This is important for getting new players to CoD:

[Oersted]

In these heady post-patch days with 100+ users on the servers it may not seem relevant, but if we want big crowds all the time, then we have to think of simplifying the install process.

As it is, the install process from buying CoD on steam to getting to TF v.4.00 is VERY complicated. I think it is the main holdup for new users. It would be great if a simplified process could be made. I.e. "buy vanilla CoD on Steam, install mega-patch and you're good to go". It should contain a link to a live Wiki with updated instructions, links to youtube tutorials and a section with tweaks like the "clouds-fading-in"-tweak. A single-stop shop we can point all new users to, as I will certainly do in a bevy of new movies coming out!

Most CoD fliers are old 40+ fogeys like myself and the majority of them needs an install that is simple and to the point.

And why not aim to have a couple or even three servers going with 100 players? - The sim is fantastic and deserves it!

[Kling]

In these heady post-patch days with 100+ users on the servers it may not seem relevant, but if we want big crowds all the time, then we have to think of simplifying the install process.

As it is, the install process from buying CoD on steam to getting to TF v.4.00 is VERY complicated. I think it is the main holdup for new users. It would be great if a simplified process could be made. I.e. "buy vanilla CoD on Steam, install mega-patch and you're good to go". It should contain a link to a live Wiki with updated instructions, links to youtube tutorials and a section with tweaks like the "clouds-fading-in"-tweak. A single-stop shop we can point all new users to, as I will certainly do in a bevy of new movies coming out!

Most CoD fliers are old 40+ fogeys like myself and the majority of them needs an install that is simple and to the point.

And why not aim to have a couple or even three servers going with 100 players? - The sim is fantastic and deserves it!

What is wrong with this thread?
http://theairtacticalassaultgroup.com/forum/showthread.php?t=5058&p=52711

[Oersted]

What is wrong with this thread?
http://theairtacticalassaultgroup.com/forum/showthread.php?t=5058&p=52711

Well, we can start with the first phrase in the first posting:

"There are currently two patches to download, the 3.00 patch and the 3.01 minipatch"

- So, it is outdated from the get-go.

Also, a thread is not the best way to present this kind of info, because there will be a lot of similarly outdated postings in it, following the first posting, which will just confuse.

Also, downloading and installing first 3.00, then 3.01, then 4.00 (etc) is overly complicated. I am thinking that it should be possible to maybe have the different patches but packaged in one single installer, which first does one, then the other, and so forth.

A proper wiki page will all the up-to-date info and none of the outdated info is the best possible solution. A single link that everybody gives to others so it will rise in google page ranks as well, and become the first result when people google "install cliffs of dover".

I do movies and I think they are a great recruitment tool. I for one know that a lot of people have discovered and rediscovered CoD via those movies. I just fear that a lot of potential players are dropped by the wayside when they see a movie and think WAUW, but then are faced with a complicated install procedure.

Anyway, just my 5€cents...

[Mysticpuma]

Hi Oersted, there is currently work being done.to make exactly that.

As you can.appreciate, the release.of the patch was set for a deadline and on Friday we had the most ever visitors at one.time on the Forums there were 856 users waiting for the patch.

Currently we are looking at an all in.one patch, but possibly an updater programme that will.do it all.for you, but this takes time. As before it's WiP, but it is being looked at as a way of going from.Vanilla to most likely 4.01 (once the Hotfix is done, which I am.sure will happen.as it did with 3.00).

It would have been.ideal.to.have this ready for the release, but felt that it was best to get it out for the public to try and then also generate bug reports we may have missed.

So once the Hotfix (at some point) becomes available, then there could be an easier solution, but lets get those bugs listed first.

Cheers, MP

[Oersted]

Hey Mystic,

I wasn't pushing at all, I am sure you know that. Just saying what I think should be done down the road after the hotfix is out (obviously). It'll be quite a while before we are in 5.00 territory, so sometime before then it would be great to have it done. I am willing to help in every respect possible. I'm no programmer though, but I think I could do god work with texts, proofreading and of course a movie or two.. :-D

Getting the sim out to as many as possible is the first step to getting a big, healthy community which can support and inspire the modding team. CoD has been scraping along with a minimum number of players for extended periods and we all want to change that simply because the sim is brilliant. Paving the way for new folks to get into it is crucial, especially now with competition on the horizon...

