940-1941... and it will update CoD to 1941.

Diamondaxe
May-26-2017, 21:58
30 mm cannon..... this was my only true request.....as I said earlier.....it's inclusion will break the game,,,,,spits and hurries abound but not for long....all will fall to my glorious 30mm cannon.....or as i like to call it....the beaufighter disassembly device.

BOO
May-27-2017, 01:23
This is all great .

No Wellington in 4.5 though. I get that. Blennis and Beaus suit the BOB daytime and something to look forward to for 5.0.

Just checking though -- it is still there somewhere isn't it?

Cybermat47
May-27-2017, 03:35
I hope that tanks are made more difficult to destroy. At the moment, it's possible to destroy Matildas with the Bf-109 E-4's 20mms.

DerDa
May-27-2017, 04:26
So much more than I expected for 4.5!!!

THANK YOU!!!


And finally the Tiger Moth with teeth!
That's definetely just the thing for me :-)

Trooper117
May-27-2017, 06:49
Such a great time to be a flight simmer!

Well done all... really looking forward to the 'new' CloD :)

SD_MBen
May-27-2017, 07:40
The very best!

I can not wait to get a life playing this sim!

Ben

\Hawk/
May-27-2017, 08:27
Thank you so so much TFS!
Not to sound ungrateful, any word on rain, lightning in the future?
Either way, totally stoked about the update!

Sent from my SM-N920C using Tapatalk

HurricaneHarvest
May-27-2017, 08:28
Partical Effects, like smoke, dust etc can be real FPS killers, not to sure why, they are just 2D picture sprites ?

Great work.

keeno
May-27-2017, 11:08
Oh My God!!!!

Thanks to all involved past and present. Hard to believe that video of the armed tiger moth was nearly 2 years ago!!!!

A long wait, worth waiting for.


Cheers

ATAG_Marlow
May-27-2017, 12:29
I am in complete awe of TFS and what they are achieving on our behalf. Like everybody else, I am agog with excitement! Thanks, Guys! :thumbsup: :D :)

aus
May-27-2017, 13:34
Team Fusion Simulations does not disappoint.

But then I knew this would be the case from a long time ago.

Tally ho!!!

Horrido!!!!

<s!> :salute:

Dirty
May-27-2017, 15:16
Finally fighter bombers for both sides! Christmas comes early this year!

ATAG_Dave
May-27-2017, 18:56
Thanks for the update SM and thanks to all at TFS past present and future for the hard work.

Tiger moth dogfight maps??!! Blimey I might have to dust off the joystick and fly again just for that :thumbsup:

S!

ATAG_Highseas
May-27-2017, 20:13
eeeekkk !!!!!!!!

ATAG_Highseas
May-27-2017, 20:16
I might have to dust off the joystick and fly again

Damn straight Sonny Jim.

(Dave)

Get back in your plane dammit

Blitzen
May-27-2017, 20:42
The day it comes out a support check from me will be coming your way!:ilike:

ATAG_SKUD
May-27-2017, 20:59
I see one big problem this update is going to cause....




How are we going to get 300 people on the server?:)

BOO
May-28-2017, 03:04
Hi

Will any of the upcoming features stop or reduce the "prop Stutters" and small micro stutters I currently experience? Seem its mainly where thar be ships and AI.

Regards

BOO

Kling
May-28-2017, 03:17
Hi

Will any of the upcoming features stop or reduce the "prop Stutters" and small micro stutters I currently experience? Seem its mainly where thar be ships and AI.

Regards

BOO

Hm i never had that. What is your system?

BOO
May-28-2017, 03:47
Hm i never had that. What is your system?

Hello Kling

Win10, ASUS Z170 Pro Gaming MB, GTX 1060, 8 GB Vengence RAM. I have the operating system on one SSD and the game on a second SSD. I use an ED pro and an MSFF Sidewinder plus a Warthog Throttle and Crosswinds. I play at 1080P with adaptive Vsync selected in the NVCP.

By temporarily switching off the Win Defender AV I can reduce the effect a touch (perhaps its a placebo).

It seems to be potentially something resulting from vsync but ive not studied it too closely to ascertain for sure. Seem to be much more apparent on AI operating Servers but its not something I can say is related to "popping in" like the warping ships.

Its most apparent manifesttation is seen but the prop very briefly stopping/stuttering. Without this I think id be hard pushed to notice anything was happening.

Cheers

BOO

ATAG_Ezzie
May-28-2017, 04:05
Hello Kling

Win10, ASUS Z170 Pro Gaming MB, GTX 1060, 8 GB Vengence RAM. I have the operating system on one SSD and the game on a second SSD. I use an ED pro and an MSFF Sidewinder plus a Warthog Throttle and Crosswinds. I play at 1080P with adaptive Vsync selected in the NVCP.

By temporarily switching off the Win Defender AV I can reduce the effect a touch (perhaps its a placebo).

It seems to be potentially something resulting from vsync but ive not studied it too closely to ascertain for sure. Seem to be much more apparent on AI operating Servers but its not something I can say is related to "popping in" like the warping ships.

Its most apparent manifesttation is seen but the prop very briefly stopping/stuttering. Without this I think id be hard pushed to notice anything was happening.

Cheers

BOO

Hey Boo - i used to get the propellor stopping as well. On one of the threads on the forums someone posted a fix to stop it. I think it might have been the anthromorphic (excuse spelling) or something but i cant remember exactly. It was something in the game settings and it did the trick. Have t seen them since

If i can remember the exact fix i will update this.

Edit - try the anti- epilepsy setting.

Ezzie

BOO
May-28-2017, 04:24
Hi Ezzie - thanks

When I first started I used the AE and whilst it smooths stuff out I lost all prop effects. As in I may have well be flying a jet. Tried the windows screen too to do away with the vsync but performance over objects was patchy. I like me prop but I don't like stutters so perhaps this is the only way around for me. I'm sure I had smoother play in the past though when I was on Win7 and 3rd party core unlockers.

Thanks

BOO

Ekko
May-28-2017, 04:50
Thank you S/M
Thank you TFS

♣_Spiritus_♣
May-28-2017, 18:21
@Booster, the Wellington is still planned for 5.0, not 4.5.

9./JG52 gr00ve
May-28-2017, 19:03
good stuff! :thumbsup:

air density bug fixed? cant find that line in patch details.

Kling
May-28-2017, 19:28
good stuff! :thumbsup:

air density bug fixed? cant find that line in patch details.

Yes it is thanks to that, that the FMs can be fixed ;)

7./JG26_SMOKEJUMPER
May-28-2017, 19:41
Hi,

Has the Hurricane fuel tank explosion where it goes out after been corrected?

Will we ever explode and run the risk of hitting parts in the future you think?

Last one for now; was the Force Feedback cannon shake been corrected?

Thanks!

Babar89
May-29-2017, 08:19
Thanks for the update and thanks to all at TF for the hard work! :)

PreyStalker
May-29-2017, 08:54
Oh why did you have to make it even better ???

How is a person supposed to get things done and have a social life if they spend all their time flying CLOD ???

Can I bill TFS for the new trousers I'm having to buy to fit my CLOD belly into ???

But thanks anyway, can't wait !

:thumbsup:

rmiles
May-29-2017, 10:37
Really hyped for this!!!

Looking forward to flying the Spitty VB, Ground-Attack Hurri, Beaufighter, and the whole lot!

:thumbsup::D:salute::)

9./JG52_Meyer
May-29-2017, 10:42
Yes it is thanks to that, that the FMs can be fixed ;)

Excellent! There are a few Astronauts we are looking forward to meeting in the ionosphere 1st chance we get. :devilish:

Hals und beinbruch

rmiles
May-29-2017, 10:45
Excellent! There are a few Astronauts we are looking forward to meeting in the ionosphere 1st chance get. :devilish:

Hals und beinbruch

LOL! I think, realistically, you'll find yourself burning down to Earth! :)

ATAG_Highseas
May-29-2017, 11:01
LOL! I think, realistically, you'll find yourself burning down to Earth! :)

I know I will !!

BOO
May-29-2017, 12:19
LOL! I think, realistically, you'll find yourself burning down to Earth! :)

er....................nope..............there are no words...............

ATAG_Colander
May-29-2017, 12:26
How is a person supposed to get things done and have a social life if they spend all their time flying CLOD ???


The same way those on TFS... Don't get other things done or have a social life.

jcenzano
May-29-2017, 15:55
Awesomeness...

Sent from my E5823 using Tapatalk

Swoop
May-29-2017, 17:44
Thanks SM and TFS, really looking forward to seeing all the fine work that's been put into 4.5.

With DX11, maybe a VR patch? Flying BOS with the rift has made that sim so much more immersive, especially for offline campaigns (flying the excellent 190 "Butcher" right now and the Yak1 on order). Could also be another source of income creating these scripted offline campaigns just like 1C are doing.

TWC_Fatal_Error
May-29-2017, 18:54
TY TFS very happy about all the new toys and it sounds like you guys are getting there fast now so glad for the community. I do have a question though, is vaporloc bug where an aircraft is obscured by a column of vapor at a certain point in a climb one of those particle fixes yet to come ? Again my sincere Thanks <S> Fatal

RAF74_Buzzsaw
May-29-2017, 20:00
With DX11, maybe a VR patch?

VR is not ready to be implemented in CoD.

Our Coder tried an Alpha implementation of VR in TF 4.312 which was not considered sufficiently workable... only for those who like 'experiments' and who don't mind getting physically ill when they fly over London and the framerate drops to 20 fps.

It cannot be considered in any way an official working version. That will have to wait till later.

For more details, see this thread:

https://theairtacticalassaultgroup.com/forum/showthread.php?t=21356&highlight=Oculus+Rift

ATAG_Vortex
May-30-2017, 07:49
~S~ Buzzsaw

Awesome! I really cannot wait for this! Great news!

One question I have though, will the map be updated to include things such as railways and all the place name mistakes rectified?

I did see a thread once, not on this forum, with all the map issues people had found.

Many thanks once again!

ATAG_Dave
May-30-2017, 08:03
VR is not ready to be implemented in CoD.

Our Coder tried an Alpha implementation of VR in TF 4.312 which was not considered sufficiently workable... only for those who like 'experiments' and who don't mind getting physically ill when they fly over London and the framerate drops to 20 fps.

It cannot be considered in any way an official working version. That will have to wait till later.

For more details, see this thread:

https://theairtacticalassaultgroup.com/forum/showthread.php?t=21356&highlight=Oculus+Rift

Is VR support still a possibility for TF5.0 or is it likely to be in a version later than TF5.0?

ATAG_Colander
May-30-2017, 09:21
Is VR support still a possibility for TF5.0 or is it likely to be in a version later than TF5.0?

Is in the queue but first the FPS need to be brought to decent levels, otherwise it will be a :sick: party

Swoop
May-31-2017, 12:43
Fair enough, hopefully with DX11, this will help with an improvement in performance? BOS is very nice in VR since DX11.

