PDA

View Full Version : Axis Littlestone controlled map



AKA_Recon
Nov-15-2013, 22:44
I don't know the exact name of this map, so my apologies in advance.

Also, no offense is intended regarding the map designer.

I don't fly as much lately, but both times this week I joined, this map is up. I'm not a fan at all unfortunately. I miss the 'flying over the channel' and finding the bombers and flying the Blenheim to attack ships, etc...

This map is full of just all the things I don't like about the 'gamey' aspects. It's completely a fighting on the deck, turn fight map where 80% of the time your either getting vulched by bored Germans or shot by someone driving a tank to the airfield and killing you on spawn.

The action is minutes if not seconds away, seemly designed for the OCD crowd. When I did a timeleft, it said '6 hours' - so I was disapointed to say the least.

No offense again to the maker of this, but I think as an experiment, I think it's time to put this one away - the attendance was very low on a Friday night with it - so I wonder if I'm not alone- I dropped out early than I normally do after getting vulched 3x on takeoff in a row - this is just not what I think is a good map setup

ElGringo
Nov-16-2013, 00:25
Just my 2 cents Recon:
Well I like the map... I would not play it all day long, but it does provide a nice change from my point of view. First map where I can do some kind of Close Air support. And if SeeLowe had happened, I guess it would have been a messy, low alt fight for air superiority over the beachhead...

And there is ships, tanks, and lots of things to destroy with your Blenheim. Try the map in ground attack mode. I' m sure you will find some fun in it.

But it is true the attendance is generally pretty low on this map.

Roblex
Nov-16-2013, 04:04
I think it, or something similar, has its place so we can try out vehicles and also try flying Close Air Support for a change. I agree the gameplay does usually end up becoming a bit juvenile, a more concentrated version of the Hawkinge Furball with tanks added in, but I don't think we should abandon the whole concept.

If you want to make it more 'realistic' then perhaps move it to a Dunkirk map as Red pilots seem more willing to take-off from England despite having a convenient airfield in France and this might keep the fight higher. Make it 'pre-evacuation' and thus more of the area in Allied hands and tanks still defending rather than being abandoned while crew try to get on ships. Blue can obviously sink ships and destroy tanks with their bombers that are better suited to tactical support but I am not sure what to do with the reds; perhaps they can close airfields as they don't yet have any missions that allow red to close fields based on tonnage dropped and the Blenhiem is little suited to doing much more. If you restrict the Blue forward fields then Red can at least have the satisfaction of forcing the Blues further and further back :D

AKA_Knutsac
Nov-17-2013, 16:31
Gotta agree with Recon, this map just promotes the mindless spawn-fly-die, rinse, repeat gameplay that I personally despise. Five hour vulch-fest...boring! Only two missions out of all those offered by ATAG that I hate flying, the Littlestone invasion scenario and the winter night map with purple clouds (thought I was having a flashback to my days as an amateur pharmacist).

~S~

AKA Knutsac

EG14_Marcast
Nov-17-2013, 17:09
If you want to make it more 'realistic' then perhaps move it to a Dunkirk map as Red pilots seem more willing to take-off from England despite having a convenient airfield in France and this might keep the fight higher. Make it 'pre-evacuation' and thus more of the area in Allied hands and tanks still defending rather than being abandoned while crew try to get on ships. Blue can obviously sink ships and destroy tanks with their bombers that are better suited to tactical support but I am not sure what to do with the reds; perhaps they can close airfields as they don't yet have any missions that allow red to close fields based on tonnage dropped and the Blenhiem is little suited to doing much more. If you restrict the Blue forward fields then Red can at least have the satisfaction of forcing the Blues further and further back :D

I totally agree with this.

Kling
Nov-17-2013, 17:20
or at least get rid of the blue airfield on english soil.
This airfield gives blues and reds 1min of flying time too each others fields. Personally I dont like this kind of flying. I thought we aiming at having as realistic scenarios as possible..?!

