PDA

View Full Version : Invincible Defiant!



EG14_Marcast
Jun-26-2013, 11:00
I made a mission with BR20 bombers escorted by G50s and intercepted by Hurricanes. Flying a G50, I changed the Hurricanes with Defiants (I never used this type before) forgetting the aerial gunnery at the top. Result: a massacre. All the italian fighters shot down at first contact. So I changed the aerial gunnery to average, but again all the G50s shot down or damaged in a few time. Have you found some special tactics to face the Defiant? I read that they were vulnerable to front attack but it's very difficult to get that approach in dogfight, and I can't believe that a type which was withdrawn from the battle in a short time due to the heavy losses couldn't be beaten in any other way!

ATAG_Snapper
Jun-26-2013, 11:29
The 109 pilots had a nasty shock the first time they encountered Defiants, mistaking them for Hurricanes and approaching them conventionally from behind. They caught on quickly though and adjusted their tactics accordingly to effectively knock the Defiants out of the sky (attacking from below and also head on IIRC).

Dutch
Jun-26-2013, 13:52
How I wish we had a flyable and multicrewable Defiant!

Can you imagine how much fun they'd be online? The Tactical possibilities for Defiants playing 'Tail end Charlie' to a flight of Spits or Hurris!! And the complaints from Spittie jocks because the Defiants couldn't keep up?

The endless confusion over teamspeak, with gunners giving pilots orders? The shock and horror from all the B&Z 109 experten? It would be fantastic. :D

GerritJ9
Jun-30-2013, 10:00
It would certainly make my week, month even, if the Defiant were ever to be a flyable!

Gromit
Jul-01-2013, 04:58
It would certainly make my week, month even, if the Defiant were ever to be a flyable!

You ever want a crewman, just let me know, failing that can we take a Lewis gun up in a Tiger Moth:-)

Oersted
Jul-04-2013, 15:23
It would be a huge modelling job, but the mechanics are already in the sim, with the Blennie dorsal turret. I'd LOVE to see a Defiant modelled as flyable! One can dream...

1lokos
Jul-04-2013, 15:52
The Br.20 turret is more apropriated (as base), since is the only in game that are powered. Bul still the "infamous" 5 m/s vertical movement...

Sokol1

Tonester
Jul-04-2013, 18:49
Can we just give it a hurricane cockpit?...im kinda kidding....dont want to see the frankenplane fiasco that accompanied the start of il2 modding...Ranwars did some great stuff though with what he had back then....would be fun to fly i think...we can but dream

Wulf
Jul-04-2013, 19:53
I made a mission with BR20 bombers escorted by G50s and intercepted by Hurricanes. Flying a G50, I changed the Hurricanes with Defiants (I never used this type before) forgetting the aerial gunnery at the top. Result: a massacre. All the italian fighters shot down at first contact. So I changed the aerial gunnery to average, but again all the G50s shot down or damaged in a few time. Have you found some special tactics to face the Defiant? I read that they were vulnerable to front attack but it's very difficult to get that approach in dogfight, and I can't believe that a type which was withdrawn from the battle in a short time due to the heavy losses couldn't be beaten in any other way!

I have only flown against Defiants in the 109, so I'm not sure exactly how well a more lightly armed Italian fighter is going to fair, but you're right, a formation of Defiants can be a difficult proposition from some angles.

As noted by Snapper, an attack from below is probably the best approach. To do this climb well above the enemy and commence a conventional diving attack with a pursuit curve that takes you down behind and below the formation and then back up through it. If done properly, this should put you back into an attacking position once again, above the formation and out of gun range. You should be doing about 400kph+ at the merge. Alternatively, you can mount a more direct attack from above but this should be done from a somewhat steeper angle (around 90 degrees), to reduce the effectiveness of the Defiant's defensive fire. Commence your attack from a position above and slightly forward of the formation and if possible slightly off to one side or the other. You should be doing about 450-500kpm+ at the merge. Return to altitude after you pass through the formation for another attack. And remember, you will have less than a second's shooting time in these circumstances. Timing is extremely important.

Hope this helps.

GerritJ9
Jul-06-2013, 18:08
There's an interesting instruction film about the Boulton Paul turret as fitted to the Defiant, made by the RAF in 1940, titled "The RAF at war, The Unseen Films 1940 5 of 5, the Boulton Paul Turret." It shows details such as how the ammo boxes were fitted etc etc. Might be useful if anybody wants to model the turret in future.