IIJG27Rich
May-31-2017, 13:03
I'm just speaking for myself here but from what I've been told Dx11 will improve performance. What I'm going to do is replace my 20" monitor with a 24" :)

rince77
Jun-01-2017, 04:31
Best news in years!:)

As a single player I'm hoping the all important ai fixes will be included, for " the level the original developers had hoped for" wont be realised without them.

many thanks for your perseverance over the years .:salute::salute::salute:

Kling
Jun-01-2017, 05:55
TY TFS very happy about all the new toys and it sounds like you guys are getting there fast now so glad for the community. I do have a question though, is vaporloc bug where an aircraft is obscured by a column of vapor at a certain point in a climb one of those particle fixes yet to come ? Again my sincere Thanks <S> Fatal

I see this bug sometimes and the only common denominator I have seen is actually not climbing but high angle of attack. The only time I see this bug, often from Hurricanes, the plane has a high angle of attack and slow speed.
Its a hard bug to catch because you dont see it offline and you see it very seldom online... :/

the_soupdragon
Jun-01-2017, 07:01
Great list but, do the sound fixes include radio calls? #hoping :)

Cheers
SD

CG_Justin
Jun-01-2017, 08:59
Ok, I have not been flying CLoD as much as I should, but now I'm getting really excited for this! This sim has soooo much previously untapped potential that is finally coming to fruition thanks to this team. I can't wait for this update, but when it comes to N. Africa.....TAKE MY MONEY!!! :flying2:

ATAG_Ribbs
Jun-01-2017, 09:52
I feel like the ground war in the next theater is going to be epic. It would be so cool it the tank damage models were someday brought up to a higher level. I know it's not a tank sim..but it would be awesome.

Topgum
Jun-02-2017, 10:41
OOOOOOOOPS, yet one week ago and I miss this great & important update! Will I miss the release of 4.5, too? :doh:
Anyway, thanks Spirit and thanks to TFS for the great work keeping the dream alive and full filling them.:salute:
4.5 apparently offers apparently much more that I personally expected. The whole range from Tigermoth to Beaufighter 'n stuff is awesome.:stunned:

Just a little question concerning the corrected bugs: Is the not yet animated trim wheel of the Spit variants included too?

TFS rules, salute :thumbsup:

1lokos
Jun-02-2017, 12:16
Just a little question concerning the corrected bugs: Is the not yet animated trim wheel of the Spit variants included too?


Yes, animated trim wheels, animated brake wheel and that "Lubber Line" in P-8. :D

ATAG_Colander
Jun-02-2017, 12:41
Yes, animated trim wheels, animated brake wheel and that "Lubber Line" in P-8. :D

You are going to be the happiest man on earth once the Lubber Line is corrected :D

farley
Jun-02-2017, 12:46
You are going to be the happiest man on earth once the Lubber Line is corrected :D

I think he will be!:D

DerDa
Jun-02-2017, 12:52
When 4.5 comes the radiant smile of all CloDers will be seen even from EGS8p7
Supernova style.

BOO
Jun-02-2017, 13:19
lokos lives on earth?

ATAG_Highseas
Jun-02-2017, 14:33
Maybe..... but that reference was to Colanders home galaxy.

ATAG_Colander
Jun-02-2017, 14:36
http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-J4EiMBh5jF0/UcL8JEEoi3I/AAAAAAAAEa8/Oy9UUeTizSs/s640/E9.gif

ATAG_Ribbs
Jun-02-2017, 15:36
Yes!!!!! Drivable submarines!! 5.0!!! Thank you thank you! Colander you're the man!!

Look guys that's clearly a submarine port window!

ATAG_Colander
Jun-02-2017, 16:03
Look guys that's clearly a submarine port window!

Nope, is starboard.

ATAG_Ribbs
Jun-02-2017, 17:00
Damn!.. guess we will have to wait for 7.0:grrr::grrr::grrr:

ATAG_Highseas
Jun-02-2017, 18:32
Nope, is starboard.

Stargate.

at least in UK speak.

Probably work the same way though. Looks like the same parts too (at least from the outside).

EAF331 Starfire
Jun-03-2017, 02:01
NEW FLYABLE AIRCRAFT:

- Beaufighter 1F Dayfighter (early) and 1NF Nightfighter (early) with Hercules III engine (The Beaufighter 1C with Hercules IX will not appear until TF 5.0).




First of all. I am looking forward to see what TFS can do with the right access to the source code. From what I have seen without it I have been amazed.

With the risk of getting a close and deep shave (with a large knife) below my chin, I would like to direct TFS attention to the naming convention of the Beaufighter versions which I think might be wrong as I have run into several sources claiming that the Ic major difference are extra fueltanks and nav equipment.

Although I don't have any books personally to support my claim I found an access into one on Google. The rest is from the not so reliable internet.



Description: Pilot's Notes for Beaufighter Marks IC and IF Two Hercules III or XI Engines

(http://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/details/r/C3306119>)




The Mk. I that was build/equipped as nighfighters designated 1F initially. Not NF.
The Costal version was named Mk. Ic and differed only in an extended fueltank and internal equipment. Not engine




Bristol Beaufighter I: First production contract placed July 1939, for 300 aircraft (including the four prototypes) with 1,400 hp Hercules Ills. First 50 armed with four 20-mm Hispano cannon in nose; subsequent aircraft also had six 0.303-in (7.7-mm) guns in wings; Hercules XI engines in last 120 Filton-built Mk Is.

Mk IC
The Mk IC was developed for Coastal Command duties. The main difference at this early stage was that the Mk IC was equipped with 50 gallon “slipper” fuel tanks, developed for the Vickers Wellington. The aircraft was also equipped with a navigator’s table and direction finding equipment, essential for long range duties over the sea. The first Mk ICs entered service with No. 242 Squadron from March 1941, moving to the Mediterranean in May.
http://www.historyofwar.org/articles/weapons_beaufighter_variants.html




http://www.europeanaf.org/shared/Starfire/Temp/Beufighteaces.JPG
Source: Beufighter Aces (Book)





Bristol Beaufighter I: First production contract placed July 1939, for 300 aircraft (including the four prototypes) with 1,400 hp Hercules Ills. First 50 armed with four 20-mm Hispano cannon in nose; subsequent aircraft also had six 0.303-in (7.7-mm) guns in wings; Hercules XI engines in last 120 Filton-built Mk Is. Deliveries to RAF began July 27, 1940, initial deliveries being to Nos 25, 29, 219, 600 and 604 Squadrons. Most fitted with AI Mk IV 'arrowhead' radar for night-fighting role in retrospective programme starting September 1940. During 1941, Bristol Beaufighter Is adopted for Coastal Command service with long-range fuel tanks in place of wing guns and revised crew arrangements; deliveries began to No 252 Sqn in March 1942. Coastal Command version subsequently designated Mk 1C and Fighter Command version Mk IF. Production totals, 272 Mk IF and 78 Mk 1C at Filton, 240 Mk IF by MAP caption Factory at Weston-super-Mare; 25 IF and 300 Mk 1C by Fairey at Stockport including 72 Mk 1C supplied to RAAF, of which one re-engined in Australia with 1,600 hp Wright GR-2600-A5B radials, and flown in August 1944. First operational with No 30 Sqn, RAAF, in September 1942.
http://www.airpages.ru/eng/uk/boif.shtml


EDIT

The "Pilot's Notes for Beaufighter Marks IC and IF Two Hercules III or XI Engines" does not mention a Hercules Engine Mk. IX, just the Mk. XI.

Ill can share the Pilots Notes if you PM me.

kashiide
Jun-03-2017, 03:15
You are right about the NF naming,it never existed

Poltava
Jun-03-2017, 06:53
Excellent news! Keep up your GREAT work! Waiting patiently ... :thumbsup:

Erpr.Gr.210_Mölders
Jun-03-2017, 09:20
Thanks for your work and for the update, astonishing indeed!

I sincerely hope, somehow, that the new patch will fix the RAF aircraft climb and energy retention rates because actually they are flying rockets and not WW2 planes....com'on guys...I know the Spitfire is the best plane ever made, is invincible and that the German ones are made to act as a good antagonist that at the end must be shoot down...but come on guys...also a blind will notice that actually RAF planes have totally unbelievable climb rates.
They climb from a flat turn from the top of the sky like the Columbia, engines that continues to work also in a vertical or negative G dive, aircraft that flies as per normal with missing wings and radiators perforated for ages...
New maps, new aircraft, etc are all great stuffs but for God sake, if possible, fix the RAF planes FM and DM...

...Or to see the thing on the other side if the Spitfire is modelled actually close to its real counterpart in the game....it means that in the 109s there is something very very wrong.

Salute!!!

BOO
Jun-03-2017, 14:15
Thanks for your work and for the update, astonishing indeed!

I sincerely hope, somehow, that the new patch will fix the RAF aircraft climb and energy retention rates because actually they are flying rockets and not WW2 planes....com'on guys...I know the Spitfire is the best plane ever made, is invincible and that the German ones are made to act as a good antagonist that at the end must be shoot down...but come on guys...also a blind will notice that actually RAF planes have totally unbelievable climb rates.
They climb from a flat turn from the top of the sky like the Columbia, engines that continues to work also in a vertical or negative G dive, aircraft that flies as per normal with missing wings and radiators perforated for ages...
New maps, new aircraft, etc are all great stuffs but for God sake, if possible, fix the RAF planes FM and DM...

...Or to see the thing on the other side if the Spitfire is modelled actually close to its real counterpart in the game....it means that in the 109s there is something very very wrong.

Salute!!!

Deleted

Bonditaria
Jun-03-2017, 14:22
Thanks for your work and for the update, astonishing indeed!

I sincerely hope, somehow, that the new patch will fix the RAF aircraft climb and energy retention rates because actually they are flying rockets and not WW2 planes....com'on guys...I know the Spitfire is the best plane ever made, is invincible and that the German ones are made to act as a good antagonist that at the end must be shoot down...but come on guys...also a blind will notice that actually RAF planes have totally unbelievable climb rates.
They climb from a flat turn from the top of the sky like the Columbia, engines that continues to work also in a vertical or negative G dive, aircraft that flies as per normal with missing wings and radiators perforated for ages...
New maps, new aircraft, etc are all great stuffs but for God sake, if possible, fix the RAF planes FM and DM...

...Or to see the thing on the other side if the Spitfire is modelled actually close to its real counterpart in the game....it means that in the 109s there is something very very wrong.

Salute!!!

That's interesting, can you share a track of you flying the moves you think you shoudn't be able to achieve? That would be a great help understanding what you're objecting to exactly.

RAF74_Buzzsaw
Jun-03-2017, 15:37
Actually, speaking objectively, the 109E-4N is actually the best plane in the game by a long way.

And anyone who flys the 109's strictly in the way they are intended to be flown, (i.e., climb to altitude, use dive and zoom tactics) is in fact, almost invulnerable to being shot down. Of course, that requires discipline and focus.

The only significant issue is their performance at extremely high altitudes, ie. 27,000 ft/8000 meters or higher... and even up there, a 109 pilot in danger can simply dive away if he gets in danger.

And we expect to fix those high altitude problems in TF 4.5.

My recommendation is you try flying the Spitfire for a while against some good 109 pilots. Karaya for example... or a Squad who understands team tactics.

Perhaps the real source of your concern is the fact the Blue side is sometimes outnumbered at particular times of the day, and being outnumbered is definitely a handicap. I am always surprised when Blue is outnumbered... I guess some people have a preference for the Red side... but a lot are under the mistaken impression the Spits are better... they are not. They are easier to fly... but if effort is invested in learning the strong points of the 109 and flying to those strengths, then a Blue sider can find himself very successful.


Thanks for your work and for the update, astonishing indeed!