EG14_Marcast
Nov-17-2013, 20:22
Just gave up to this map. I started at 23,00 and it was still running at 0215 CET. I started as Red flying a Blenheim: I hit twice Littlestone, reported as target in the briefing, with no apparent damage. How many tons of bombs do you need to destroy it? I shifted to Blue. Practically impossible for everybody to spot the British artillery, last target left. The map is going to its time end in the dark, quite boring. I miss Home Plate and London Raids :-(

Roblex
Nov-18-2013, 00:13
I shifted to Blue. Practically impossible for everybody to spot the British artillery, last target left.

I have had the same problem with the Red target that is SW of St Mary and N or the river. I am fairly sure it is the field full of vehicles but I have never been able to work out where the last vehicle is hiding to get the target completed. I have even resorted to fetching a tank to look at them all close up and failed to find one that was not already destroyed. Perhaps they are not the target? It is described as something like an 'ammunition train convoy' but there does not seem to be either a train or a road convoy in the area.

9./JG52_J-HAT
Nov-18-2013, 10:08
Just gave up to this map. I started at 23,00 and it was still running at 0215 CET. I started as Red flying a Blenheim: I hit twice Littlestone, reported as target in the briefing, with no apparent damage. How many tons of bombs do you need to destroy it? I shifted to Blue. Practically impossible for everybody to spot the British artillery, last target left. The map is going to its time end in the dark, quite boring. I miss Home Plate and London Raids :-(

Hey marcast, I miss those two too. It seems almost everytime I get on it is either this map (in winter or fall textures) or the Dunkirk one... or at least something in winter or fall.

I took out the artillery as my first target yesterday and was going for the armor concentration when I left (I am sure I got the target). I will make recon pictures and post them, as there seems to be some difficulty findind that target. It really isn't if you know where they are. Just go N from Littlestone until you reach the large river that goes E-W. Than follow that river West unteil you reach the square river, which has a river going SW. Follow that river SW until you see a large house with two more surrounding it (just E of the river). There are flak guns aroung the houses and the 4 howitzers are two on either side of the largest house (E and W). You need to take out some of the flak too to get the target.

Actually, the targets in this map are relatively easy to destroy. They are just too many and taking off from France takes some time to reach them. Taking off from littlestone isn't alway possible either.

I ended up leaving yesterday because I wanted to fly some other map, summer, not winter again. Sometimes I wish the rotation times weren't that long.

Less targets and less time per map would be IMHO better for adding some variety.

9./JG52 Jamz Dackel
Nov-18-2013, 10:35
This map still running then I take it....

Marmus
Nov-18-2013, 10:58
I love this map. I am a truly dedicated fan of CloD, but real life limits my flight time....I can fly this map in a short period of time....take off, bomb Hawkings with a 109, get shot down....bam....I am done. Kinda like my sex life.

ATAG_Snapper
Nov-18-2013, 11:16
Do you fly alone a lot? :D

J/K!!!

:)

Osprey
Nov-18-2013, 11:36
Unfortunately it seems that you can't get near Littlestone in a tank because 88's will whop you from about 4 miles away, or something does that you can't see.

Why are all of the 'what if?' scenarios based on German victory? How about they got bogged down in the Ardennes and then trounced by the BEF and French? We never hear that one do we? :devilish:

EG14_Marcast
Nov-18-2013, 11:43
Hey marcast, I miss those two too. It seems almost everytime I get on it is either this map (in winter or fall textures) or the Dunkirk one... or at least something in winter or fall.


Yes, it's the actual rotation. Dunkirk is usually quite fast (and funny), but yesterday it started at 02,30 CET. The next one is Home Plate, but I have to sleep too....

ATAG_NakedSquirrel
Nov-18-2013, 15:56
Why are all of the 'what if?' scenarios based on German victory? How about they got bogged down in the Ardennes and then trounced by the BEF and French? We never hear that one do we? :devilish:

Don't be silly :-P

Though it would be fun to see the Morane-Saulnier.

I mean... we need something to make the hurricane look fast. :D

EG14_Marcast
Nov-19-2013, 03:13
Just go N from Littlestone until you reach the large river that goes E-W. Than follow that river West unteil you reach the square river, which has a river going SW. Follow that river SW until you see a large house with two more surrounding it (just E of the river). There are flak guns aroung the houses and the 4 howitzers are two on either side of the largest house (E and W). You need to take out some of the flak too to get the target.


