setting up DCS P-51

[Old_Canuck]

Second landing attempt in simulator mode. Not very pretty but more parts still attached than the previous attempt. This happened near the end of the rollout. Got TIR working and basic flight controls except CH throttle quadrant. It sees the quad. but I haven't found the right parameter to enter yet. Trial and error I suppose. First day of flying was kind of pleasant. It's not easy and that's the way we likes it right?

4070

[Foul Ole Ron]

Yeah the landing is a good deal more challenging than CloD, ROF, etc. It took me a while to get consistent at it. What works for me is keeping the rpm at 2500 and mp at around 20" during the approach. Starrt putting flaps down at 250mph and then dropping some more once I go below 200mph, trimming as I go all the time. At 150mph I drop the gear and then bring it in so I'm going maybe 110mph or so once I pass over the start of the runway. Then flare a little and chop the throttle totally as I touch down - find this prevents the bumps back up into the air which plagued my landings at first.

Of course you have to remember to remove that elevator trim and flaps if you refuel and go to take off again. 30 degrees flap and a whole pile of elevator trim makes for an interesting take off experience for about 10 seconds after which I made a fiery crater in the ground.

[Old_Canuck]

Thanks for the advice, Foul Ol Ron. Will write this down and give it a try again today. My landings were 30 MPH too hot by your numbers. :salute:

[gavagai]

Aim for a 3-point landing at 90mph, or you will bounce and bad things can happen.

The DCS P-51 makes me think that our other flight sims go way, way easy on us when it comes to takeoff and landing, including Clod. Rise of Flight is just a joke except for the Nieuports and Sopwith Dolphin.

[Old_Canuck]

Finally after 5 attempts a little bouncy but all good. Will try 90 MPH next thx. I love this difficulty. This old boy is a new DCS fan now :thumbsup:

[Archie]

Took my new P51 up for a ride yesterday, after getting to grips with the start up, taxying and take off tutorials.They sure are useful (and required!) watching.
Start up procedure is pretty easy, taxying, once I stopped going round in circles was ok, and I actually managed to take off in the thing successfully!
I never really liked the 'stang in il2, but love it in DCS, it does actually feel 'real' and sounds fantastic on flyby view.
One day I might even try a landing!
It certainly feels like a step up from CoD, and I love CoD. It will be interesting when they bring the 109 out, that will probably be a real swine to land in...

[[MORK]Dedagain]

Managed to take off after 4 attempts and managed landing with just one bent wheel .
I am still having problems in the final engine start up ,as engine never seems to want to kick in to alter the mixture as per tutorial.

[Foul Ole Ron]

This works 100% of the time for me:

Get everything set for ignition. Prime for a full 6 seconds. Switch on the engine and wait for it to sort of cough 2 times as it gets going properly. Then flick the mixture switch to RUN and you should be good to go.

[Archie]

Yes I think the tutorial says to prime for 1 second, and 4 in cold weather (something like that) but priming for a bit longer works for me as well.

[Old_Canuck]

Thanks for the advice early in this thread guys. After almost 10 attempts the pony landed sweetly on three points without bouncing. Now I'll have to try it right side up lol. Seriously, it seemed like a milestone so I saved a track. DCS getting into prop planes is the best thing to happen for a long while in the flight sim world IMHO.

[airdoc]

What I found very helpful for take off and landing was to introduce a bit of a curve in the sensitivity of the rudder. Those nervous, jerky pushes that I did with my feet now have less of an impact at small deflections and don't flip me over.
Also, after landing I use small very brief pushes on the appropriate toe brakes in order to steer the airplane. And don't forget to always lock the tailwheel by pulling back on the stick whenever your aircraft is in contact with the ground!

[[MORK]Dedagain]

This works 100% of the time for me:

Get everything set for ignition. Prime for a full 6 seconds. Switch on the engine and wait for it to sort of cough 2 times as it gets going properly. Then flick the mixture switch to RUN and you should be good to go.

Thanks will try this cheers.

[AKA_Recon]

anyone else having issues where the view is bouncing all around on them while in flight ?

wasn't sure if it was a trim problem or something wrong with my setup.