[ATAG_Lewis]

The 'Beginners Guide' is made as a work in progress and is an evolving guide...It was written with help from all the community and tweaked as new information was brought to light....We welcome any new info that will help new players settle into CLOD...So if an idea once discussed becomes considered a good addition to the guide any one can have it changed by contacting ATAG_Snapper who can manage website issues...

I have said before that 'The Beginners Guide' is the communities property to tweak as required..not mine...It will best evolve that way

There is a discussion thread for suggestions to changes in the 'Beginners Guide'.....here..:

http://theairtacticalassaultgroup.com/forum/showthread.php?t=5143

As soon as new info is established someone should contact ATAG_Snapper and have the main page changed in accordance....As with any guide it should be short, precise and concise...

Having said that I actually did a reinstall last night and was amazed just how short a time it took to verify the files and then install all the patches.....Once the patches are downloaded it was minutes and with the 'MOD installer.exe' applications it is very easy to do.

As with any patching process it is always something to learn and do....Unfortunately at the moment the patches aren't linked with STEAM to manage them so folks have to learn but we have a most helpful team and community here that appreciate we are struggling to get folks into this sim and are doing there best to help them on this website....as you are Oersted...Thank you buddy

[Oersted]

Your guide is just GREAT Lewis! - It should obviously be the backbone of all content in an Install-CoD-wiki-page. That is the good thing: there isn't much new content to be done: it is mostly a question of collating the info already present, your guide, Philstyle's vid, etc.

[Chivas]

Team Fusion has done a wonderful job, but I'm struggling to have fun with COD. I used to pride myself in being a very good deflection shooter ,etc, taking down or disabling a targets quickly so I could divert to the next threat. I expected the more complex damage model of COD would make this job easier as the first burst should be quite devastating for most aircraft. That said putting bullets on target with the COD FM is far more difficult than the original IL-2. After a few minutes of chasing a Hurri all over the sky with my 109 hitting it with burst after burst and still the swiss cheese Hurri is making wonderful evasive maneuvers. Its a frustrating exercise, and I wonder just how frustrating it is for new people with far less experience and deflection shooting knowledge. I realize new people could always change the difficulty level to easier settings, but just saying.....

[AKA_Recon]

In these heady post-patch days with 100+ users on the servers it may not seem relevant, but if we want big crowds all the time, then we have to think of simplifying the install process.

As it is, the install process from buying CoD on steam to getting to TF v.4.00 is VERY complicated. I think it is the main holdup for new users. It would be great if a simplified process could be made. I.e. "buy vanilla CoD on Steam, install mega-patch and you're good to go". It should contain a link to a live Wiki with updated instructions, links to youtube tutorials and a section with tweaks like the "clouds-fading-in"-tweak. A single-stop shop we can point all new users to, as I will certainly do in a bevy of new movies coming out!

Most CoD fliers are old 40+ fogeys like myself and the majority of them needs an install that is simple and to the point.

And why not aim to have a couple or even three servers going with 100 players? - The sim is fantastic and deserves it!

I would agree, a single download installer from vanilla to 4.0 would be nice :)

[AKA_Recon]

Team Fusion has done a wonderful job, but I'm struggling to have fun with COD. I used to pride myself in being a very good deflection shooter ,etc, taking down or disabling a targets quickly so I could divert to the next threat. I expected the more complex damage model of COD would make this job easier as the first burst should be quite devastating for most aircraft. That said putting bullets on target with the COD FM is far more difficult than the original IL-2. After a few minutes of chasing a Hurri all over the sky with my 109 hitting it with burst after burst and still the swiss cheese Hurri is making wonderful evasive maneuvers. Its a frustrating exercise, and I wonder just how frustrating it is for new people with far less experience and deflection shooting knowledge. I realize new people could always change the difficulty level to easier settings, but just saying.....

very difficult I agree.

and even with better LOD's , trying to get SA is tough

[ATAG_Lolsav]

(...) That said putting bullets on target with the COD FM is far more difficult than the original IL-2. After a few minutes of chasing a Hurri all over the sky with my 109 hitting it with burst after burst and still the swiss cheese Hurri is making wonderful evasive maneuvers. Its a frustrating exercise (...)