Finally last night Lolsav could find it, we bombed it but we didn't destroy, then I had to leave. It's really hard to see unless you are very close. This map is much better starting early morning.

Osprey
Nov-19-2013, 06:48
Don't be silly :-P

Though it would be fun to see the Morane-Saulnier.

I mean... we need something to make the hurricane look fast. :D


It's only slow because the engine pops. Nothing more satisfying that bagging the 'fast' E4/N in a Hurricane, had a good one the other day - dragged him away from the front alone for a 1 v 1 knowing he was 'stick in the gut' type and relying on E4N power. I was safe the whole time and knew eventually he'd get more desperate to get me, then the mistake, WHAM. Luckily for him a buddy turned up, or unluckily for him because I killed him too lmao!

9./JG52_J-HAT
Nov-19-2013, 12:31
Hey Marcast,

Glad you found it! I find it easier to strafe the targets, as they are too far apart to blow with a single bomb. So even if you hit all SC-50 bombs, you still need another 109 or to strafe the remaining guns.

EG14_Marcast
Nov-19-2013, 12:53
Hey Marcast,

Glad you found it! I find it easier to strafe the targets, as they are too far apart to blow with a single bomb. So even if you hit all SC-50 bombs, you still need another 109 or to strafe the remaining guns.

Well, Lolsav found it......We stayed at least 15 min searching around the area at low altitude and low speed, luckily there were just a few Reds. I'm not sure that I'll find it again....I tried to follow your indications, the first river N of Littlestone than the S-W branch. But the river finishes and I couldn't see any triple house there...I began to fly around and when Lolsav called for the spot I was completely lost, I could only reach him, drop bombs and finally crash while strafing :ind:. Anyway, the target should be heading 270° from Littlestone.

III./ZG76_Saipan
Nov-19-2013, 14:03
i like this map, its a challenge for the ground targets. i think alot of people overlook this aspect of the game.

Marmus
Nov-19-2013, 14:09
I wish we had flares or smoke bombs to help mark those ground targets...especially the moving tanks.

9./JG52_J-HAT
Nov-19-2013, 15:10
Here we go, nice recon pics... took me a plane to make this, as there was a Matilda shooting Littlestone up. I ended up strafing and killing him too before landing :)

General target area as seen from the West / Northwest:
5868

Eastern positions:
5869

Western positions:
5870

Square river thingy as reference to direction and distance to target:
5871

Target area marked on the map:
5872

Nowing where it is, strafe the hell out of it. It is a relatively easy target. You can take it all out when going up the the tank concentration, for example. Don't waste bombs on it.

III./ZG76_Saipan
Nov-19-2013, 16:00
very nice pics, i have them in a tree line prob. 'cause i have trees turned up.

9./JG52_J-HAT
Nov-19-2013, 16:37
Weird, I run trees on very high too. :thumbsup: The only thing not maxed out is Building Detail, which is set to High.

EG14_Marcast
Nov-19-2013, 19:29
Great recon work, Jhat :thumbsup:

trademe900
Nov-26-2013, 13:53
I don't know the exact name of this map, so my apologies in advance.

Also, no offense is intended regarding the map designer.

I don't fly as much lately, but both times this week I joined, this map is up. I'm not a fan at all unfortunately. I miss the 'flying over the channel' and finding the bombers and flying the Blenheim to attack ships, etc...

This map is full of just all the things I don't like about the 'gamey' aspects. It's completely a fighting on the deck, turn fight map where 80% of the time your either getting vulched by bored Germans or shot by someone driving a tank to the airfield and killing you on spawn.

The action is minutes if not seconds away, seemly designed for the OCD crowd. When I did a timeleft, it said '6 hours' - so I was disapointed to say the least.

No offense again to the maker of this, but I think as an experiment, I think it's time to put this one away - the attendance was very low on a Friday night with it - so I wonder if I'm not alone- I dropped out early than I normally do after getting vulched 3x on takeoff in a row - this is just not what I think is a good map setup

You saved me having to create a new thread. I too share the exact same viewpoint, as do many others I have talked to on the server. As already mentioned, the attendance drops off on this map.