[AKA_Recon]

Took my new P51 up for a ride yesterday, after getting to grips with the start up, taxying and take off tutorials.They sure are useful (and required!) watching.
Start up procedure is pretty easy, taxying, once I stopped going round in circles was ok, and I actually managed to take off in the thing successfully!
I never really liked the 'stang in il2, but love it in DCS, it does actually feel 'real' and sounds fantastic on flyby view.
One day I might even try a landing!
It certainly feels like a step up from CoD, and I love CoD. It will be interesting when they bring the 109 out, that will probably be a real swine to land in...

brilliant that they have this - goes to show the level of detail - not just in FM, etc... but in all aspects of the game. Love that quality!

[ChiefRedCloud]

I'm with you Canuck ... I haven't even got my Mustang out of it's crate yet and I'm absorbing all these tips ..... good stuff

[Catseye]

Second landing attempt in simulator mode. Not very pretty but more parts still attached than the previous attempt. This happened near the end of the rollout. Got TIR working and basic flight controls except CH throttle quadrant. It sees the quad. but I haven't found the right parameter to enter yet. Trial and error I suppose. First day of flying was kind of pleasant. It's not easy and that's the way we likes it right?

4070

Yup, doing the same thing.
Went online and got the keymap and now going through my Warthog Hotas and inserting them. I think this will take a month to work out all the programming snags and become familiar with the settings.

I made 4 landings.
First one was great approach bounced then ran off the runway and broke things.
Second time, hit hard and broke everything.
Third time, crabbed in to lose height but airspeed was too high and bounced my way to broken undercarriage when trying to keep in on the runway.
Fourth time made it OK and taxied to the apron in front of the hanger.

Not that it's getting better but I'm beginning to get the feel of how it bleeds speed and the correct approach angle. Just more time in the saddle is all.

Cheers,
Cats . . .

[gavagai]

Flying the DCS P-51 changed the way I land in other flight sims, especially Clod. I pay a lot more attention to my approach speed in Clod and try for a 3 point landing every time. In the other direction, Clod left me totally unprepared for the DCS P-51.

[Dutch]

Flying the DCS P-51 changed the way I land in other flight sims, especially Clod. I pay a lot more attention to my approach speed in Clod and try for a 3 point landing every time. In the other direction, Clod left me totally unprepared for the DCS P-51.

Pffft. The P-51 is a doddle compared to the Nieuport 17 mate. Don't think I've ever landed one of those in one piece. Well, maybe once.

[Headshot]

Once you master take off and lading I'd be interested in knowing how people go up against the terminator AI P51 in the quick mission. I've spent hours on it and only managed to kill my engine hit the ground or get chewed up and spat out by Arnold.

[Foul Ole Ron]

First thing you'll want to do is fully open up both radiators. The auto settings just can't keep up with the type of energy fighting the AI does as the steep climb to stall is rough on the airflow over the engine. The AI isn't too imaginative but does know how to keep its speed up.

Don't try to turn hard after the initial head on pass to instantly try to get on his six or you'll blow chunks of energy and will lose him as he climbs. I usually do a climbing turn and work on steadily getting on his six through a succession of climbs and dives. It's actually very good practice for flying the Mustang towards the edge of its envelop.

To keep my engine alive against the AI I usually fly at 2700rpm and 50" mp with rads fully open. I find that gives me enough speed to tackle the AI while also keeping me in the fight for long enough to hunt him down.

[gavagai]

Pffft. The P-51 is a doddle compared to the Nieuport 17 mate. Don't think I've ever landed one of those in one piece. Well, maybe once.

See my first post in this thread.

The Nieuport 17 requires a very different skillset compared to the P-51. Flaring the N17 before touchdown is about the worst thing you can do!

[Dutch]

Flaring the N17 before touchdown is about the worst thing you can do!

Really? No flare? So you mean a 'wheeler' landing? Thanks for the tip. I'm slowly (very slowly) working my way through the RFC career with it, off and on. Think I've landed intact once. Cheers! :thumbsup:

The P-51 is ok I find. It's a lot more sensitive to control input than the models in Cliffs, but I'd say the techniques are very similar. I'd post a vid for the Canuck's benefit, but I still can't upload vids because of a windows error I can't eradicate.

