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ATAG_Lewis
Nov-17-2013, 07:41
For new players coming into any new genre that involves new hardware there is always the problem of 'What Hardware?'..This can be a daunting experience for the new players with so many options on the market... This thread is for them to reference and get a general consensus on what Hardware to invest in when decided that CLOD is for them....

so...

Please post your hardware (Joystick / Throttle / Pedals / Headtrack device) preference here with a brief description and whys and wherefors (if you have the time)..Also a pic would be good...Generally any information you think would be usefull to a new player who is looking for a joystick...If you don't have time then simply state your kit and we can at least still get a general concensus on the most popular stuff.... This goes for even if you see your joystick preference already stated by someone else, please enter a post with your kit and again it will add to the information of how many players use that particular hardware.

IMPORTANT - Please don't dispute others claims as I want this thread to be a 'This is what I use thread' and that is all so it is not cluttered with personal disputes and contrary preferences......Thanks Folks

ATAG_Lewis
Nov-17-2013, 07:41
Microsoft Sidewinder Precision 2

After using many different sticks at the beginnning of my flight sim life I eventually settled on this stick. I used Logitech 3D pro and Saitek Cyborgs in the past but found that the 3D pro had a common rudder pot break down problem (which happened on both sticks I bought) and was stiff and that the Cyborg was simply just too stiff.

There are 2 versions of the 'Microsoft Sidewinder Precision 2', one with forcefeedback and one without. Both have a twist rudder. The non-feedback version has return to center springs in the base which are low resistance compared to many sticks I have tried which I prefer. They have a 'HAT switch' on the top and a thumb button, a throttle slidder and 4 keys on the base,all of which are programmable. Both sticks use the same handles and 4 base buttons so the only difference being the Forcefeedback which can be tweaked in CLODs directory.(I have personally erased all but the 'return to center' files here)

This stick is discontinued but I found all mine on Ebay relatively cheaply. Many of my friends have this stick too and none of us have had any types of break downs so they are a very robust stick. I even have a friend who used his stick for 9 years without a glitch.

http://cdn.iofferphoto.com/img3/item/208/348/148/HvN5.jpg http://i.testfreaks.com/images/products/600x400/191/microsoft-sidewinder-precision-2.33283263.jpg

CHProducts Throttle Pro

I heard a lot about CHProducts before I eventually managed to find a throttle at a cheap enough price for me to try. The Throttle Pro is a robust piece of kit. It has 3 buttons, 4 HAT switches, 1 mouse key and a main throttle slider. I have 3 gripes with this piece of hardware: 1) No potentiometers. 2) Throttle slider too loose. (remedied by a simple friction mod) and 3) bad ergonomic design. Chunky feel to the handle makes using it feel like you have hold of a pineapple in your left hand. Apart from these problems I still use it and would reccommend it simply because of its robustness and quality

http://media.gdgt.com/img/product/27/l1d/pro-throttle-2dxp.jpg

TrackIR

Brilliant piece of technology which totally changes the immersion for CLOD

http://cdn.trendhunterstatic.com/thumbs/face-tracking-trackir-is-next-in-video-games.jpeg

9./JG52 Ziegler
Nov-17-2013, 08:09
This is my kit. The crosswinds and Obutto are new additions just ordered. :thumbsup: I also use track IR5 and am looking at an Occulus Rift (for BOS and Assetto Corsa) :salute:Although some may think expensive, for me it's a relatively inexpensive hobby.



5813581458155816

Archie
Nov-17-2013, 09:27
CH Fighterstick, CH yoke and CH pedals. I bought them because I wanted something that would last for a long time. The Fighterstick is a little big for me, the pedals are a bit too close together.
Also use a Saitek throttle quadrant as for the cost it is very good.
For head tracking I use a TiR3 with vector expansion.
5833

III./ZG76_Saipan
Nov-17-2013, 09:35
Saitek x52, Saitek pedals, Track IR4. set is about 6 years old, used them during the IL2 '46 days. I like all the buttons and in Il2 the stopwatch on the throttle came in handy for flying timed routes.

Chivas
Nov-17-2013, 12:35
I've owned every highend joystick, but always go back to the Microsoft ForceFeedback 2. Its the best for putting bullets on target quickly and smoothly. Although I have my eye on a new joystick currently in production.
http://simhq.com/forum/ubbthreads.php/topics/3851676/New_Realistic_Flight_Sim_Contr#Post3851676

The Cougar throttle is the best throttle on the market. All the buttons and rotaries couldn't be better situated, and its Foxy/Target software allows for quite a number of options.