No offence at all to the mission makers but this map is taking away the enjoyment from atag.

Recon is correct, it simply turns into the same fight after fight turning on the deck. of course you don't see any red pilots complaining about that , out turning 109s kill after kill.

I fly both red amd blue and was ranked number 4 on atag server records for highest kills (mainly flying hurricane) not long ago but now I have lost interest to log on due to this map. Apart from one sided red pilots, is anyone really enjoying this?

The whole point of atag battles in my opinion is as it was before, fighting over the channel, always with the chance to surprise attack or be taken out from nowhere- fighting way up above and below. But this arcadey style of play I believe should be left to the dogfight servers, which are good fun by all means... however atag is not about that.

Can we switch back to the old channel maps , get rid of the blue airfield on red soil? I miss logging on to atag....

92 Sqn. Philstyle (QJ-P)
Nov-26-2013, 14:40
I know this is the ATAG forums all, but there are other servers with interesting maps on them too.

The ATAG team have stated many times that if player numbers drop off for particular missions, they will reconsider those missions.

If you're not getting what you want from the mission, rather than just leave the game, why not try another server? You'll be surprised how quickly even a near empty server will fill up once a couple of people seed it.

Better to have two or three servers each with 50 players in them, rather than one server with 80 and no-one else on-line.

trademe900
Nov-26-2013, 15:03
In my experience only 2 servers are available, atag and the dogfight one. We don't all live in the same time zone and therefore those of us in new Zealand, Australia and other parts of the world don't get that many choices or time frames to play with you all over in England etc. It's not as simple as just picking another server unfortunately.

trademe900
Nov-28-2013, 17:27
The other problem with this map is that the reds are at an unfair advantage. At the moment it is a gravy train for the reds at littlestone. Since it is a constant ground level turn fight at littlestone, blues at least need 109 E4N at littlestone to stand a chance against the red spit 2a that are circling around the blue airfield constantly.

ATAG_Freya
Nov-28-2013, 19:32
Not gonna speak for or against this map, as I am still on the fence.... but take off from france, get high, perch, then bounce the F-ers. (FLY - ers:D) I don't fly the 109 hardly at all and racked up 5 kills in a session doing this. Just saying there are good points to this map, and bad. Depends on who you fly with or against. Lots of fun to be had in them tanks though...

ATAG_EvangelusE
Nov-28-2013, 20:09
This map relies on good player numbers and I understand what trademe900 is trying to say regards the time zone problem. The server can be very quiet and its generally there for the full duration.

Do you players down under see the SoW server or is it a ping problem? Its a good alternative but you are right - sometimes only few servers show up in the list.

Just out of curiosity - what happened to ATAG server 2? The last time I saw it was when dedicated to testing/developing TF 4 mod.

trademe900
Nov-28-2013, 20:11
Haha ahh so that was Freya in the bloody tank rolling through the blue airfield destroying us just before!

I can see the sow server but there is no one on it when I go to play

ATAG_Freya
Nov-28-2013, 22:01
mmm....nope. Not me. But I know of whom you speak. In fact, last week, I spent at least an hour in a blue side tank 'policing' littlestone so that 109's could use the feild. It was good fun, but I was amazed at how fast this guy was getting to littlestone from Hawkinge, even if he was in the faster "wheeled" armored car thing. (sorry the name escapes me right now). AFAIK, the wheeled vehicles can't go through the rivers, and yet it seems to be impossible to not hit a river en-route from Hawk to L-stone. Along the beech maybe? I am still perplexed over the issue.... :salute:

RAF74_Buzzsaw
Nov-28-2013, 23:11
mmm....nope. Not me. But I know of whom you speak. In fact, last week, I spent at least an hour in a blue side tank 'policing' littlestone so that 109's could use the feild. It was good fun, but I was amazed at how fast this guy was getting to littlestone from Hawkinge, even if he was in the faster "wheeled" armored car thing. (sorry the name escapes me right now). AFAIK, the wheeled vehicles can't go through the rivers, and yet it seems to be impossible to not hit a river en-route from Hawk to L-stone. Along the beech maybe? I am still perplexed over the issue.... :salute:

British tanks don't only spawn at Hawkinge. There are spawn areas for British tanks all around the German beach head. Between those spawns and the airfield at Littlestone are German tank spawns, static German AI tanks and artillery, and on the field itself there are German tanks, artillery and spawns.