I sincerely hope, somehow, that the new patch will fix the RAF aircraft climb and energy retention rates because actually they are flying rockets and not WW2 planes....com'on guys...I know the Spitfire is the best plane ever made, is invincible and that the German ones are made to act as a good antagonist that at the end must be shoot down...but come on guys...also a blind will notice that actually RAF planes have totally unbelievable climb rates.
They climb from a flat turn from the top of the sky like the Columbia, engines that continues to work also in a vertical or negative G dive, aircraft that flies as per normal with missing wings and radiators perforated for ages...
New maps, new aircraft, etc are all great stuffs but for God sake, if possible, fix the RAF planes FM and DM...

...Or to see the thing on the other side if the Spitfire is modelled actually close to its real counterpart in the game....it means that in the 109s there is something very very wrong.

Salute!!!

9./JG52 Sturm
Jun-03-2017, 15:44
That's interesting, can you share a track of you flying the moves you think you shoudn't be able to achieve? That would be a great help understanding what you're objecting to exactly.

I believe he's particularly referring to high alt stuff which is unquestionably broken in favour of Red fighter atm. As Buzzsaw has detailed, this will be fixed in 4.5 :)

IIJG27Rich
Jun-03-2017, 17:07
It would be nice to see some new intro screens :recon:

ATAG_Flare
Jun-03-2017, 17:23
Thanks for your work and for the update, astonishing indeed!

I sincerely hope, somehow, that the new patch will fix the RAF aircraft climb and energy retention rates because actually they are flying rockets and not WW2 planes....com'on guys...I know the Spitfire is the best plane ever made, is invincible and that the German ones are made to act as a good antagonist that at the end must be shoot down...but come on guys...also a blind will notice that actually RAF planes have totally unbelievable climb rates.
They climb from a flat turn from the top of the sky like the Columbia, engines that continues to work also in a vertical or negative G dive, aircraft that flies as per normal with missing wings and radiators perforated for ages...
New maps, new aircraft, etc are all great stuffs but for God sake, if possible, fix the RAF planes FM and DM...

...Or to see the thing on the other side if the Spitfire is modelled actually close to its real counterpart in the game....it means that in the 109s there is something very very wrong.

Salute!!!

I fly the Spitfire much more than any other plane in CloD, and I had a lot of experience flying high-alt vs. 109s in groups during the War Machine campaign last spring.

The only place where the Spitfire was really better than the 109s we were encountering was above 32,000 or so feet, where they just couldn't climb up as high as us. (Apparently this is the "air pressure bug" and IRL the planes were more evenly matched up at these altitudes.)

At all other altitudes, below 25,000 for sure, the 109s would be better than us in speed, dive, and especially climb. The only other place we seemed to do well was running on the deck in the IIa when we could go at 3000rpm and +12 boost and 50% rads for a very long time because of the Spit IIa's excellent radiators.

The figures seem to match up with my experiences, and not yours. I think you may need to adjust your tactics if you are being outclimbed by Spitfires in a 109.

ATAG_Ribbs
Jun-03-2017, 17:34
Haha..Boo... Yee of little faith.. I bet I can read your mind!. I had a long post written out and just about ready to hit send. Just couldn't do it , and deleted as well. Just wasn't worth it. Feel your pain Brotha

DerDa
Jun-03-2017, 17:36
Well, somehow I never get to fly these Super-Spits.
And somehow I never encounter these outclassed 109s.

...

The game must be broken! Unbalanced!

Or maybe
...
could it be me?

ATAG_Ribbs
Jun-03-2017, 17:44
I fly the G50 and the Hurricanes..so I have no idea what you guys are talking about..Haha.

ATAG_Highseas
Jun-03-2017, 18:12
I fly the G50 and the Hurricanes..so I have no idea what you guys are talking about..Haha.

I'm mainly flying a bunch of workshop tools and a screwdriver mostly at the mo... so me neither

and DerDa.. the closing word you seek is I think the little used "Bunkum"

a polite word for ... "gosh that can't be right surely"

or :grrr::devilish::argue::cussing::bricks::thmbdwn:

(if that sort of bleak imagery is your bag.)

:D

BOO
Jun-03-2017, 20:52
#butthurt

Gromit
Jun-04-2017, 09:02
I fly the G50 and the Hurricanes..so I have no idea what you guys are talking about..Haha.

I got 11 kills in the G50 last night on the Hamble map, (was a blast guys thanks), so quite why anyone is complaining their 109 is underperforming against red planes makes me laugh!


By the way I was shot down 4 times by 109's, which is definitely improving, it's usually four times an hour roflmao

S guys, great fun .

farley
Jun-04-2017, 09:12
I got 11 kills in the G50 last night on the Hamble map, (was a blast guys thanks), so quite why anyone is complaining their 109 is underperforming against red planes makes me laugh!


By the way I was shot down 4 times by 109's, which is definitely improving, it's usually four times an hour roflmao

S guys, great fun .

11 kills... my total for the year... well, not quite... I'm so lousy that i shoot myself down (which, ironically, takes some skill....)....:D

Four friendly fire kills? Really? Oh my.... your mates need to start spreading the love around Gromit.... well, unless they really don't like you..... do you happen to owe any of them money? Winning too much at cards at the base are you?:)

Gromit
Jun-04-2017, 09:21
11 kills... my total for the year... well, not quite... I'm so lousy that i shoot myself down....:D

Four friendly fire kills? Really? Oh my.... your mates need to start spreading the love around Gromit.... well, unless they really don't like you..... do you happen to owe any of them money? Winning too much at cards at the base are you?:)

Aww mate, 109 driver need to go to specsavers , anything without a yellow nose gets shot at, even 109's, last night I was TK'd 4 times in the whole map one guy even saving a Hurricane I was pulling in behind, that's actually an improvement, last time I flew G50's I was attacked by 109's on average every 12 minutes over Calais to French point, I got so annoyed I started shooting back, in the end it was safer to go to England! :doh:

farley
Jun-04-2017, 09:27
Well, somehow I never get to fly these Super-Spits.
And somehow I never encounter these outclassed 109s.

...

The game must be broken! Unbalanced!

Or maybe
...
could it be me?

Well DerDa, not sure how old you are, but most of us older guys are probably broken in one way or another......

:sobbing:........

:(..........

:ind:.........

:)............

:ilike:......... I'm ok now......:thumbsup:

farley
Jun-04-2017, 09:32
Aww mate, 109 driver need to go to specsavers , anything without a yellow nose gets shot at, even 109's, last night I was TK'd 4 times in the whole map one guy even saving a Hurricane I was pulling in behind, that's actually an improvement, last time I flew G50's I was attacked by 109's on average every 12 minutes over Calais to French point, I got so annoyed I started shooting back, in the end it was safer to go to England! :doh:

OUCH!

Come over to the "good" side:D

You know what they say. Once you go red, you'll never be dead (by your own dudes at least)......:thumbsup:

Ok, full disclosure..... if you got 11 kills, then I'm actully glad that your mates are knocking you down!:-P

:)

~S~

ATAG_Ribbs
Jun-04-2017, 11:29
OUCH!

Come over to the "good" side:D

You know what they say. Once you go red, you'll never be dead (by your own dudes at least)......:thumbsup:

Ok, full disclosure..... if you got 11 kills, then I'm actully glad that your mates are knocking you down!:-P

:)

~S~
I can vouch for the 11 kills.. I know I was 3-4 of them... Haha. I usually fly the G50 on that map and it's a blast. Last night I saw the map from the red side in a Blenheim and Hurricane..and it was just as much fun!

Ohms
Jun-04-2017, 11:34
Aww mate, 109 driver need to go to specsavers , anything without a yellow nose gets shot at, even 109's, last night I was TK'd 4 times in the whole map one guy even saving a Hurricane I was pulling in behind, that's actually an improvement, last time I flew G50's I was attacked by 109's on average every 12 minutes over Calais to French point, I got so annoyed I started shooting back, in the end it was safer to go to England! :doh:

YIPEE your back:)

ATAG_Snapper
Jun-04-2017, 11:39
YIPEE your back:)

I thought the same. Was wondering when Gromit was coming back from walk-about. :thumbsup:

Gromit
Jun-04-2017, 12:06
Aww shucks I had no idea you missed me!

Trying to put a bit more time in as real life gets in the way some times, especially with 4.5 on the way, Beaufighters hmmmmmmmmmmm :-)

ATAG_Snapper
Jun-04-2017, 12:17
Beaufighters are going to lure me into the world of multi-engines! LOL

BOO
Jun-04-2017, 12:55
I got 11 kills in the G50 last night....

Don't worry Gromit...you're bound to be a little rusty after a lay off......... :wf:

ATAG_Flare
Jun-04-2017, 13:53
Beaufighters are going to lure me into the world of multi-engines! LOL

One of these days before 4.5 hits you'll get in a Blennie, I'm sure of it.

If you have the keybinds it can start in under four seconds and the engine management is easier than the Spit.

ATAG_Ribbs
Jun-04-2017, 14:57
Beaufighters are going to lure me into the world of multi-engines! LOL

The Blenheims, with the new facelift is going to be even more a beast than the bomber boys already make it. More payload and more armorment! Just think of all those 40's..they will be used for defensive purposes I'm sure, Leaving the rest to ruin Blues airfields! S!

ATAG_kiwiflieger
Jun-04-2017, 19:48
Probably a bit late to the party... but go Team Fusion! Can't wait for all this new content!

It would be nice in upcoming updates to fix the ability to give your plane noseart - not a massive priority as I can imagine but would be a cool feature to give an aircraft a more personal touch.

I wait with bated breath for the day all this will be reality... in a virtual kinda way.










100th post woohoo

BOO
Jun-05-2017, 04:11
Whether or not it makes it for 4.5 but I'm sure a community member found the nose art bug and TF stated the bug was now squshed.

Blackc5
Jun-12-2017, 14:44
Many thanks to TFS for their excellent work on making CLoD a huge success.

at this point I have been mulling over the 4.5 patch as well as 5.0 and have a few tech questions.

1. what are the ballistics being modeled for the new cannon rounds? such as the
a. new 30mm
b. the hispanno 20mm.
c. the 50cal (not really a cannon but just about)
d. the new 151/15 and 151/20.

2. what are the engine specs for the:
a. spit V
b. the 109 F
c. the 520
d. the P40
e. the 202

JG51_BlackC5 C.O.

RAF74_Buzzsaw
Jun-12-2017, 15:40
To answer your questions would require about eight hours of my time to write the response, post the data references, etc. and I don't have that time.

Suffice it to say we are modeling the aircraft with all the detail we can find.


Many thanks to TFS for their excellent work on making CLoD a huge success.

at this point I have been mulling over the 4.5 patch as well as 5.0 and have a few tech questions.

1. what are the ballistics being modeled for the new cannon rounds? such as the
a. new 30mm
b. the hispanno 20mm.
c. the 50cal (not really a cannon but just about)
d. the new 151/15 and 151/20.

2. what are the engine specs for the:
a. spit V
b. the 109 F
c. the 520
d. the P40
e. the 202

JG51_BlackC5 C.O.

GERMANWOLF
Jun-12-2017, 17:11
Hello pilots, flight 109 to 4 years in the ATAG, above 7000 meters it simply stops, gets very bad and slow.other question would be the sounds of the engines that was much lowered, I think it was a little out of reality.First it was possible to listen Better the sound of enemy aircraft around.

Blackc5
Jun-12-2017, 17:36
To answer your questions would require about eight hours of my time to write the response, post the data references, etc. and I don't have that time.

