PDA

View Full Version : Playability and FPS question



Tigertooo
Feb-26-2013, 05:43
I know several people have very low FPS flying CloD, due to hardware issues.Sometimes the sim is even unplayable for them.
Will this issue be adressed in the future so more pilots can fly more comfortable?
In other words, can one expect higher FPS in the future with whatever same hardware one has?
Thank you

Injerin
Feb-26-2013, 05:49
This issue has been addressed multiple times, and there are multiple settings to make the game run smoother for all types of hardware set-ups. Check the
Tech. section of these forums or you can try here--->http://forum.1cpublishing.eu/forumdisplay.php?f=191

Osprey
Feb-26-2013, 06:46
How many have tried the latest patch TigerToo? Word on the street is that TP last considered COD pre- last patch and rejected it. How many of the low FPS guys actually bought it or tried it since? You guys also run co-op with lots of AI right? What are the numbers you are expecting to face? COD is only about a tenner these days btw, no reason not to have it.

TBH mate PC gaming isn't cheap. I'd doubt they could run BF3 if you can't run this, that's what XBox and PS3 is for ;)

PS, Tell Hatter that BHA are going down at the Amex, "There are teachers and there are pupils....." :devilish:

SlipBall
Feb-26-2013, 06:54
How many have tried the latest patch TigerToo? Word on the street is that TP last considered COD pre- last patch and rejected it. How many of the low FPS guys actually bought it or tried it since? You guys also run co-op with lots of AI right? What are the numbers you are expecting to face? COD is only about a tenner these days btw, no reason not to have it.

TBH mate PC gaming isn't cheap. I'd doubt they could run BF3 if you can't run this, that's what XBox and PS3 is for ;)

PS, Tell Hatter that BHA are going down at the Amex, "There are teachers and there are pupils....." :devilish:

Very expensive, but resistance is futile :thumbsup:

TheVino3
Feb-26-2013, 07:15
I just want to say (and this is NOT representative of the Team Fusion opinion) that this game is not a game that runs fine on most systems - it needs a fairly hefty system to play well, some manage with low end systems which seems to me to just be luck of the draw somehow.
Im all for making this game open to more people, but its not ever going to be open to people who run old outdated systems that cant run 1946 very well.

This sim is still ahead of its time really, and people who have PCs that are behind the times can hardly expect to run it well - if at all.
As Osprey says: PC gaming is not cheap.

Cheers

Tigertooo
Feb-26-2013, 08:56
I think i mis-phrased my question (I'm Belgian so me and English.....)
I do know FPS depends on one's hardware, i know Clod is hardware demanding, i know upgrading costs money and i know of different tweeks of the Sim as well of one's graphic card. So i'll rephrase the question: on my system, Clod runs well on "high" settings. Will i notice an increase of FPS on my system, due to any future patch?
Sorry for not being clear enough

Continu0
Feb-26-2013, 09:06
How many have tried the latest patch TigerToo? Word on the street is that TP last considered COD pre- last patch and rejected it. How many of the low FPS guys actually bought it or tried it since? You guys also run co-op with lots of AI right? What are the numbers you are expecting to face? COD is only about a tenner these days btw, no reason not to have it.

TBH mate PC gaming isn't cheap. I'd doubt they could run BF3 if you can't run this, that's what XBox and PS3 is for ;)

PS, Tell Hatter that BHA are going down at the Amex, "There are teachers and there are pupils....." :devilish:

I am not sure if I get you right (not a naitive speaker), but I can play BF3 perfectly smooth whereas CloD just stutters when there are many bulidings around... So I really still believe that the engine is just not optimized...

I`ll get a new Grapics-Card soon and will see how much it helps...

Osprey
Feb-26-2013, 09:08
Hopefully TF will work on things which enhance the sim with content for those of us who supported it through the tough times (like now) than spend copious amounts of resource scraping the barrel trying to appease users with outdated hardware who aren't going to upgrade and/or haven't tried the latest patch. :recon:

Osprey
Feb-26-2013, 09:11
....I can play BF3 perfectly smooth whereas CloD just stutters when there are many bulidings around... So I really still believe that the engine is just not optimized...