The small British tank/armoured car are two types, the Mk VIC tank which is tracked and can go across rivers, and the Guy Mk IA armoured car which is wheeled, and which can't go across rivers. The Guy Mk IA is much faster than the MkVIC. The MkVIC has better armour. Both have 15mm light cannon for armament.

The equivalent are the German Mk IIC light tank and the Sdkfz 222 Armoured car, both of which have 20mm cannon.

ATAG_Freya
Nov-29-2013, 00:27
http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-UUaVMXszuEY/UltYdYKWUZI/AAAAAAAAjyY/gyEfcwPNrg8/s400/facepalm.gif

Well...glad that's resolved. Thanks Buzz! Twice. Not once, but twice, I've drove a tank from Hawkinge to Littlestone only to be killed about 5 miles away. Hours well spent. I never noticed the spawn points near there, serves me right I guess. It was a lovely drive though....birdsong and hippie music playing. Felt like Don Sutherland's character from Kelly's Heroes. What was his name? Freya? :)

StormBat
Nov-29-2013, 10:55
I did really well on this map a few times, yesterday my score was a little over 24. And yes it is a quick action map and vaulching map, which doesn't bother me at all, but why are there two variations of this map? pick a season already and just do the one please... To many people are leaving because of this. Even if targets are different doesn't matter. Look I get it, it's a map to try out tanks in a close combat situation, But it dose kinda get old real fast even though I do very well on it. So please take one out of rotation I don't care which one, but it is hurting our numbers especially for newbies who get frustrated and discouraged real fast. I'm not trying to insult the map maker here either because it is an interesting scenario. Btw I was just on this map half hour ago(winter version) an there were only 9 people on, just saying. Anyway just my 2 cents on the subject.

RAF74_Buzzsaw
Nov-29-2013, 12:26
I did really well on this map a few times, yesterday my score was a little over 24. And yes it is a quick action map and vaulching map, which doesn't bother me at all, but why are there two variations of this map? pick a season already and just do the one please... To many people are leaving because of this. Even if targets are different doesn't matter. Look I get it, it's a map to try out tanks in a close combat situation, But it dose kinda get old real fast even though I do very well on it. So please take one out of rotation I don't care which one, but it is hurting our numbers especially for newbies who get frustrated and discouraged real fast. I'm not trying to insult the map maker here either because it is an interesting scenario. Btw I was just on this map half hour ago(winter version) an there were only 9 people on, just saying. Anyway just my 2 cents on the subject.

I agree there should not be two versions of the map.

I created one version of the map, the autumn one to allow people to use the vehicles, but I think Bliss decided to double up by adding a winter version as well.

Unfortunately the winter one goes too late in the day, the amount of daylight hours on a winter map are less, so it gets dark earlier. This wasn't what I planned, and I didn't want two versions.

Bliss is in the middle of a move right now, and through no fault of his own is unable to make changes.

DUI
Dec-29-2013, 21:26
With all respect to the mission maker, personally, I would appreciate to not see this map in the server rotation anymore. It was fun in the beginning, especially for testing out the new tanks. But now, it is a pure dogfight/vulching experience with all planes concentrated to one tiny spot. No motivation for blue to spawn in France. Another aspect is that there is no squadron flying possible, only killing and dying on your own. And there is also no motivation for bomber pilots - why flying for half an hour over the Channel if there are Jabos with a 5 minute distance to the targets? The only motivation to achieve the targets is to have a new mission started...

Maltloaf1
Dec-30-2013, 04:04
Have to say I agree with DUI completely here, and admit that if I see this map in the rotation I now go and fly elsewhere. I know others like it but it takes all types. I love the London Raids map as BoB is all about the bombers for me, it's about escorting them and shooting them down, or keeping the escorts off while some one else shoots them down. I love the dynamics that build up around the big raids. Anyway, nice for a while but can we can this map yet? Sorry to be negative.

Malt loaf