Suffice it to say we are modeling the aircraft with all the detail we can find.

fair enough, although I thought that this was the place to ask questions about the patches.
Will the data be released to us at some point so that we can go thru it?

RAF74_Buzzsaw
Jun-12-2017, 17:44
fair enough, although I thought that this was the place to ask questions about the patches.
Will the data be released to us at some point so that we can go thru it?

No.

If I had to compile and present all the data I use in modeling the aircraft and post it here for public consumption, I'd never get any FM work done.

At my last count I have 42.5 gb of data in original documents on the various aircraft... and I am constantly adding to that.

Go look at the WWII Aircraft Performance site and see how much material is there... I have all that is presented there, plus 10 times what they haven't presented. For example, they have no specifics on engines, props, fuselage design detail, aerofoil and drag detail, construction and damage detail, unless it is mentioned in a performance testing document... they have no pilot manuals, engine manuals, maintenance manuals, etc. etc.

(and by the way, they are a great site... no criticism intended... they do a great job of presenting what they do)

http://www.wwiiaircraftperformance.org/

If I wanted to show all the data I use, I'd spend the next year putting up a website.

Plus in some cases there would be copyright issues... I buy a lot of the data... If I started posting links to the sources, they could sue me for unlicenced distribution since in most of the cases the material they sell is watermarked.

I don't have any intention of becoming a resource center for WWII aircraft... I am busy enough with CoD and the FM's.

RAF74_Buzzsaw
Jun-12-2017, 18:28
For those who want to do some research on WWII aircraft, off the top of my head here are some good public links...

http://www.wwiiaircraftperformance.org/

https://ww2aircraft.net/forum/ (technical section)

http://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/results/r/?_q=AP-c6&_ps=60&_cp=8 (requires visiting and copying)

http://www.muzeumlotnictwa.pl/digitalizacja_archiwaliow/digitalizacja.php

http://www.airwar.ru/other/bibl_r.html

http://www.avialogs.com/index.php?option=com_osemsc&view=register&Itemid=185 (pay to play)

.... and of course if you are really serious... then be prepared to scour your local university/public libraries, other government sources... all in all, be ready to give up thousands of hours of your life. ;)

Blackc5
Jun-12-2017, 18:37
lol I understand, and I have gone thru a lot of those, but they do not all agree, I'm interested in what specs TFS has chosen to go with.

anyway thanks for the reading list and I will add it to my backlog lol

ATAG_Flare
Jun-12-2017, 23:23
lol I understand, and I have gone thru a lot of those, but they do not all agree, I'm interested in what specs TFS has chosen to go with.

anyway thanks for the reading list and I will add it to my backlog lol

I'm sure that Buzzsaw will be able to piece together all the best information from his massive amount of sources to make the most realistic FMs possible. I'm excited to fly them for sure.

I do recall that he said that in terms of documents, TF tries to utilise first documents from the original manufacturer, then from the national air forces, then captured evaluations come last as they tend to be the least accurate. I may be wrong on this however...

Blackc5
Jun-13-2017, 23:12
I'm sure that all of TFS data will be correct, what I'm looking for is the data so that I can do my planning based on that data, there is not a question of accuracy like when looking up MV on 50 cal ammo there are lots of sources all with some fairly large spreads in data. I really do not care which data is modeled, I will fly according to what is modeled, I'm trying to get a head start on my planning.

RAF74_Buzzsaw
Jun-14-2017, 04:07
I'm sure that all of TFS data will be correct, what I'm looking for is the data so that I can do my planning based on that data, there is not a question of accuracy like when looking up MV on 50 cal ammo there are lots of sources all with some fairly large spreads in data. I really do not care which data is modeled, I will fly according to what is modeled, I'm trying to get a head start on my planning.

You don't have to worry about us using modern ammunition Muzzle Velocity for WWII .50 caliber weapons... we will use the appropriate muzzle velocity for the ammunition used.

Blackc5
Jun-14-2017, 10:38
You don't have to worry about us using modern ammunition Muzzle Velocity for WWII .50 caliber weapons... we will use the appropriate muzzle velocity for the ammunition used.

ok i get it, it is a secret.
it would have been a shorter conversation if you started with "we are not going to tell you" lol
its all good, great work TFS

ATAG_Colander
Jun-14-2017, 11:43
ok i get it, it is a secret.
it would have been a shorter conversation if you started with "we are not going to tell you" lol
its all good, great work TFS

I'm not sure you get it.
TFS members use all their available time to do TFS work. Using that time to post lengthy explanations which undoubtedly start endless threads of what was done, is being done or will be done is a waste of this limited time.
Ask your self this, do you want 4.5 released at the earliest or TFS members answering these questions?

Link Law
Jun-14-2017, 12:05
Can´t wait for it :)

1lokos
Jun-14-2017, 12:27
...other question would be the sounds of the engines that was much lowered, I think it was a little out of reality.First it was possible to listen Better the sound of enemy aircraft around.

This engine sound was bug (common to many "flight games": il-2:46, CloD, DCSW, not sure but think BoS too) a pilot should not able to hear the sound of other aircraft engines near above their own aircraft engine sound.

In CLoD this exploit was minimized with that loud wind noise - early in CloD fly Spit/Hurri with canopy open was a norm in MP.

https://vignette4.wikia.nocookie.net/batfink/images/2/2b/Bf47b.jpg/revision/latest?cb=20140313211907

Blackc5
Jun-14-2017, 12:31
I'm not sure you get it.
TFS members use all their available time to do TFS work. Using that time to post lengthy explanations which undoubtedly start endless threads of what was done, is being done or will be done is a waste of this limited time.
Ask your self this, do you want 4.5 released at the earliest or TFS members answering these questions?

which is what i just stated, TFS does not want to post this information, I do get it, the request was not granted, and I'm good with that. I think that just stating "we do not want to publish this info" would have made the conversation much shorter and I have no problem with that response.

You are correct TFS has more important fish to fry.

Instead I spend a lot of time trying to make my request for information understood while get evasive responses leading me to believe it is just a misunderstanding, TFS does not owe me or anyone else anything. but this thread was put out as a chance for us to ask questions so I asked.

I fully understand (now) that TFS does not want to answer this question and please consider the request for information withdrawn.

sorry for asking the wrong question (no sarcasm intended)

just for sake of clarity, the question was not where did you get the information that you are using or to justify it, only what is the data that is in the game. but I can understand how that might lead others to starting a debate on how legitimate the data is so in hindsight I can see where the hesitation is coming from

Go TFS!

RAF74_Buzzsaw
Jun-14-2017, 15:17
Hello Black

You are not reading my posts. We are not being 'evasive' in the slightest.... or do you not understand the meaning of the word 'No'?

It is not that: "...TFS doesn't want to post this information."

As I explained previously, if I wanted to show all the data we use to create FM's I would need to host a website bigger than WWII Aircraft Performance... in fact I'd have to create an entirely new website that would take thousands of hours of work. This would take away from the time I have to create FM's... In fact it would stop work on FM's.

I would like to ask the members of this forum>>> Do you want me to stop work on the FM's so I can create a website of WWII aircraft data for guys like Black?

Plus there is the issue of copyright on some of the material which I purchased from other sites. I couldn't legally host that material.

It already takes me huge amounts of time to provide data to the rest of the TF team to allow work on models and coding without having to worry about every Tom, Dick and Harry who drops by this board and wants info.

So, as I have said before, if you want to research the details of various aircraft/weapons, you will need to do it yourself.

And by the way, if you disagree with our FM's.... feel free to post your comments... backed up by data to support them. I read every comment on the FM's which goes on these boards.


which is what i just stated, TFS does not want to post this information, I do get it, the request was not granted, and I'm good with that. I think that just stating "we do not want to publish this info" would have made the conversation much shorter and I have no problem with that response.

You are correct TFS has more important fish to fry.

Instead I spend a lot of time trying to make my request for information understood while get evasive responses leading me to believe it is just a misunderstanding, TFS does not owe me or anyone else anything. but this thread was put out as a chance for us to ask questions so I asked.

I fully understand (now) that TFS does not want to answer this question and please consider the request for information withdrawn.

sorry for asking the wrong question (no sarcasm intended)

just for sake of clarity, the question was not where did you get the information that you are using or to justify it, only what is the data that is in the game. but I can understand how that might lead others to starting a debate on how legitimate the data is so in hindsight I can see where the hesitation is coming from

Go TFS!

Continu0
Jun-14-2017, 15:33
Hey Buzz

I guess it is very obvious that explaining the whole process now would slow down the way to 4.5 / 5.0. But could it be an idea that you take some time after 4.5 or 5.0 to explain your work a little bit? And by that I don't mean something like "justify yourself", but rather "present all the work you have done". I am pretty sure that most of the players don't even have the slightes clue of the complexity which is going into the game. And to enlighten the community just a little bit about the whole work would also maybe make the community appreciate your work a little bit more. :thumbsup:

At least I remember the map-making live-stream back then when at some point I was "oh my god... all that work, just for us?". I feel you'd deserve to present your work in a similiar way. But the decission is of course up to you. I know, discussions about FM/DM never stop and if for that reason you want to avoid it at all, you have my complete understanding. You are working for free, so I for myself don't expect anything at all! :thumbsup:

This just as an idea for a solution to the current discussion, hope it helps!

All the best,
Continuo

Blackc5
Jun-14-2017, 15:49
Hello Black

You are not reading my posts. We are not being 'evasive' in the slightest.... or do you not understand the meaning of the word 'No'?

It is not that: "...TFS doesn't want to post this information."

As I explained previously, if I wanted to show all the data we use to create FM's I would need to host a website bigger than WWII Aircraft Performance... in fact I'd have to create an entirely new website that would take thousands of hours of work. This would take away from the time I have to create FM's... In fact it would stop work on FM's.

I would like to ask the members of this forum>>> Do you want me to stop work on the FM's so I can create a website of WWII aircraft data?

Plus there is the issue of copyright on some of the material which I purchased from other sites. I couldn't legally host that material.

It already takes me huge amounts of time to provide data to the rest of the TF team to allow work on models and coding without having to worry about every Tom, Dick and Harry who drops by this board and wants info.

So, as I have said before, if you want to research the details of various aircraft/weapons, you will need to do it yourself.

And by the way, if you disagree with our FM's.... feel free to post your comments... backed up by data to support them. I read every comment on the FM's which goes on these boards.

Buzzsaw, thanks for responding but I'm taking up your time that is better spent on the patches. I understand that posting all the info that TFS is using to build the model as accurately as possible would be very time consuming and frankly that is not what i was looking for. as to your response of "no" that was followed by an explanation of why you could not do it which completely (in my mind) missed what I was asking for.

I was hoping for something as simple as we are modeling the Hispanno in the spit V with a 153 grain round with a muzzle velocity of 820 mps and a rate of fire of 400 rpm while the 520 has x y and z with the 151/20 coming in at x y and z. none of this in my mind has to do with historical accuracy or any argument about which is correct (I do not really care), at the end of the day it is what it is, just like with the altitude bug in the spits, I know that it is there so I avoid operations that put my team at a disadvantage.