Hello Chivas old buddy. (Hope im not mistaken, its Chivas from Warclouds, right?)

You forgot to mention a big improvement that will enhance kills, for both sides actually. Lonewolfing is going to be more dangerous than before - They cant hear coming in close anymore! You can get so close to his six the first shot should be devastating (assuming you dont miss). That said, the situation of combat you reported it can also be look as entertaining. And you dont need a pilot kill to get your kill registered. Even if you land first its gonna be your kill (shared with someone else if the target receives more love first) ;)

[Chivas]

Hello Chivas old buddy. (Hope im not mistaken, its Chivas from Warclouds, right?)

You forgot to mention a big improvement that will enhance kills, for both sides actually. Lonewolfing is going to be more dangerous than before - They cant hear coming in close anymore! You can get so close to his six the first shot should be devastating (assuming you dont miss). That said, the situation of combat you reported it can also be look as entertaining. And you dont need a pilot kill to get your kill registered. Even if you land first its gonna be your kill (shared with someone else if the target receives more love first) ;)

~Salute~ Lolsav Yes, the same. Warclouds was a great server with a lot of great pilots like yourself.
JG27_Chivas

[Mysticpuma]

Ahhhhhhh Warclouds.....god bless the P-47.....happy times :)

Regarding your difficulty shooting down the aircraft, I find it actually quite an interesting post.
As much as I can see your frustration in not having shot it down, there were many gun cameras and reports of damaged aircraft that still evaded and ultimately survived. Frustrating for you but also very accurate in regards to the enemy surviving and evading.

Cheers, MP

[Chivas]

Ahhhhhhh Warclouds.....god bless the P-47.....happy times :)

Regarding your difficulty shooting down the aircraft, I find it actually quite an interesting post.
As much as I can see your frustration in not having shot it down, there were many gun cameras and reports of damaged aircraft that still evaded and ultimately survived. Frustrating for you but also very accurate in regards to the enemy surviving and evading.

Cheers, MP

I agree there will quite a few reports and pics of aircraft surviving devastating attacks. That said I've read far more reports of exactly the opposite. My limited experience with COD so far is the percentages appear to be exactly the opposite. Disregarding any faults I may have with flying and shooting, I would have thought the new complex damage model would end fights much sooner than I've experienced. Again this is with limited experience with COD, but exactly the experience most new users would have, that might have them moving on. I have no answer, but hope to carry on and enjoy what COD has to offer, but wonder where the Hollywood/Historical balance is, or if our perception of historical reality, might be a little too severe.
~Salute~

[Logan]

I had the same thing, get behind... low 6... pop up and pepper a spit,thinking oh he's so dead...nope turns and burns on me. I take it the DM now can tell if you hit something vital or just shot right through the plane. In old IL2 didn't we have a "box" or two and if you hit that well the plane was down.? Its frustrating yes (plus I'm not that good of a shot) but its fun now you have to pick where to hit and not just spray some bullets in that general direction..(my normal way :D )

Anyways getting off topic. How about a locked post that list the patches and links?
So you have:
"New pilots now that you have Cliffs Of Dover here are the patches you need to stay up to date"
TF3.0> link
TF3.01>link
TF4.0>link
Then you can edit it as you need. Until a All in one is ready.

[PFT_Endy]

I agree there will quite a few reports and pics of aircraft surviving devastating attacks. That said I've read far more reports of exactly the opposite. My limited experience with COD so far is the percentages appear to be exactly the opposite. Disregarding any faults I may have with flying and shooting, I would have thought the new complex damage model would end fights much sooner than I've experienced. Again this is with limited experience with COD, but exactly the experience most new users would have, that might have them moving on. I have no answer, but hope to carry on and enjoy what COD has to offer, but wonder where the Hollywood/Historical balance is, or if our perception of historical reality, might be a little too severe.
~Salute~

If you don't damage a vital component or rip a big chunk of plating or an aileron or something you can hardly expect a big effect. That's what always made me laugh while watching IL2 movies - a short burst and bam! the wing comes off.