I've also found with the P-51 that it's essential to lower the axis control sensitivity in the 'axis tune' menus. Mine is currently set up with no deadzones, 100% saturation and curvature on '10'. I had the curvature much less sensitive than this initially, while I got used to it, and am now gradually lowering it. I'm sure it'll be different for different controllers, but lowering the curvatures certainly helps with control initially. :thumbsup:

[Catseye]

Pffft. The P-51 is a doddle compared to the Nieuport 17 mate. Don't think I've ever landed one of those in one piece. Well, maybe once.

Serves you right for flying French aircraft.

Not enough Garlic and Wine.

[Dutch]

Serves you right for flying French aircraft.

Not enough Garlic and Wine.

You're right. Sorry. I should know better by now. So how is 'Dewoitaine' pronounced again? :D

[ChiefRedCloud]

Pffft. The P-51 is a doddle compared to the Nieuport 17 mate. Don't think I've ever landed one of those in one piece. Well, maybe once.

Not to detract from this thread but I always thought the DR1 was the prom queen when it came to a good landing. It just will NOT stop rolling ......

[gavagai]

Yeah, but it doesn't break a wing when you look at it funny.

I give first place to the Sopwith Dolphin for being the bitchiest WW1 crate to land. It's the only aircraft that will flip over and *kill you* right when you think you've rolled to a safe stop. We have to set up a "duck!" snap view for landing that thing.

[Maltloaf1]

I am getting the hang of the P51 slowly and landings and take offs are not perfect but at least workman like. However, I keep frying the engine every time I do any thing energetic. What I can't understand is the dials are all in the green when it happens. RPM less than 2500, temps in the green, manifold pressure well below the red line and the throttle only half open and bang! Suddenly no engine. Any ideas?

[Foul Ole Ron]

Define energetic?

One thing to bear in mind is that the temp gauge that you're seeing is not exactly precise so the actual temp of the engine can be hotter than what the gauge shows - this isn't a bug but a realistic representation of the gauge limitations.

The engine settings that you're describing shouldn't be causing any problems but if you're performing certain types of maneuvers it's possible you're over-stressing the engine. If you're doing vertical climbs that results in very little airflow over the engine and can quickly lead to overheating - especially if you're doing a few quickly in a row.

Opening up both radiators might help you out if you're performing maneuvers that are tough on the engine airflow as the auto settings just can't keep up - again a realistic representation of how they actually work. I can fly for a good period of time at 2700rpm and 50-55" MP once I have the radiators manually opened.

[Maltloaf1]

Not really very energetic! Not even aerobatics. I tried opening both rads manually and watched the gauges and temp seems ok. I have been flying against the FW190 and it is fairly difficult to watch the gauges and the Hun but I definitely have not been thrashing it and it still goes pop. Probably need to experiment a bit more.

[No.54 Ghost (KL-G)]

is there any way to see how much the radiators are open?
right now i open them to max right away and then just leave them there, but it would be nice to be able to know how much they are open so you can get more speed out of it when you need it

[Foul Ole Ron]

If you're fighting the FW-190 that means you'll be doing steep climbs to almost stall and then coming back down - the AI loves to do those over and over. The climb part can be tough on the engine airflow but if you go back down pretty vertically you can reduce that temp as you get very good engine airflow in the dive. If you have both rads open you really should be able to go at 2600 and 46" for quite a long period. If you want to keep up with the AI then 2500 and 30 something MP probably won't cut it.

[Foul Ole Ron]

is there any way to see how much the radiators are open?
right now i open them to max right away and then just leave them there, but it would be nice to be able to know how much they are open so you can get more speed out of it when you need it

The Mustang only has 4 settings that are controlled via the 4 way switches - Auto, Fully Open, Fully Closed and Off. You can't choose a setting of half-open manually. For normal flight you may as well leave it on Auto - it'll handle the temps just fine. For combat you'll definitely want to go to fully open both to handle the increased temps and also in case you get any battle damage and the Auto setting gets broken.

[ATAG_Headshot]

I have had a few random engine seizures with all temps in the norm. I looked into it a bit on the forums and I found someone saying that if you have your RPM too low but leave your manifold pressure high you can blow the engine pretty quick which made sense as I was flying 2300-2400 but still around 50 MP I think. If your MP is high you have to keep your RPM up even for cruising it seems

[Maltloaf1]

Thanks all. Food for thought. I hadn't realised that open meant fully open etc good to know. I'll play with a few things and see what happens.