My questions have hit a sore spot and for that I apologize as that was not my intention. when I'm doing my homework and looking into how to plan operations against enemy aircraft it helps to know where my equipment has an advantage and when it does not (in the game) and by looking at all of the info out there I can come to conclusions that will not be valid in the game. I can work this out after the patches are done by flying the aircraft, but I find that it is always better to go to the source (which in this case is TFS not the original documentation).

anyway thanks for your patience with my line of questioning as I know that you guys at TFS are working very hard on what I hope will be a great venture so good luck

Go TFS

ATAG_Colander
Jun-14-2017, 16:01
@Buzz: Please ignore him. Is obvious he needs to have the last word.

ATAG_Dave
Jun-14-2017, 18:05
I would like to ask the members of this forum>>> Do you want me to stop work on the FM's so I can create a website of WWII aircraft data for guys like Black?



No. Never :salute:

RAF74_Buzzsaw
Jun-14-2017, 19:11
Hey Buzz

I guess it is very obvious that explaining the whole process now would slow down the way to 4.5 / 5.0. But could it be an idea that you take some time after 4.5 or 5.0 to explain your work a little bit?

Maybe after TF 4.5 if I have time... but that would likely take about a week of my time and require a very complex post or series of posts.

And by the way, it is not just me... it is other people as well... our coder Colander as well. I see a problem with how the game's physics engine or system is simulating as aspect, and then I put in a request to him... he then has to spend huge amounts of time re-coding the game. He is still working on getting the power generating math correct for all the new supercharger types we are introducing. He has been working on this since we first started the mod... and the latest engine modeling has been two years in the making.

Take a look at this article if you want to understand the complexities of the equations which need to be translated into code:

http://www.enginehistory.org/members/articles/ACEnginePerfAnalysisR-R.shtml

I believe CoD has the most complex aircraft engine simulation of any Flight Sim out there... it is far in advance of anything I have seen.

Akula93
Jun-14-2017, 19:56
Reading last few posts I think Blackc5 posts are misunderstod.
Hes not asking for explanations on how or from where data is taken, or how it is made to work in game, hes just wondering if data on what airplanes can do in game will be posted, data like it is now available for CloD airplanes in TF wiki
here: https://www.theairtacticalassaultgroup.com/wiki/doku.php?id=germanflightmanuals
or like BoX has it in more detail here: https://forum.il2sturmovik.com/topic/25993-aircraft-flight-and-technical-specifications-and-operational/

just informative copy paste data, nothing to extra

atleast this is how i see all this, there is for shure no need for u guys to explain from where data is taken or how this all works in game, but its helpfule for players to have info like its in TF wiki for new airplanes also

farley
Jun-14-2017, 20:12
"I would like to ask the members of this forum>>> Do you want me to stop work on the FM's so I can create a website of WWII aircraft data for guys like Black?"


No. Never :salute:


Wasn't that a rhetorical question Dave?

Sorry, i just had to ask as never used the word "rhetorical" before........:D

PS: I think that Mr Black just gets really excited about the technical side of it all, and would love to know everything he can about the planes etc...... lots of enthusiasm..... which is a good thing...... we are an excited and excitable bunch here... and obviously full of anticipation for the upcoming releases. Long live TF!!!
:)

farley
Jun-14-2017, 20:33
Take a look at this article if you want to understand the complexities of the equations which need to be translated into code:

http://www.enginehistory.org/members/articles/ACEnginePerfAnalysisR-R.shtml

I believe CoD has the most complex aircraft engine simulation of any Flight Sim out there... it is far in advance of anything I have seen.


Holy cow Buzz! Seriously, you gentlemen must be, to understate, a very intelligent bunch (even smarter than some politicians...)

I was boggled by the end of this sentence "Predicting the output of a piston engine rests on thermodynamic and fluid mechanic principles combined with experimental data taken in as general a manner as possible".
After that my mind just clouded over....

If my respect for TF and any others involved could go any higher, it would after seeing this example of stuff you "sort out" for this sim.... but it is already at an A1+++ rating :thumbsup:

Thank you all for your dedication and hard work.:salute:
28715

RAF74_Buzzsaw
Jun-14-2017, 21:49
Reading last few posts I think Blackc5 posts are misunderstod.
Hes not asking for explanations on how or from where data is taken, or how it is made to work in game, hes just wondering if data on what airplanes can do in game will be posted, data like it is now available for CloD airplanes in TF wiki
here: https://www.theairtacticalassaultgroup.com/wiki/doku.php?id=germanflightmanuals
or like BoX has it in more detail here: https://forum.il2sturmovik.com/topic/25993-aircraft-flight-and-technical-specifications-and-operational/

just informative copy paste data, nothing to extra

atleast this is how i see all this, there is for shure no need for u guys to explain from where data is taken or how this all works in game, but its helpfule for players to have info like its in TF wiki for new airplanes also

Of course we will update our TF Wiki page and TF pilot manuals.

Here's TF's primary goal:

- To make the aircraft perform as much like the real aircraft as possible.

We want to create modeling which allows the player to pick up an original historical flight manual, and be able to use it as a guide.

For that reason, posting something like BoS has done, is not really appropriate in our opinion.

For example, how do you define a maximum safe dive speed down to the exact kilometer per hour before an aircraft starts or disintegrate or is unable to pull out?

- What G loading is incurred as the aircraft pulls out of the dive?
- At what angle is the dive?
- How much airspace is required for recovery?
- What altitude is the dive pullout occurring at?
- etc. etc.

All of those factors are going to change what the exact maximum allowable dive speed is.

This is not meant as a criticism towards BoX, they are welcome to post their figures as a guide, but we prefer to instead give the kind of guidelines you might see in an historical pilot manual. In that case, you will see a figure for maximum dive speed which is actually lower than the particular aircraft might in some circumstances be able to sustain safely. Pilots can choose to exceed that speed, but they are taking a risk... they may or may not survive depending on the circumstances mentioned above.

CLIFFS OF DOVER is an organic game system... there are a multiplicity of factors simulated in the game which interact and change the answer to questions. It's not just a copy, paste and plugin system. (neither is BoX a copy/paste/plugin system... but they have decided to provide a simplified summary for their users... we prefer not to)

This is my last comment in this thread.

EAF331 Starfire
Jun-15-2017, 03:48
any idear when the 4.5 will be released?

Maru
Jun-15-2017, 04:07
any idear when the 4.5 will be released?

Tomorrow

gonk
Jun-15-2017, 05:21
Tomorrow

Lies..all lies... :devilish:

farley
Jun-15-2017, 07:18
Tomorrow

Fake news!:D

7./JG26_SMOKEJUMPER
Jun-15-2017, 14:19
any idear when the 4.5 will be released?


I've been wanting to ask as well. :P

Is there a goal idea? I'm rather excited so forgive my impatience. It's like Christmas is coming...... Christmas in July would be rad.

Gromit
Jun-15-2017, 14:32
Buzzsaw, thanks for responding but I'm taking up your time that is better spent on the patches. I understand that posting all the info that TFS is using to build the model as accurately as possible would be very time consuming and frankly that is not what i was looking for. as to your response of "no" that was followed by an explanation of why you could not do it which completely (in my mind) missed what I was asking for.

I was hoping for something as simple as we are modeling the Hispanno in the spit V with a 153 grain round with a muzzle velocity of 820 mps and a rate of fire of 400 rpm while the 520 has x y and z with the 151/20 coming in at x y and z. none of this in my mind has to do with historical accuracy or any argument about which is correct (I do not really care), at the end of the day it is what it is, just like with the altitude bug in the spits, I know that it is there so I avoid operations that put my team at a disadvantage.

My questions have hit a sore spot and for that I apologize as that was not my intention. when I'm doing my homework and looking into how to plan operations against enemy aircraft it helps to know where my equipment has an advantage and when it does not (in the game) and by looking at all of the info out there I can come to conclusions that will not be valid in the game. I can work this out after the patches are done by flying the aircraft, but I find that it is always better to go to the source (which in this case is TFS not the original documentation).

anyway thanks for your patience with my line of questioning as I know that you guys at TFS are working very hard on what I hope will be a great venture so good luck

Go TFS

Unsure why you would need this info, the Hispano (110mm) and Mauser 151 (80mm) used very different cartridge sizes so the energy levels are well understood, these websites may shine some light on what your looking for -

http://users.skynet.be/Emmanuel.Gustin/fgun/fgun-pe.html

http://quarryhs.co.uk/WW2guneffect.htm

Kendy for the State
Jun-15-2017, 14:51
Sounds like a real covfefe!

Sent from my XT1635-01 using Tapatalk

Blackc5
Jun-15-2017, 16:03
Unsure why you would need this info, the Hispano (110mm) and Mauser 151 (80mm) used very different cartridge sizes so the energy levels are well understood, these websites may shine some light on what your looking for -

http://users.skynet.be/Emmanuel.Gustin/fgun/fgun-pe.html

http://quarryhs.co.uk/WW2guneffect.htm

Gromit
the hispano is used in the spit V but also in the 520, the rate of fire is different for each (100 rpm difference) and different sources differ.

your first source lists the hispano II as 880 m/s the second source lists it as 860 m/s.

not to be picky but i believe that the 151 is an 82mm not an 80mm.

I do not care about the historical accuracy so much as knowing what I'm dealing with.

out of respect for Buzzsaw I'm happy to wait until after the patch is out and they get time to update the Wiki (to what ever level they think is appropriate), also I think that it is what it is in the end and that my posting of this question is idle curiosity not to start a blue vs red drama.

farley
Jun-15-2017, 16:21
I've been wanting to ask as well. :P

Is there a goal idea? I'm rather excited so forgive my impatience. It's like Christmas is coming...... Christmas in July would be rad.

Christmas in June would be even rader!:D

Gromit
Jun-15-2017, 16:24
Gromit
the hispano is used in the spit V but also in the 520, the rate of fire is different for each (100 rpm difference) and different sources differ.

your first source lists the hispano II as 880 m/s the second source lists it as 860 m/s.

not to be picky but i believe that the 151 is an 82mm not an 80mm.

I do not care about the historical accuracy so much as knowing what I'm dealing with.

out of respect for Buzzsaw I'm happy to wait until after the patch is out and they get time to update the Wiki (to what ever level they think is appropriate), also I think that it is what it is in the end and that my posting of this question is idle curiosity not to start a blue vs red drama.

Hispano V was only used in the Tempest, it was a lighter weapon with shorter barrel but improved rate of fire, it lost muzzle velocity over the Mkii, 860ms vrs 830ms for MkV, as far as I know all service Hispanos from 1941 were Mkii, cartridge is the same on all from Spit through to Typhoon mk ii 860fps with longer barrel. not seen 880ms quoted much but that may be for the lighter ap or hei instead of the heavier ball?

Either way 20ms at those velocities are not going to have an impact on game play.

ATAG_Colander
Jun-15-2017, 16:33
Either way 20ms at those velocities are not going to have an impact on game play.

Perfect! I need something to blame when I miss my shots :D

Blackc5
Jun-15-2017, 17:14
Hispano V was only used in the Tempest, it was a lighter weapon with shorter barrel but improved rate of fire, it lost muzzle velocity over the Mkii, 860ms vrs 830ms for MkV, as far as I know all service Hispanos from 1941 were Mkii, cartridge is the same on all from Spit through to Typhoon mk ii 860fps with longer barrel. not seen 880ms quoted much but that may be for the lighter ap or hei instead of the heavier ball?

Either way 20ms at those velocities are not going to have an impact on game play.