That's also the beauty of CloD's DM, you need to hit something important, be it a radiator, engine or control surface. Coolant leak will kill a plane in the long run as sure as turning it into a ball of fire. But making small holes in the wings of the other aircraft will not.

Do you flied RAF planes btw? Because that might be part of the problem or at least what you perceive as a problem. The allies only have .303 guns which, especially in TF patch 4.0, are not the greatest destruction tool around. You really need to hit something important for that 109 to feel it. It's much easier to kill something if you fly blue though, those cannon shells are even more lethal now.

[Oersted]

What you post here Chivas actually confirms, to my mind, that CoD is probably the most realistic WWII combat flight sim yet. There were not many aces in WWII because it was not very easy to down enemy planes! ninety percent of pilots did not see the enemy in time, did not get into position, botched their approach, shot too early, missed the target... If that happens most of the time in CoD then that is probably quite realistic. Two tiny maneuvering airplanes spraying bullets at each other in a big big sky... Not easy to get kills, and that is why only a select few actually got them.

[Chivas]

What you post here Chivas actually confirms, to my mind, that CoD is probably the most realistic WWII combat flight sim yet. There were not many aces in WWII because it was not very easy to down enemy planes! ninety percent of pilots did not see the enemy in time, did not get into position, botched their approach, shot too early, missed the target... If that happens most of the time in CoD then that is probably quite realistic. Two tiny maneuvering airplanes spraying bullets at each other in a big big sky... Not easy to get kills, and that is why only a select few actually got them.

I totally agree, but many of us computer pilots have far more hours/years of experience flying and deflection shooting than most WW2 pilots ever hoped to have. Most of us understand how to fly and shoot effectively, even factoring in the learning experience required with the new COD FM/DM. In the accounts I've read there were very few long prolonged dogfights, it was usually over in the first burst of gunfire. I'm not saying the COD experience is wrong, I've never flown a WW2 aircraft in WW2. ;)

[ATAG_Colander]

Is not only the experience we all have flying and shooting but also the fact that you don't die, just re spawn in a new shiny plane.
If there where real consequences, many of the long dogfights you see (specially on the deck) would not happen.

[PFT_Endy]

Also, take a look at many WWII guncams, there is a 1-2 second full burst, sometimes even longer with no reaction from the target a/c. It's just there getting hit, not breaking away. That's something that always made me wonder actually, the lack of reaction to enemy fire, just continuing the gentle turn or flying straight until something blows up. No instant evasive maneuvers we see online. Ofc, they happened but not as often as you might think and that's something really strange...

[Chivas]

Is not only the experience we all have flying and shooting but also the fact that you don't die, just re spawn in a new shiny plane.
If there where real consequences, many of the long dogfights you see (specially on the deck) would not happen.

There definitely is a necessity for some pilots to fly high, but there is also a necessity to fly relatively low to attack and protect the ground targets/pounders. I would suggest a number of pc pilots should be court-martialled for only protecting their sorry arse by flying high. Especially when they have a habit of looking down their long pointy noes, at those actually doing something to win the battle, and not their stats. I suppose most pilots would chose not to go into harms way given half a chance, but orders are orders. ;)

[Logan]

There definitely is a necessity for some pilots to fly high, but there is also a necessity to fly relatively low to attack and protect the ground targets/pounders. I would suggest a number of pc pilots should be court-martialled for only protecting their sorry arse by flying high. Especially when they have a habit of looking down their long pointy noes, at those actually doing something to win the battle, and not their stats. I suppose most pilots would chose not to go into harms way given half a chance, but orders are orders. ;)
Alt monkeys we called them, fly high ,stay high and never get in a furball and never go down low.

[K9Katt]

Your guide is just GREAT Lewis! - It should obviously be the backbone of all content in an Install-CoD-wiki-page. That is the good thing: there isn't much new content to be done: it is mostly a question of collating the info already present, your guide, Philstyle's vid, etc.

Mystic has already gone beyond with this offer to assist - I will vote for the
"one fix" for the whole thing approach as this patch thing is pushing me toward a mental breakdown - tks again for the assist - K9:thumbsup: