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View Full Version : suggestions : change the "unstrap belts" thingy



OBT~Psycho
Apr-08-2013, 07:36
ok so don't get me wrong here, I'm all about "full realism", hardcore gamer.

but since the dawn of CoD, I've been annoyed by the way they modelled this thing.
It takes an awful amount of time to the pilot to change move their head in front of the gunsight. My opinion is that if we could do it faster would be really enjoyable, even if we go back to the 1946 style with no animation at all.
By the way, the reduction of head movement while focused on the gunsight just make me crazy and make it almost unusable in dogfight. You can't stay in "focus view" while chasing a man desperatly trying to shake you off of his tail. And trying to anticipate the movements of your enemy to pick the right moment to switch betwen "seat" and "gunsight" without loosing contact is almost way out of my skill... Am I the only one?

This is not really an issue when flying RAF as the gunsight is centered in the cockpit, but it become really tricky once in a 109. I know, if you fly Luftwaffe, best tactic beeing Boom an Zoom, you still can manage to use this function without getting bothered too much, but still... It's annoying.

So what's the community opinion about this and is this feasible?

ATAG_Snapper
Apr-08-2013, 08:24
Hi Psycho and welcome to the forum. :salute:

Others share your concern. Here's a fairly detailed post recently by Eco-Dragon: http://theairtacticalassaultgroup.com/forum/showthread.php?t=3969&p=41754&viewfull=1#post41754

Foul Ole Ron
Apr-08-2013, 08:41
Out of curiosity how did LW pilots handle the off-centre sights in real life? Did the pilot just shift his body a little to the right when looking to get a clear sight picture on the target? If that's the case then to my mind that real close up view could nearly be done away with - no pilot could lean that far forward (though it's definitely nice for picking out runways sometimes). We'd need something like a toggle button that caused the view then to shift right a touch to simulate the pilot moving to get a sight picture while keeping the same FOV that they're flying at. It would have to be something pretty quick as I'd presume that it was not much of an ordeal to use the sights.

OBT~Psycho
Apr-08-2013, 09:08
actually the fact that the sight was slightly off centered was meant to help the aiming. Considering that almost everybody were right-handers, the pilot would just have to close his left eye to be aligned with the sight.
Now that specific feature is hardly represented in simulators as we play with a single monitor. So there is a bias taken to the reality. Developpers have to choose between being relatively accurate in cockpit modeling and put the sight slightly to the right, or being "single display friendly" and put the sight in the center.

The feature you describe, Foul Ole Ron, was exactly what has been done in 1946. Just hit the "gunsight" button and your pilot was move a bit to center the sight. The FOV wasn't changed, you could still look around just as in "normal" situation. I think that then you were unable to lean, but whatever...

and thanks to Snapper, I will have a look at this topic.

TX-Gunslinger
Apr-08-2013, 09:18
Eco's post singulary concerns headshake - which is very non realistic.

On the gunsight part - I concur with the Clod implementation being a step-backward from original Il-2, in which the center on gunsight function was instant.

I use TrackIR5. I dampen down the left-right (X axis) settings - and just slide right when I want to shoot. For people without TrackIR or other 6 DOF head trackers, I imagine this results in the forced use of the "Loosen Shoulder Straps" command which is an awful solution.

IRL - the reflecter gunsights were centered on the pilots eye in Luftwaffe Aircraft by mounting the sight to the right of the cockpit centerline - and closing the left eye would allow centering. Although the Allied gunsights were in the center - humans do have binocular vision.

S!

Gunny

edit: LOL Psycho - simultaneous post

TheVino3
Apr-08-2013, 09:25
I believe you can hold the right mouse button and then move your viewpoint about the cockpit, and release the right mouse button when you have the viewpoint in your desired location. This way you can see the gunsight properlywithout having to lean towards it.

Cheers

OBT~Psycho
Apr-08-2013, 09:49
I believe you can hold the right mouse button and then move your viewpoint about the cockpit, and release the right mouse button when you have the viewpoint in your desired location. This way you can see the gunsight properlywithout having to lean towards it.

Cheers

I'm not sure about it. Will have to try, but I think you can not change the position of pilot's head. I think it is possible in ROF, where you can set up the default head position at your convenience, but once again I'm really not sure.

Katdog5
Apr-08-2013, 10:30
I believe you can hold the right mouse button and then move your viewpoint about the cockpit, and release the right mouse button when you have the viewpoint in your desired location. This way you can see the gunsight properlywithout having to lean towards it.

Cheers

+1

Yep. A non-issue.

1lokos
Apr-08-2013, 10:31
Alternative to "Loose shoulder straps/Unfast straps/Lean to gunsight...":

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p10GhgsPtzE

Sokol1

-Sven-
Apr-08-2013, 10:41
+1

Yep. A non-issue.

Oh that's marvelous, please describe to me how I, a pilot without TrackIR, can use this to center my view so the gunsight is always in my view? If I press center view I want that to be the default view. I'd very grateful as that would ease my gunnery-suffering by a substantial amount.

TheVino3
Apr-08-2013, 11:00
Oh that's marvelous, please describe to me how I, a pilot without TrackIR, can use this to center my view so the gunsight is always in my view? If I press center view I want that to be the default view. I'd very grateful as that would ease my gunnery-suffering by a substantial amount.