I would agree 20m/s will not create much of an impact but this is just an example of one item on the list, and I did not want to get into the whole historical accuracy issue.

the question of how the 20mmX110mm in the 520 is modeled, which I believe the french labeled 4.04? is identical to the hispano except the rate of fire is much higher, will have a big impact on game play.

lets shelve this until after the patch comes out, I started by asking a question that I thought would be easy for TFS to answer ("what are they using", not "what is historical accurate") and it has turned out not to be so, at this point it is only pissing people off and not getting anywhere.

Go TFS!

Blackc5
Jun-15-2017, 17:15
Perfect! I need something to blame when I miss my shots :D

that is what i need too lol

ATAG_Flare
Jun-15-2017, 20:36
Just curious, why would the rate of fire be faster on the French hispano than on the British? (The sources I found say 650rpm for the Hispano Mk. II and ~880m/s velocity.)

Blackc5
Jun-15-2017, 21:21
Just curious, why would the rate of fire be faster on the French hispano than on the British? (The sources I found say 650rpm for the Hispano Mk. II and ~880m/s velocity.)

the HS.404 was the original version of the cannon firing the 20mmX110mm round it was developed by the French, the Hispano was somewhat a copy of it but the British mkII version had a lower rate of fire.
the French HS.404 in the 520 is my favorite fighter vs fighter aircraft cannon (except for the 60 round capacity).

kashiide
Jun-16-2017, 06:30
Black5,

HS 404 means Hispano Suiza 404,it is the same firm.
The French HS 404 has a rate of fire of 600 rpm.the first production ones had higher ROF,but it was troublesome and prone to jam,so ROF was lowered to 600 RPM

So no differences between HS 404 and Hispano MK1 and MK2,except the MK2 had a belt feeding system instead of the 60 rounds drums.

The cannons in the early Beaufighter are Hispano MK1,exactly the same cannon than HS 404.
The observer had the task to reload the 4 cannons,as the Beaufighter carried in total 16 drums,4 for each cannon

BOO
Jun-16-2017, 09:15
the Beaufighter carried in total 16 drums,4 for each cannon


:satisfied::satisfied::satisfied::satisfied::satis fied::satisfied::satisfied::satisfied::satisfied:: satisfied::satisfied:

Gromit
Jun-16-2017, 10:01
Black5,

HS 404 means Hispano Suiza 404,it is the same firm.
The French HS 404 has a rate of fire of 600 rpm.the first production ones had higher ROF,but it was troublesome and prone to jam,so ROF was lowered to 600 RPM

So no differences between HS 404 and Hispano MK1 and MK2,except the MK2 had a belt feeding system instead of the 60 rounds drums.

The cannons in the early Beaufighter are Hispano MK1,exactly the same cannon than HS 404.
The observer had the task to reload the 4 cannons,as the Beaufighter carried in total 16 drums,4 for each cannon

I seem to recall the ROF was lowered by reducing the recoil springs, they misfed as the cases got trapped on the higher rate?

Mike Allen a Beau radar operator mentions reloading the cannons was an unpopular job as it was easy do drop a rather heavy drum on your fingers and you sometimes had to manually re cock the cannon after, sound like a real pain in the backside!

kashiide
Jun-16-2017, 10:59
:satisfied::satisfied::satisfied::satisfied::satis fied::satisfied::satisfied::satisfied::satisfied:: satisfied::satisfied:



Yes it's a real flying tank.very fun to fly

dhyran
Jun-25-2017, 15:09
Hiho Gents,

one thing is for sure, when 4.5 is released i am back again with some friends of mine

CAN'T WAIT!

<S>
dhyran

BTW. classic question, is there a release date for 4.5 yet? (beside two weeks please)

ATAG_Ribbs
Jun-26-2017, 09:46
Nah..no release date yet.. just working hard to get it finished. :thumbsup:

aus
Jun-26-2017, 21:50
Maybe after TF 4.5 if I have time... but that would likely take about a week of my time and require a very complex post or series of posts.

And by the way, it is not just me... it is other people as well... our coder Colander as well. I see a problem with how the game's physics engine or system is simulating as aspect, and then I put in a request to him... he then has to spend huge amounts of time re-coding the game. He is still working on getting the power generating math correct for all the new supercharger types we are introducing. He has been working on this since we first started the mod... and the latest engine modeling has been two years in the making.

Take a look at this article if you want to understand the complexities of the equations which need to be translated into code:

http://www.enginehistory.org/members/articles/ACEnginePerfAnalysisR-R.shtml

I believe CoD has the most complex aircraft engine simulation of any Flight Sim out there... it is far in advance of anything I have seen.

It is up there and if it is fixed, will be unbeatable with the combined environment and overall attention to detail. Can't wait. Go TFS

Erpr.Gr.210_Mölders
Jun-27-2017, 01:38
What about damage model of the RAF planes and LW ones ( Bf 110 in particular )? What about the balance between fighters and heavy-fighters bombers?
Do we have to expect in this patch the same crap damage model that we got now or there will be some modifications\works made about it?

Sorry but actually the damage model of the RAF planes is pretty puzzling.
As you know I fly mainly the Bf 110 and is pretty boring ( to use an educated term ) to be always damaged by aircraft that fly as per normal vented and oiled and crippled of bullets for ages.
The engine of the Bf 110 breaks in seconds when hit and the aircraft immediately tends to go down as a rock whatever trim you apply.
Some minutes ago a vented Spitfire escaped from me ( me undamaged ) flying at 700 km\h...come on.... :doh:

BOO
Jun-27-2017, 02:04
Never ever been my experience of RAF types. Engine and Rad damage and you have 2 maybe 3 mins at most usually a lot less.

Erpr.Gr.210_Mölders
Jun-27-2017, 04:41
Never ever been my experience of RAF types. Engine and Rad damage and you have 2 maybe 3 mins at most usually a lot less.

This is true only for oil radiator damage and not so for water radiator damages. The big problem is that, in both cases, the RAF planes continuing to make maneuvers as if they are undamaged.
Climbing, diving, gaining speed, etc all stuffs that, I can assure you, in a Bf 110 damaged are ALL impossible to be made also in the more favourable circumstance and lucky situation.

Erpr.Gr.210_Mölders
Jun-27-2017, 05:00
You can make a simple test by yourself if wanting: damage on purpose both the oil and water radiators of RAF and LW planes when at 4000 meters of altitude and then following a path easy to be tracked, try to fly for as long as you can.

When I've done it the results were these:

Bf 110: From Dunquerque harbor to about Wissant ( following the coastline )

Bf 109: Pretty much the same as the Bf 110

Spitfire|Hurricane: Dunquerque harbour --> French point --> Boulogne ( following the coastline )

Both the Spitfire|Hurricane seems to have some kind of positive buoyancy that keep them in flight for ages in respect to their German counterparts also if damaged.
It's not the first time that I'm damaged 4-5 km north of the Calais area and I'm not able to reach the coastline while the damaged RAF plane of turn, from the same position, is able to come back easily to its bases at Hawkinge or Lympne...or from Le Havre they back, with the water radiator damaged, to Crepon without a problem.
It's not the first time that I'm not able to gain on a damaged RAF plane flying on the deck ( or at any altitude ) while my aircraft has got no damages at all ( note that in the Bf 110 once damaged you are lucky if you can keep 200 kmh in levelled flight ).

Is normal having damaged planes going more faster than undamaged ones? I'm not an experienced mechanic but...few words to the wise....

RAF74_Buzzsaw
Jun-27-2017, 06:10
Hello Molders

Are you aware the British radiators carried more fluid in their reservoirs than the German's did?

Since the game models radiator leaks on a single constant, that is why a British aircraft will take longer to drain... and seize.

Anyway, in regards to your comments about the Bf110's:

- Changes in TF 4.5

- 110's will see better climb, high altitude performance, and a higher ceiling... with the fixing of the bug which affected this

- 110's will see better turn and energy retention... due to the more precise engine modeling and the consequently more accurate aerodynamics

- We will be introducing the Bf110C-6 ground attack variant as well as the Bf110C-4B... which was another low alt fighter bomber... and the fastest 110 down low, faster than the C-7's.

Otherwise you will need to get used to the fact your chosen aircraft is inferior in most air combat categories to single engined types. ;)

But good on you for challenging yourself. :thumbsup:

RAF74_Buzzsaw
Jun-27-2017, 06:42
Oh yes, forgot another change for the Bf110's for TF 4.5.

In the event an engine is damaged and needs to be shut off, the Bf110 pilot will be able to feather the prop on that engine to reduce drag.

Gromit
Jun-27-2017, 09:09
Hello Molders

Are you aware the British radiators carried more fluid in their reservoirs than the German's did?

Since the game models radiator leaks on a single constant, that is why a British aircraft will take longer to drain... and seize.

Anyway, in regards to your comments about the Bf110's:

- Changes in TF 4.5

- 110's will see better climb, high altitude performance, and a higher ceiling... with the fixing of the bug which affected this

- 110's will see better turn and energy retention... due to the more precise engine modeling and the consequently more accurate aerodynamics

- We will be introducing the Bf110C-6 ground attack variant as well as the Bf110C-4B... which was another low alt fighter bomber... and the fastest 110 down low, faster than the C-7's.

Otherwise you will need to get used to the fact your chosen aircraft is inferior in most air combat categories to single engined types. ;)

But good on you for challenging yourself. :thumbsup:

Bit baffled by this altitude bug, as I understand it the problem is in the atmospheric modelling rather than the individual aircraft, so surely the red aircraft will also see a benefit when the bug is fixed?

ATAG_Colander
Jun-27-2017, 09:34
Bit baffled by this altitude bug, as I understand it the problem is in the atmospheric modelling rather than the individual aircraft, so surely the red aircraft will also see a benefit when the bug is fixed?

Absolutely all planes will behave differently.
Hopefully they will all be a lot closer to real life but, that doesn't mean there will not be those who complain that their favorite aircraft is porked :D

ATAG_Ribbs
Jun-27-2017, 09:39
As long as my Hurricane does 700 km/h....with the wings still attached, I will be happy.... :)

Mysticpuma
Jun-27-2017, 09:52
Regarding the damage modelling, will it be possible to have bits of the CR.42 fall off instead of them always breaking in half behind the cockpit?

kashiide
Jun-27-2017, 10:13
Regarding the damage modelling, will it be possible to have bits of the CR.42 fall off instead of them always breaking in half behind the cockpit?


this would require rework of the damage models(3d and texture) and the code attached to it.
possible,lot of work.

DerDa
Jun-27-2017, 10:40
Absolutely all planes will behave differently.
Hopefully they will all be a lot closer to real life but, that doesn't mean there will not be those who complain that their favorite aircraft is porked :D

You mean I will no longer be able to catch those 109s with my Tiger Moth???

IIJG27Rich
Jun-27-2017, 10:57
Not that F4 :salute:

ATAG_Colander
Jun-27-2017, 11:27
You mean I will no longer be able to catch those 109s with my Tiger Moth???

Depends...
In a free fall with no engine, if the Tiger Moth looses it's wings, it will have less drag so it will overtake a 109.

ATAG_NakedSquirrel
Jun-27-2017, 11:45
Depends...
In a free fall with no engine, if the Tiger Moth looses it's wings, it will have less drag so it will overtake a 109.

Is there any other way to fly a Tiger Moth?

Tibsun
Jun-27-2017, 12:33
Depends...
In a free fall with no engine, if the Tiger Moth looses it's wings, it will have less drag so it will overtake a 109.