[gavagai]

I have had a few random engine seizures with all temps in the norm. I looked into it a bit on the forums and I found someone saying that if you have your RPM too low but leave your manifold pressure high you can blow the engine pretty quick which made sense as I was flying 2300-2400 but still around 50 MP I think. If your MP is high you have to keep your RPM up even for cruising it seems


Yes, that's like trying to ride your bike uphill in high gear!

[PFT_Endy]

Thanks all. Food for thought. I hadn't realised that open meant fully open etc good to know. I'll play with a few things and see what happens.

Erm, to open the radiator fully you need to click and hold "open" button for several seconds. How long you hold it controls how much you open the radiator. You can see it looking from F2 view. Unless there's a setting I missed that opens it all the way by one button press but I don't think so...

[Foul Ole Ron]

Yep that's my bad actually :) Misread the manual a while back. Just tested it there. Open and Close do it incrementally. Takes about 15 seconds of holding it open to get it fully open. Always seemed a bit strange to me about fully open.. need to RTFM a bit more carefully.

[Maltloaf1]

Yes, that's like trying to ride your bike uphill in high gear!

But wouldn't that just stall the engine, same as a car rather than seize it solid. And 2400 rpm is still power band country surely. Having said that I haven't tried to start it again so it may be stalled rather than seized but the Big Bang it goes with implies it is terminal. No gentle grumble of grinding metal like Clod, just a satisfying Big Bang and a mental picture of many conrods sticking through the crank case wall and then silence.

[Foul Ole Ron]

2400 and 42 is max cruise so should be ok. I'm no expert on piston engines by any means but I think there's generally a limit on the manifold pressure that can be used at a particular RPM level. If you push the MP past that level you run the risk of over-stressing the engine and the engine cylinders which can end up in detonation - which sounds like what's happening to you when you get that bang and the prop comes to a dead halt. Maybe you can save a track next time it happens and we can take a look then on our end?

[gavagai]

The original comment was 2300-2400rpm and 50" mp. Very different from 42" and 2400rpm. Max sustained is 2700rpm and 46" mp.

[Maltloaf1]

Where do you get all the numbers from guys? Are the pilots notes available somewhere as that would make life easier? I am fairly sure trial and error was not the normal flight school method of teaching!

[Foul Ole Ron]

Towards the back of the manual it has a list of flight regimes. In the cockpit on your right I think there's a panel as well - near the radio.

[bolox]

MustangIII manual for those interested
http://www.mediafire.com/download/2xjztdpvwjxk2ej/p51rafsmall.rar

[Headshot]

Your problem and mine is probably oil pressure under neg-g. Here is a couple of lines from the flight manual.

"The aircraft is capable of performing chandelles, wingovers, slow rolls, loops, Immelmans, and spilt-S turns with ease. However, remember that inverted flight must be limited to 10 seconds, because of loss of oil pressure and failure of the scavenger pump to operate in an inverted position"

I can't for the life of me take down the ai p51 despite all the talk about keeping up speed and opening radiators. You just cant afford to stall in the vertical. It kills your engine in a few seconds.

[Foul Ole Ron]

If you fly for 10 seconds inverted the engine will cut-out but once you roll back around it comes back again - similar to the neg g cut-out that you get in the Spit / Hurri in CloD. When you get the loud bang and the prop comes to an immediate dead halt that's detonation after the engine has been over-stressed for whatever reason.

The AI is a bit of a bastard - particularly the P51. I don't think ED have properly coded the FW-190 or it's AI yet as a 4v4 AI matchup always seems to result in the P51s totally wiping the floor with the Doras. There's a section on the ED forums where people have posted their dogfighting vids which might be be useful:

http://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?t=87518

You can get a trial version of Tacview as well - it'll show the types of curves, etc. flown by you the AI. It's pretty nifty - I decided to get the home version so I can see the telemetry throughout the fight. You can visually see how one bad move that bleeds too much speed leads into you into a fatal situation a few minutes down the line when you can't keep up with a move made by the AI. You have to be really precise throughout the fight which I find hard unless I'm practicing a lot at it.

http://lomac.strasoftware.com/tacview-en.php