You cant make it the "default" location (as far as im aware) but its a pretty simple manouevre: right-click and hold, drag mouse a little to the right, release, youre done! :thumbsup:
Just make sure to do this at the start of every flight and you're good. Also, if you switch to an outside view and back in, you will have to repeat so dont do too much switching of views in a dogfight and you should be alright. Its not the perfect solution but to me it seems like a fairly decent way to do it.

Cheers

OBT~Psycho
Apr-08-2013, 11:37
Oh that's marvelous, please describe to me how I, a pilot without TrackIR, can use this to center my view so the gunsight is always in my view? If I press center view I want that to be the default view. I'd very grateful as that would ease my gunnery-suffering by a substantial amount.

that's what I am looking for. IIRC you can do this in flaming cliff by modifying a file where you enter the coordinates of your desired head default position, and you are good to go. every time you recenter your TrackIR, it will be at this very location

but have a look at the "109 quirks" thread, there are some nice ideas about alternatives to this now-called "non-issue" ;-)

OBT~Psycho
Apr-08-2013, 12:07
Alternative to "Loose shoulder straps/Unfast straps/Lean to gunsight...":

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p10GhgsPtzE

Sokol1

yep, not exactly what I expected but a place to looking for in there.

as I understand you are not using TrackIR, and I'm looking for a TrackIR solution. But what you showed rang some bells in my head:doh:

I just have to map the lean action on one of my unused hat! then when the place gets hot, I just have to adjust the position getting ready to engage some brave duels with brit's

'feel a bit stupid not having thought of such a thing way long before. I really like German airplanes, love their look, have build plenty of plactic models with iron crosses on them, but still could'nt find a trick to feel confortable in the gunnery part in CoD. anyway it definitely is worth a try

Katdog5
Apr-08-2013, 13:15
Oh that's marvelous, please describe to me how I, a pilot without TrackIR, can use this to center my view so the gunsight is always in my view? If I press center view I want that to be the default view. I'd very grateful as that would ease my gunnery-suffering by a substantial amount.

theres no such thing as a pilot without trackir. get it.

vranac
Apr-08-2013, 15:25
as I understand you are not using TrackIR, and I'm looking for a TrackIR solution. But what you showed rang some bells in my head:doh:

I just have to map the lean action on one of my unused hat! then when the place gets hot, I just have to adjust the position getting ready to engage some brave duels with brit's


You can move your head little bit left and center it there, no need for constant moving your head.It will move from the center after few turns
but it is easy to center it again.

Better solution is with newview and it works with TrackIR also.

OBT~Psycho
Apr-08-2013, 17:27
yep, that's the main answer I got when we discussed about this thread with squad mates during our monday session.

I think it is the easiest way so far.

will give it a try soon...

1lokos
Apr-08-2013, 19:59
.... and I'm looking for a TrackIR solution.


First: dont use anymore the function "Loose../Unfast../Lean" (Shift+F1).

Use your TrackIR to center 109 gunsight (like people without TrackIR use NewView - that emulate TrackIr with joy HAT).

From someone tips:


1. Center Track IR before going in game.
2. Select your 109 aircraft.
3. In game move your Head LEFT until you loose the Reticle completely, hold your head there.
4. With your head position frozen as in STEP 3 Re center Track IR
5. Move head to its neutral position .. Bingo new center is looking straight at the Revi.

At end you have you 109 gunsight always centered - like in this above YT video, and dont suffer view restriction of Shift+F1.



I just have to map the lean action on one of my unused hat!


3 - Use this unused HAT to change FOV, ex:
Hat up = FOV 90
Hat down = FOV 70
Hat right = FOV 30

So when fire in Tommies use FOV 90 (close view).:thumbsup:

Ok, this is not what all "Luft's" want - in game already centered gunsight, since il-2 first days at twelve years ago - but probable is the best solution, until someone in TF find in the mess of CloD code how change this... or the il-2 BoS came with gunsight already centered... :D

One thing: Use NewView dont exclude use TrackIR at same time, and is not restricted/usefull to Bf-109 only:
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v259/PauloDRK/blen-bussola_zpsa27eb6e4.jpg

Sokol1

OBT~Psycho
Apr-14-2013, 05:08
hi again,
I found a release of NewView and now I'm struggling to get it working. So far I just had a look at the software, but a squad mate get his hands dirty but is stuck.
Is there a place where we could find some instructions or tutorial on NewView? Or may be someone can help here.

I would like to clarify the way to get it working in the same time of the TrackIR... I've seen some parameters but I can't figure out the way it's supposed to be set.

By the way, how can we know what are the coordinates of a positionof your head? I would like to set some quickview button for the compas on the spit for example. Do I just have to mess with the numbers or is there a more practical way?

thanks in advance

rollingstoned
Apr-23-2013, 18:22
I dont even bother leaning in on the sights in a dogfight, i just shoot from the hip using tracers. I am also a complete nub, but i would go into a single player and just practice shooting down dodging targets without leaning to the sights; You will get proficient at this very quickly as you are not compensating for optical zoom etc. i do not suggest this without tracers. For more stationary targets of course i use the gunsights... but who cares about non evasive trargets

Flyingblind
Apr-24-2013, 09:17
I find a quick and easy way of getting some target practice is to shoot your own AI wingman. They are programmed to stick on your six come what may and do so with increasing desperation as you try and get on theirs. They are always there so no need to search for them and they never run away. The suckers. Best not tried online with human pilots though.