Will we ever see a plane going faster with lost bits? Because my current experience is, it doesn't matter what you lose, if you lose a part, it creates airdrag.

Like that one, I clipped both wingtips of a hurry, guess what happens? It was half the speed. Airdrag of turbulence at the damaged parts? Is it modelled that way?

Also planes with both wings fully cut off (airdrag obviously can't overtake here) tends to slow down, even when the heavy part pointing streamlined downwards.

ATAG_Colander
Jun-27-2017, 12:42
Are we complaining that the FM for planes without wings is wrong? :)

Tibsun
Jun-27-2017, 12:49
Are we complaining that the FM for planes without wings is wrong? :)

Yes! I want my clipwing hurry to be supersonic :D

Gromit
Jun-27-2017, 13:51
Will we ever see a plane going faster with lost bits? Because my current experience is, it doesn't matter what you lose, if you lose a part, it creates airdrag.

Like that one, I clipped both wingtips of a hurry, guess what happens? It was half the speed. Airdrag of turbulence at the damaged parts? Is it modelled that way?

Also planes with both wings fully cut off (airdrag obviously can't overtake here) tends to slow down, even when the heavy part pointing streamlined downwards.

If you lose a wing your drag is going to go up massively as the asymmetric drag will cause a huge amount of yaw , basically turning the plane into an airbrake!

ATAG_Ribbs
Jun-27-2017, 14:28
Are we complaining that the FM for planes without wings is wrong? :)

Lmao

RAF74_Buzzsaw
Jun-27-2017, 16:09
Bit baffled by this altitude bug, as I understand it the problem is in the atmospheric modelling rather than the individual aircraft, so surely the red aircraft will also see a benefit when the bug is fixed?

Actually the 'altitude density bug' was more an engine power issue... although there are aerodynamic questions as well.

The German aircraft were more affected by the lack of power at high altitudes due to the fact their climb was more dependent on engine power instead of wing lift.

The Spits/Hurris had better wingloading, so therefore they were less affected.

Also the Daimler Benz's used a unique Hydro-Coupled Supercharger, which was in effect, a two speed supercharger, (actually better than two speed) but with the bug, this engine was not able to take advantage of the better performance at high altitude which this supercharger delivered historically.

We will be posting an update which details all the changes in FM's which will happen in TF 4.5.

Erpr.Gr.210_Mölders
Jun-27-2017, 16:49
Thanks for the detailed reply and the news RAF74_Buzzsaw, much appreciated!

I will open in the next days somehow a topic about the Bf 110 because there are also stuffs that should be corrected if possible, especially about the idiot in the back ( as I call " affectionately " my dear rear gunner :) )

Just a thought...saying me that the RAF planes carry more coolant liquid are you saying me between the lines that they are full of that liquid inside? ( Looking for how long they can fly loosing that fluid because it seems infinite )...obviously I'm just joking!!! :) :) :)

ATAG_Colander
Jun-27-2017, 17:03
I would recommend holding your horses on FM comments/requests. Once released, the new versions will improve in a lot of factors.

Erpr.Gr.210_Mölders
Jun-27-2017, 18:35
I would recommend holding your horses on FM comments/requests. Once released, the new versions will improve in a lot of factors.

Viktor!!! :salute:

69th_Zeb
Jun-27-2017, 20:53
Absolutely all planes will behave differently.
Hopefully they will all be a lot closer to real life but, that doesn't mean there will not be those who complain that their favorite aircraft is porked :D

Ha. Yeah, in the computational fluid dynamics world, you're paying around $30k (in our case was Solidworks) for a product that is only 80-90% accurate. Wind tunnels/empirical testing still has to be done for the biggest defense/civilian projects (Mercedes has an epic one). F1 guys still mount rails of sensors during practice.

No two planes out of the same line will fly the same. Gauges may not be calibrated. Bugs in the pitot. Nests in the nacelle. A run of ten engines with spun bearings. Static ports be clogged mateys! Maybe marketing fudged the POH to win the bid. Who knows. For the most part, I could probably find other ways out of historical data -in defense of the programmers. Warbirds of yesteryear were also nowhere near as well-maintained as they are today.

I do like learning about the original planes by comparing them with CLOD as a system. It's also fun coming up with my own performance values from scratch, or seeing how tactics failed back then, and, in some circumstances, how we as a community have unknowingly adopted ones that worked towards the end of the war. What people wrote in books makes more sense now too. I think there's plenty of nerdy gold nuggets there.

But to say the flight model is not up to par. Schucks. I wish the C.F.D. guys that are paid millions would at least get closer. I paid like, ten bucks for this sim.

Nice work TFS!

Gromit
Jun-28-2017, 11:01
people come into these things with preconceptions, and there are a lot of myths and outright bunkum spouted about favourite models!

For every complaint about one side you can find just as many against the other, a lot of people think because they believe their favourite is superior, then it has to be, facts be damned,

The idea all aircraft came off the lines identical with exactly the same performance is nonsense, we often hear of "dog's" or "lemons", we often read the excuses of "it was damage repaired", " the engines not running right" etc when captured planes were tested and don't match up to printed graphs from manufacturers , but did anyone think for a moment that could be the performance of a "used" frontline aircraft?

This is a game, and that's all it is, it will never be reality so it's pointless and grossly ungrateful to the guys who produce this work nit picking flight or damage models because they don't match up to your expectations, I for one believe these models are more than good enough to produce realistic gaming, and if your reliant solely on the max numbers in the game code to win your fights, maybe you need to spend more time thinking about tactics and position, because plenty of us have good enough results with G50's and Hurricanes, it's not all about the best plane!

ATAG_Colander
Jun-28-2017, 11:05
But to say the flight model is not up to par. Schucks. I wish the C.F.D. guys that are paid millions would at least get closer. I paid like, ten bucks for this sim.


He, you forgot to add the real time for multiple planes on a home PC requirement :)

GERMANWOLF
Jun-28-2017, 11:08
As May comes to a close, TFS is pushing closer and closer to finishing up the next patch for the community. As things start to come together and testing begins, we wanted to reach out and give everyone somewhat of a "change log" of sorts about what to expect with 4.5. This list isn't everything nor is it finalized (see last week's post) with things possibly being added if time allows.

The amount of work that has been done is impressive and the man hours involved countless. TFS sees 4.5 as what we hope will be a definitive and final version of the original Cliffs of Dover, with additional aircraft, bugfixes, and improvements which bring the game up to the level the original developers had hoped for.

That said, here is a sample of what to expect with patch 4.5.

CODE:

- Complete rewrite of TFS mods to the source code.

- Enabling DX11

- Aircraft mirrors enabled

CORRECTED BUGS:

- Distant rivers looking like lakes

- Flashing plexiglass from bombers, known as the “Christmas tree effect”.

- Drained the three gigantic flooded water areas (#590) in France, aka known as "The Swimming Pools” @ AV02, BC16, BD14

- Grandvillier Airdrome @ BC07 corrected to show all airfield hangers

- Relly Norrante Fontes @ BF17 corrected to show all blast pens and Isbergues rail station.

- Somewhere in France removed unconnected railway buffer.

- Marquise West @ BA20 corrected to show 49 new objects, on airfield and nearby village.

- Campagne Les Guines @ BB20 corrected to show all 64 objects instead of 2 at airfield.

- East of St Tricat, German camp discovered and now showing.

- Frethun, railway station discovered and now showing.

- Spitfire I/IA/IIA cockpit fix for radiator lever. 28423

- Blenheim cockpit and bombardier cabin switches added. 28424 28425

- Field modded Hurricane bomb switches added to cockpit.

- Hurricane wooden trim wheel corrected

EFFECTS: (Nearly all “particle effects” have been reworked, below are some)

- Engine damage smokes

- Exhaust flames

- Oil leaks

- Dust/Dirt

- Muzzle flashes

- Shell casings

- Weapon smoke

- Projectile impacts on all surfaces

- Tracer effects

- De Wilde impact flashes

- Bomb/Artillery explosions

- Vehicle explosions

- Flak effects

- Fuel fires

- Fuel explosions

- Aircraft crash explosions/fires

- Environmental smoke

- Chimney smoke

- Ship wakes


SOUND:

- Sound catalogs being worked to hopefully provide great improvements for 4.5


TERRAIN:

-New English landscape.

-New French landscape.

- New shaders

NEW FLYABLE AIRCRAFT:

- Beaufighter 1F Dayfighter (early) and 1NF Nightfighter (early) with Hercules III engine (The Beaufighter 1C with Hercules IX will not appear until TF 5.0).

- Bf-110C-6 anti-shipping and ground attack version, with 30mm cannon fuselage pod. 28426 28427

- Bf-110C-4B, (early ground attack) with low altitude optimized DB601Aa engines.

- Hurricane I Rotol Fighter-Bomber fitted with eight, 40 pound bombs. Note: This aircraft can be definitively confirmed to have been used in the Desert and from Malta... but so far there has been no confirmation it was used on the Channel Front. We decided to include it in TF 4.5 for two reasons... 1) It would probably be missed in all the excitement over the new aircraft... (there will be a Fighter-Bomber version of the Hurri IIB) and 2) It will give mission builders on the Channel map the opportunity to build campaigns with fighter-bombers on both sides. If users prefer not to include the aircraft, that is their choice. 28428

- Blenheim IV, IVF (Late) with twin Browning rear turret. Bomb load additions include eight, 40 pound fuselage mounted bombs. Blenheim IV also has the ability of caring at least 2, possibly 4 SBC’s in the main bay, each holding six 40 pound bombs. 28429
28430

- Armed Tiger Moths variants, one with four 25 lb bombs, one with wing-mount .303 Vickers, and one with cockpit mount Czech 7.92mm firing through prop. We included the version with the bombs because it was a historical BoB aircraft... a last resort to be used if the Germans landed. The other two are included because we believe players will enjoy the opportunity to dogfight with a biplane... we hope to see all Tiger Moth maps as short fun missions.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h6XSpOFWa0Q


FM/DM FIXES:

- Spitfire fire (or lack of) bug corrected

- Re-mapped power physics .dll which corrects the engine bug, Spit MkIIA brakes/windmilling prop/restart, Tiger moth rudder trim, and numerous, numerous other corrections!


MISCELLANEOUS:

- Tom's Air Force Bases/Maps

- New pilot uniforms and accessories

SKINS:

More than a handful of new skins for Channel aircraft. Here is one of the Beaufighter. (Reached my MB limit!)

28431

28432

What is the approximate date of release?

ATAG_Colander
Jun-28-2017, 11:28
What is the approximate date of release?

February 29

GERMANWOLF
Jun-28-2017, 11:30
february 29

i believe nobody knows
S!

ATAG_Highseas
Jun-28-2017, 13:44
i believe nobody knows
S!

I do. But it's a secret. and I'm not telling

:ilike:

Kendy for the State
Jun-28-2017, 14:02
I believe it will be released on the Milloonium.

Sent from my XT1635-01 using Tapatalk

ATAG_Ribbs
Jun-28-2017, 14:06
February 29

I see what u did there.. :D

ZG26_Sir_Racha
Jul-08-2017, 21:49
Is there any information on the MK 101 the Bf-110 C-6 will carry? Namely will my beloved have a 10 or 30 round magazine, and is it gunner reloaded, or will it not be capable of reloading?

I will attempt to use it against fighters nonetheless because I'm crazy and love to see Spitfires fall apart.