Or it just does a whole lot more than BF3....... :-P

Tigertooo
Feb-26-2013, 09:18
Hopefully TF will work on things which enhance the sim with content for those of us who supported it through the tough times (like now) than spend copious amounts of resource scraping the barrel trying to appease users with outdated hardware who aren't going to upgrade and/or haven't tried the latest patch. :recon:
Sorry if i unintentionally offended you but i was just wondering on a personal note. I don't have an outdated system, i only upgraded a year ago and i've tried all patches and still fly Clod with pleasure.

Osprey
Feb-26-2013, 10:46
I'm not offended in the slightest TT so there is no need to apologise. I can't comment on the patch because I do not know, though I am not aware of any performance enhancements so I would suspect you will not see any improvements. I think there are some old features being added back so if anything it may regress on some systems.

trooph
Feb-26-2013, 19:03
My ring is not that outdated...and i get a lot of stutter and micropauses... TBH it runs better with higher settings than with lower ones for some reason but when i set everything to high its too damn annoying to see a micropause during a dogfight.
I can run bf3 with 80+fps most of the time.
I think the question was. Will TF look in to ClODs code during further game development to remove "junk code" and try to increase games stability and stuff that causes a lot of problems, including those that lower game performance.

ATAG_Bliss
Feb-26-2013, 19:09
I think the question was. Will TF look in to ClODs code during further game development to remove "junk code" and try to increase games stability and stuff that causes a lot of problems, including those that lower game performance.

Most definitely! We want it smooth as silk as much as everyone else.

TheVino3
Feb-26-2013, 19:11
Not commenting on looking into code down the track, but can people stop comparing this to BF3?
Ive no doubts that you can all run BF3 on incredible settings, as it is very much a thinner game and optimised completely to do what it does - a linear shooter. Nothing wrong with it, but its like saying "my dishwasher runs fine, but not when I put clothes in it" :)

ATAG_Snapper
Feb-26-2013, 19:14
........but its like saying "my dishwasher runs fine, but not when I put clothes in it" :)

Ha! Good one! :thumbsup:

Tigertooo
Feb-27-2013, 08:15
Most definitely! We want it smooth as silk as much as everyone else.
Thank you

trooph
Feb-27-2013, 16:03
Thank U Bliss for that answer :)

Tvrdi
Feb-27-2013, 16:19
Not commenting on looking into code down the track, but can people stop comparing this to BF3?
Ive no doubts that you can all run BF3 on incredible settings, as it is very much a thinner game and optimised completely to do what it does - a linear shooter. Nothing wrong with it, but its like saying "my dishwasher runs fine, but not when I put clothes in it" :)

Thers no point in comparing BF3 with CLOD as all "hardcore" sims in general are more hardware demanding (for obvious reasons). Having that in mind and knowing CLOD uses very detailed and advanced DM and FM allong with the DX11 and teh answer is right there. You will need a strong system to run it. My expereince (after last offical patch) is great with med to high settings and that is on 1920x1200. And I dont have top noch pc (GTX660Ti 2GB and i7920 Oc to 3.5Ghz). Before the last official patch I/we had a problem with effects which caused noticable fps drop but that is (more or less) fixed in the last patch. I believe, with time, we all would have a better systems and TS will do their best to optimize the code (if they will have know how and time).

Tigertooo
Feb-27-2013, 16:20
Thank U Bliss for that answer :)
as i said before: Thanks indeed for a proper answer

priller26
Mar-01-2013, 05:40
Down the road a bit when the new Nvidia Titan with SIX gigs of Vram drops in price, I'm betting such graphic cards along with TF fine work will make fps problems a thing of the past. I'm very encouraged.

trooph
Mar-01-2013, 08:43
Not all of us can afford 3k euro rig.. Im looking for an upgrade this year but i have to choose cpu mobo ram ssd up or just get gpu like gtx 670 4gb..
Indeed all flight sims are demanding..
Sorry for OT

Kristorf
Mar-01-2013, 10:19
Easiest way to get a decent FPS on older systems is to turn shadows off, quick and free.

priller26
Mar-01-2013, 23:50
Not all of us can afford 3k euro rig.. Im looking for an upgrade this year but i have to choose cpu mobo ram ssd up or just get gpu like gtx 670 4gb..
Indeed all flight sims are demanding..
Sorry for OT

I went with a 580 with 3gigs of ram which has been working quite well for me, although I do realize lots of issues with the last patch of the game were due to code, optimization and not our systems. I think you need a beefy cpu to, I didnt realize the new Intels were so much faster, or I would have gone for that instead of the amd x6thurban 1100...stock 3.3, mine running 3.8, fast, but not as fast as it could be. Live and learn.