- 110's will see better climb, high altitude performance, and a higher ceiling... with the fixing of the bug which affected this

- 110's will see better turn and energy retention... due to the more precise engine modeling and the consequently more accurate aerodynamics

:devilish:
RRRRRACHA out

♣_Spiritus_♣
Jul-09-2017, 01:20
Buzz will have a better answer for you once he has some free time to visit the boards, but I believe there really isn't much info/evidence that the 30 round drum was actually used. That said, I believe we are planning the 6 and 10 round clips. As far as reload... not sure. Sorry I can't be much more help than that, I'm sure there will be a more definitive answer soon. TFS members have been a little absent from the forums the last week or so because... well because. :devilish:

ATAG_Ezzie
Jul-09-2017, 01:47
Is there any information on the MK 101 the Bf-110 C-6 will carry? Namely will my beloved have a 10 or 30 round magazine, and is it gunner reloaded, or will it not be capable of reloading?

I will attempt to use it against fighters nonetheless because I'm crazy and love to see Spitfires fall apart.

- 110's will see better climb, high altitude performance, and a higher ceiling... with the fixing of the bug which affected this

- 110's will see better turn and energy retention... due to the more precise engine modeling and the consequently more accurate aerodynamics

:devilish:
RRRRRACHA out


Racha - you might find this an interesting read if u havent already seen it. Obviously TFS will do what they think is correct - which may or not be as per this link. But regardless still an interesting read

http://forum.12oclockhigh.net/showthread.php?t=18516&page=2

Ezzie

DerDa
Jul-09-2017, 06:37
TFS members have been a little absent from the forums the last week or so because... well because. :devilish:

Because sounds rather interesting :)

BOO
Jul-10-2017, 11:39
I'm leaning to one of them acquiring a hooky copy of the new Game of Thrones season and having some weird MMO binge watch.....cant think of any other reason

Kestrel
Jul-11-2017, 21:33
what is the approximate date of release?



february 29


2019 :-p

7./JG26_SMOKEJUMPER
Jul-12-2017, 10:25
Buzz will have a better answer for you once he has some free time to visit the boards, but I believe there really isn't much info/evidence that the 30 round drum was actually used. That said, I believe we are planning the 6 and 10 round clips. As far as reload... not sure. Sorry I can't be much more help than that, I'm sure there will be a more definitive answer soon. TFS members have been a little absent from the forums the last week or so because... well because. :devilish:



Two weeks??!?!

IIJG27Rich
Jul-12-2017, 16:19
Two weeks??!?!


Kind off Jonesing for an update here LOL :popcorn2: :salute:

♣_Spiritus_♣
Jul-12-2017, 18:11
I debated about doing an update today but decided not to. Next weekend (not this weekend) will have a major update with lots of news, photos, and video.

ATAG_Ribbs
Jul-12-2017, 19:56
No worries on not giving an update today Spiritus.. we can wait! Thanks for the heads up! S!

ATAG_Highseas
Jul-12-2017, 20:22
I debated about doing an update today but decided not to. Next weekend (not this weekend) will have a major update with lots of news, photos, and video.


Let it bubble along. I get that people want updates. I also get that that takes time to out together (the updates themselves)


4.3.2.8 or whatever is doing plenty well in the mean time.

:salute:

IIJG27Rich
Jul-13-2017, 16:40
I debated about doing an update today but decided not to. Next weekend (not this weekend) will have a major update with lots of news, photos, and video.


Sounds great!!

Kestrel
Jul-13-2017, 20:18
Next weekend (not this weekend) will have a major update with lots of news, photos, and video.

Great! We will all be looking forward to it! :thumbsup:

IIJG27Rich
Jul-21-2017, 19:28
I debated about doing an update today but decided not to. Next weekend (not this weekend) will have a major update with lots of news, photos, and video.



No update?? :recon:

RAF74_Buzzsaw
Jul-21-2017, 19:29
No update?? :recon:

Tomorrow. ;)

♣_Spiritus_♣
Jul-21-2017, 19:30
No update?? :recon:

Tomorrow, technically it is still the workweek for me.

9./JG52 Kettarian_Fox
Jul-22-2017, 02:29
Tomorrow, technically it is still the workweek for me.

Hype intensifies!

ATAG_Flare
Jul-22-2017, 10:46
Attention! Major update inbound! Prepare yourselves! The hype is out of control!

Sent from my Nexus 5X using Tapatalk

ATAG_Freya
Jul-22-2017, 11:41
http://i.imgur.com/pyFY72V.gif

:)

ATAG_Highseas
Jul-26-2017, 12:32
. HYPER HYPE OVERDRIVE.

And.....

Im ok again.

:D

ATAG_Flare
Sep-20-2017, 13:00
Sorry for the thread revive.....

I'm just wondering if 4.5 will fix the bug where large caliber shells (20mm and up) don't produce sounds when they hit you?

Hyperus
Sep-20-2017, 15:47
Sorry for the thread revive.....

I'm just wondering if 4.5 will fix the bug where large caliber shells (20mm and up) don't produce sounds when they hit you?


Does that happen with every round? Or just sometimes, cuz i remember a lot of times where a Spitfire lit me up and i didnt hear it

Knight
Dec-02-2017, 21:46
Just one question are we going to see the Hurricane MKIIb in the 4.5?

RAF74_Buzzsaw
Dec-02-2017, 22:21
Just one question are we going to see the Hurricane MKIIb in the 4.5?

No, the Hurri II's are for TF 5.0.

No completely new aircraft, TF 4.5 or IL-2 Sturmovik: CLIFFS OF DOVER - BLITZ is an update of the original game.

Some of the previous AI types from the original game have been made flyable, (like the Beaufighter) and there are some new variant types, (like the Bf-110C-6) but no completely new types.

This is a free update. When we start releasing completely new aircraft, like the Hurricane IIA/B/C etc. we will need to start charging for the privilege of flying them. ;)

=vit_unit=
Dec-03-2017, 00:51
We need the patch note (readme) of what changes this update brings ;)

Me and some other people thought hurricane mkIIb was going to be presented in 4.5 because it was written about in previous updates concerning 4.5.

RAF74_Buzzsaw
Dec-03-2017, 01:26
We need the patch note (readme) of what changes this update brings ;)

Me and some other people thought hurricane mkIIb was going to be presented in 4.5 because it was written about in previous updates concerning 4.5.

No, Hurri II's were never promised for TF 5.0.

When 4.5 was announced, a list of aircraft was clearly explained.

Hurri I Fighter-Bomber for 4.5.... yes.

Mastiff
Dec-04-2017, 14:44
delet this

Mastiff
Dec-04-2017, 14:45
As May comes to a close, TFS is pushing closer and closer to finishing up the next patch for the community. As things start to come together and testing begins, we wanted to reach out and give everyone somewhat of a "change log" of sorts about what to expect with 4.5. This list isn't everything nor is it finalized (see last week's post) with things possibly being added if time allows.

The amount of work that has been done is impressive and the man hours involved countless. TFS sees 4.5 as what we hope will be a definitive and final version of the original Cliffs of Dover, with additional aircraft, bugfixes, and improvements which bring the game up to the level the original developers had hoped for.

That said, here is a sample of what to expect with patch 4.5.

CODE:

- Complete rewrite of TFS mods to the source code.

- Enabling DX11

- Aircraft mirrors enabled

CORRECTED BUGS:

- Distant rivers looking like lakes

- Flashing plexiglass from bombers, known as the “Christmas tree effect”.

- Drained the three gigantic flooded water areas (#590) in France, aka known as "The Swimming Pools” @ AV02, BC16, BD14

- Grandvillier Airdrome @ BC07 corrected to show all airfield hangers

- Relly Norrante Fontes @ BF17 corrected to show all blast pens and Isbergues rail station.

- Somewhere in France removed unconnected railway buffer.

- Marquise West @ BA20 corrected to show 49 new objects, on airfield and nearby village.

- Campagne Les Guines @ BB20 corrected to show all 64 objects instead of 2 at airfield.

- East of St Tricat, German camp discovered and now showing.

- Frethun, railway station discovered and now showing.

- Spitfire I/IA/IIA cockpit fix for radiator lever. 29118

- Blenheim cockpit and bombardier cabin switches added. 29119 29120

- Field modded Hurricane bomb switches added to cockpit.

- Hurricane wooden trim wheel corrected

EFFECTS: (Nearly all “particle effects” have been reworked, below are some)

- Engine damage smokes

- Exhaust flames

- Oil leaks

- Dust/Dirt

- Muzzle flashes

- Shell casings

- Weapon smoke

- Projectile impacts on all surfaces

- Tracer effects

- De Wilde impact flashes

- Bomb/Artillery explosions

- Vehicle explosions

- Flak effects

- Fuel fires

- Fuel explosions

- Aircraft crash explosions/fires

- Environmental smoke

- Chimney smoke

- Ship wakes


SOUND:

- Sound catalogs being worked to hopefully provide great improvements for 4.5


TERRAIN:

-New English landscape.

-New French landscape.

- New shaders

NEW FLYABLE AIRCRAFT:

- Beaufighter 1F Dayfighter (early) and 1NF Nightfighter (early) with Hercules III engine (The Beaufighter 1C with Hercules IX will not appear until TF 5.0).

- Bf-110C-6 anti-shipping and ground attack version, with 30mm cannon fuselage pod. 28426 28427

- Bf-110C-4B, (early ground attack) with low altitude optimized DB601Aa engines.

- Hurricane I Rotol Fighter-Bomber fitted with eight, 40 pound bombs. Note: This aircraft can be definitively confirmed to have been used in the Desert and from Malta... but so far there has been no confirmation it was used on the Channel Front. We decided to include it in TF 4.5 for two reasons... 1) It would probably be missed in all the excitement over the new aircraft... (there will be a Fighter-Bomber version of the Hurri IIB) and 2) It will give mission builders on the Channel map the opportunity to build campaigns with fighter-bombers on both sides. If users prefer not to include the aircraft, that is their choice. 28428

- Blenheim IV, IVF (Late) with twin Browning rear turret. Bomb load additions include eight, 40 pound fuselage mounted bombs. Blenheim IV also has the ability of caring at least 2, possibly 4 SBC’s in the main bay, each holding six 40 pound bombs. 28429
28430

- Armed Tiger Moths variants, one with four 25 lb bombs, one with wing-mount .303 Vickers, and one with cockpit mount Czech 7.92mm firing through prop. We included the version with the bombs because it was a historical BoB aircraft... a last resort to be used if the Germans landed. The other two are included because we believe players will enjoy the opportunity to dogfight with a biplane... we hope to see all Tiger Moth maps as short fun missions.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h6XSpOFWa0Q


FM/DM FIXES:

- Spitfire fire (or lack of) bug corrected

- Re-mapped power physics .dll which corrects the engine bug, Spit MkIIA brakes/windmilling prop/restart, Tiger moth rudder trim, and numerous, numerous other corrections!


MISCELLANEOUS:

- Tom's Air Force Bases/Maps

- New pilot uniforms and accessories

SKINS:

More than a handful of new skins for Channel aircraft. Here is one of the Beaufighter. (Reached my MB limit!)

28431

28432as it states in the list i highlighted it and bold gold

ATAG_Colander
Dec-04-2017, 14:47
I guess one "I" too many :)

ATAG_Highseas
Dec-04-2017, 14:51
I guess one "I" too many :)

roflmao

RAF74_Buzzsaw
Dec-04-2017, 19:31
Edited.