Tvrdi
Mar-02-2013, 02:57
Not all of us can afford 3k euro rig.. Im looking for an upgrade this year but i have to choose cpu mobo ram ssd up or just get gpu like gtx 670 4gb..
Indeed all flight sims are demanding..
Sorry for OT

:P You dont need 3k euro for CLOD rig.....GTX660TI and some decent i5 would be enough...also an expensive SSD isnt a must, FPS wise....

Moggy
Mar-02-2013, 05:54
How many have tried the latest patch TigerToo? Word on the street is that TP last considered COD pre- last patch and rejected it. How many of the low FPS guys actually bought it or tried it since? You guys also run co-op with lots of AI right? What are the numbers you are expecting to face? COD is only about a tenner these days btw, no reason not to have it.

TBH mate PC gaming isn't cheap. I'd doubt they could run BF3 if you can't run this, that's what XBox and PS3 is for ;)

PS, Tell Hatter that BHA are going down at the Amex, "There are teachers and there are pupils....." :devilish:

Every Thursday we're doing something with Cliffs of Dover.

P.S. We do realise that coming to the Amex is your cup final. Oh and can you tell the other fans that Burberry is not a good look. I nearly threw up when I saw that Palace fan yell out "EAGLES" at East Croydon station...even his mates looked embarrassed to be with him. :D

Osprey
Mar-04-2013, 11:43
LMAO! Who cares what goes on at E Croydon station? What matters is on the pitch, and that's 3-0 @ SP thanks :)

As for the Amex, we try to think of it as a night out at a comedy club rather than a cup final. Besides, just remind me which team gave you your first ever Championship league defeat there? FFS Murray!! Ouch!

We'll see anyway, it looks like we could meet in the playoffs if you can hang on and not be displaced by Forest! :-P

Roblex
Mar-04-2013, 12:35
I suppose another angle to look at is...

Is it easy to make as much as possible of any new eye-candy 'Optional'? I know there will be things that people may get an advantage from if they turn it off but there must be other stuff that will lower frame rates and is not strictly necessary. While things are being added, is it easy to make checkboxes to allow us to turn them off if we start having fps problems?

ATAG_Snapper
Mar-04-2013, 12:54
I suppose another angle to look at is...

Is it easy to make as much as possible of any new eye-candy 'Optional'? I know there will be things that people may get an advantage from if they turn it off but there must be other stuff that will lower frame rates and is not strictly necessary. While things are being added, is it easy to make checkboxes to allow us to turn them off if we start having fps problems?

Good point, IMHO.

I guess the obvious example is "trees". I've sometimes turned them off in exasperation after losing a low-flying enemy to them, but soon turn them back on because of the eye candy they provide. I don't see much of a fps hit with them on, but other PC's just might so I can't fault anyone exercising that option to maintain smooth gameplay. With more features being unlocked in upcoming patches, I'd hate to lose players because their systems get bogged down.

Kling
Mar-04-2013, 13:22
Good point, IMHO.

I guess the obvious example is "trees". I've sometimes turned them off in exasperation after losing a low-flying enemy to them, but soon turn them back on because of the eye candy they provide. I don't see much of a fps hit with them on, but other PC's just might so I can't fault anyone exercising that option to maintain smooth gameplay. With more features being unlocked in upcoming patches, I'd hate to lose players because their systems get bogged down.

The biggest FPS hit is shadows! If there was a way to keep the shadows in the cockpit ON BUT at the same time keep the tree shadows OFF, that would be a winner for me. Currently we are forced to have shimmering, fps eating tree shadows on if we want to also have nice shadows in the cockpit...:(

Catseye
Mar-04-2013, 13:56
The biggest FPS hit is shadows! If there was a way to keep the shadows in the cockpit ON BUT at the same time keep the tree shadows OFF, that would be a winner for me. Currently we are forced to have shimmering, fps eating tree shadows on if we want to also have nice shadows in the cockpit...:(

++1

Mattias
Mar-04-2013, 19:34
I suppose another angle to look at is...

Is it easy to make as much as possible of any new eye-candy 'Optional'? I know there will be things that people may get an advantage from if they turn it off but there must be other stuff that will lower frame rates and is not strictly necessary. While things are being added, is it easy to make checkboxes to allow us to turn them off if we start having fps problems?

:salute:

I understand your concern, but the new eye-candy is really easy on the system. Most of it comes from tweaking existing code to look better but still use the exact same cpu/gpu/vram resourses :thumbsup:

Cheers/m

ATAG_Snapper
Mar-04-2013, 19:43
:salute:

I understand your concern, but the new eye-candy is really easy on the system. Most of it comes from tweaking existing code to look better but still use the exact same cpu/gpu/vram resourses :thumbsup:

Cheers/m

You guys are "the bomb"! :thumbsup:

:)

thee_oddball
Mar-04-2013, 20:00
The biggest FPS hit is shadows! If there was a way to keep the shadows in the cockpit ON BUT at the same time keep the tree shadows OFF, that would be a winner for me. Currently we are forced to have shimmering, fps eating tree shadows on if we want to also have nice shadows in the cockpit...:(

I believe Specular lighting is the culprit that causes the shimmering, hopefully there will be a way to deal with it :)

Specular Lighting

In addition to the tweaks for two-sided lighting, we modify the specular illumination to enhance the realism. First, with normal specular lighting, distant trees tend to shimmer, so we reduce specular lighting according to distance. Next, we observed actual tree leaves to get some additional clues. Figure 4-16 shows some typical shiny leaves, and from it we observe three points. The specular reflection is dominated by a strong division of the leaf into two planes along its axis. Relative to the effect of these planes, the fine detail of the veins and other features is fairly insignificant. The specular power of the reflection is low: the reflections are not sharp, as they are on, say, a glassy material. Because we are interested in modeling on the scale of whole trees, not leaf veins, we use these observations to simplify our leaf specular model. To simulate the axial separation, we use a coarser V-shaped normal map to split the leaf into two halves. Finally, because too much detail in the specular contribution often results in shimmering, we bias the texture fetch to a lower mipmap level of the normal map. The end result is smoother, gentler specular lighting that does not introduce heavy lighting-related aliasing.
http://http.developer.nvidia.com/GPUGems3/gpugems3_ch04.html

Mattias
Mar-04-2013, 20:17
The biggest FPS hit is shadows! If there was a way to keep the shadows in the cockpit ON BUT at the same time keep the tree shadows OFF, that would be a winner for me. Currently we are forced to have shimmering, fps eating tree shadows on if we want to also have nice shadows in the cockpit...:(

:salute:

This is a good idea! I always play with shadows on because I can't live without it in the cockpit, but (at least) I never thought outside the box on this one :D
It's defiently worth looking into :thumbsup:

Cheers/m

Mattias
Mar-04-2013, 20:52
You guys are "the bomb"! :thumbsup:

:)

You are too kind Snapper :)

92 Sqn. Folmar (QJ-F)
Mar-04-2013, 20:53
But my dish washer washes my clothes very well in fact...

ATAG_Snapper
Mar-04-2013, 20:58
But my dish washer washes my clothes very well in fact...

hahaha! Do you have a microwave to dry em? :thumbsup:

:)

Kling
Mar-04-2013, 22:27
:salute:

This is a good idea! I always play with shadows on because I can't live without it in the cockpit, but (at least) I never thought outside the box on this one :D
It's defiently worth looking into :thumbsup:

Cheers/m

Cool!:)

Osprey
Mar-05-2013, 11:59
:salute:

This is a good idea! I always play with shadows on because I can't live without it in the cockpit, but (at least) I never thought outside the box on this one :D
It's defiently worth looking into :thumbsup:

Cheers/m


Just to throw the cat amongst the pigeons here, I agree it's a great idea for those struggling with FPS, but if I did this I would hate to lose the shadow of other aircraft too - in fact sometimes that is a warning, or gives an idea of height from an aircraft you are looking down upon. So, please consider turning off tree/building/landscape shadows but not aircraft ground shadow. I also think aircraft ground shadow is a bit blurred anyway and should be much sharper, especially down low.

92 Sqn. Philstyle (QJ-P)
Mar-05-2013, 12:19
Just to throw the cat amongst the pigeons here, I agree it's a great idea for those struggling with FPS, but if I did this I would hate to lose the shadow of other aircraft too - in fact sometimes that is a warning, or gives an idea of height from an aircraft you are looking down upon. So, please consider turning off tree/building/landscape shadows but not aircraft ground shadow. I also think aircraft ground shadow is a bit blurred anyway and should be much sharper, especially down low.

To throw another cat in among the, by now very alarmed, pigeons;

I would prefer building, landscape and cloud shadows to be independent of tree shadows.
Sitting inside a hanger bathed in full sunlight would be odd indeed, if one only meant to turn off the tree shadows.
Flying low, down-sun in the lee of a hill in bright sunlight would be immersion breaking.

Kling
Mar-05-2013, 13:53
To throw another cat in among the, by now very alarmed, pigeons;

I would prefer building, landscape and cloud shadows to be independent of tree shadows.
Sitting inside a hanger bathed in full sunlight would be odd indeed, if one only meant to turn off the tree shadows.
Flying low, down-sun in the lee of a hill in bright sunlight would be immersion breaking.

Well that was initially what I meant. Tree shadows at the moment only make the game look worse and eat loads of FPS. If there were a way to turn these shadows off be keep all the other ones, that would be great. But then again, I have no idea how the game is coded so I dont even know if this is possible.

Mattias
Mar-06-2013, 14:09
:salute:

If (and thats a big if and by no means a promise :D) we are able to remove just the shadows from the trees we will of course make the removal of it optional somehow :thumbsup:

Cheers/m

Kling
Mar-06-2013, 16:35
:salute:

If (and thats a big if and by no means a promise :D) we are able to remove just the shadows from the trees we will of course make the removal of it optional somehow :thumbsup:

Cheers/m

Well, lets hope for that then! :)

Catseye
Mar-06-2013, 17:20
:salute:

If (and thats a big if and by no means a promise :D) we are able to remove just the shadows from the trees we will of course make the removal of it optional somehow :thumbsup:

Cheers/m

I have a feeling that the lilnk is fairly complex in that if you remove the tree shadows you will also remove all other ground shadows (buildings) including aircraft shadows. Not a good thing IMHO.

Mattias
Mar-06-2013, 17:44
I have a feeling that the lilnk is fairly complex in that if you remove the tree shadows you will also remove all other ground shadows (buildings) including aircraft shadows. Not a good thing IMHO.

:salute: Catseye,

I agree and I'm only talking shadows from trees here. I'm not sure it's possible to separate them from other shadows since I have not tried yet (a lot of other stuff to be done first), just saying we will have a look at it :thumbsup:

Cheers/m

SlipBall
Mar-06-2013, 18:09
Another option to improve fps would be to do a system upgrade...just saying :D

Mattias
Mar-06-2013, 18:44
Another option to improve fps would be to do a system upgrade...just saying :D

:)

...but not a windows update :D

Kling
Mar-06-2013, 23:00
Another option to improve fps would be to do a system upgrade...just saying :D

No matter what system you have, enabling shadows will give tree shadows that look horrible and will make your game look worse than if the shadows were disabled.... ;)

Just saying..

SlipBall
Mar-07-2013, 04:52
I'm more into the airplane's then those trees way down there :-)

Kling
Mar-07-2013, 11:45
I'm more into the airplane's then those trees way down there :-)

Hehe but look at it this way, other planes around might happen some of the time, but the ground is always there no matter if you want it not.... So it would make sense to have it looking nice ;)

Or lets say like this, if the sky was purple and had black shimmering patches over it would you still say "Im more into airplanesthan those clouds up there"? ;)