Saiteck Pro Rudder pedals with toe brakes are fine for my needs.

I also have a Logitech throttle quadrant, and button bay for CEM, engine start etc.

Track IR 5

Track IR and a decent monitor are must haves, but they will "stone age hardware" next year when the the Oculus Rift consumer version is released next year. I definitely put my search for a new monitor on hold until I see how this hardware pans out. I believe a Hotas system that includes atleast four pieces of hardware will be necessary for the best Oculus Rift experience, where its easy to find all your inputs without having to look. It will have a more realistic feel than clicking a mouse over monitor displayed systems.

sandman2575
Nov-17-2013, 22:03
I'm thinking about going with the Thrustmaster T-Flight Stick X -- hard to argue with the price, and seems sufficient options-wise for someone of my limited flight-sim experience --
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000WHFQ0K/ref=s9_hps_bw_g63_i4

hnbdgr
Nov-18-2013, 11:03
get the version with the throttle, you won't be disappointed. extremely versatile for a first joystick & low budget. 10/10 would buy again.

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Thrustmaster-T-Flight-Hotas-Joystick-PS3/dp/B001CXYMFS/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1384790699&sr=8-1&keywords=t+flight+hotas+x

Valisk_61
Nov-18-2013, 11:43
MSFFBII, X35T and TIR4 are my weapons of choice.

sandman2575
Nov-18-2013, 19:40
gah... $18 more than the non-HOTAS version, but you pushed me over the edge. Should arrive tomorrow :D



get the version with the throttle, you won't be disappointed. extremely versatile for a first joystick & low budget. 10/10 would buy again.

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Thrustmaster-T-Flight-Hotas-Joystick-PS3/dp/B001CXYMFS/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1384790699&sr=8-1&keywords=t+flight+hotas+x

ATAG_Slipstream
Nov-19-2013, 00:12
I've owned saiteks over the years but I'm sick of being sold crap that breaks or has phantom key presses and total lack of support.

I'm on a budget at the moment, so I decided to get something cheap like the Hotas-X but I saw this

http://www.speedlink.com/?p=2&cat=414&pid=21606&paus=1

great reviews, robust, paddle rudders (not twist), vibration, etc. A steal at £23.00, so I guess I'll find out on Friday when its delivered.

sandman2575
Nov-21-2013, 12:53
Finally had some time to start setting up my Thrustmaster X Hotas. Initial impressions are positive -- thing is well constructed and solid. Flight stick is particularly nice; throttle is more plastic-y but functional.


Can someone explain to me the proper use of the "Deadzones" when calibrating? I know they are supposed to help you set limits on input, but I don't understand how the calibration functions, with the two "100%" and "0%" bars that I'm supposed to tweak - ?

I'm also having trouble calibrating my trim settings. They are way too sensitive -- I try to trim elevator up, and it doesn't nudge the nose down but puts me into a dive. I try to trim elevator down and I go into a climb. I know there are sensitivity meters for the Aileron, Elevator, and Rudder, but there aren't for Aileron, Elevator, and Rudder Trim. I suspect maybe setting the Deadzones can help with the oversensitivity of the trim, but I just can't figure out how to set them correctly.

Any help appreciated --

5./JG27Meyer
Nov-22-2013, 05:07
Sidewinder ffb2 (none better imho)
CH Pro throttle
Track ir 4
Dont use pedals use twist on the stick

9./JG52 Ziegler
Nov-22-2013, 05:54
Meyer is the only pilot I know that flys standing up at a counter! Keep him away from a proper set of rudder pedals. He's already lethal.:salute:

5./JG27Meyer
Nov-22-2013, 06:38
Tis true my friend i do fly standing up with all my gear on a counter

brucevonlodi
Nov-22-2013, 07:15
I fly with the MSFFII joystick, CH pedals, TrakIR4(with the TrakIR5 Software), and Logitech gamepad. Love the Force feedback on joystick, it really helps warn me when about to stall! I have had a problem with the number 1 firing trigger failing, but I know how to open and replace the switch on the small daughter board otherwise it is a great joystick.

9./JG52_J-HAT
Nov-22-2013, 10:26
Saitek X-52Pro, Trackir5 and Saitek Combat rudder pedals. I've had this setup for 4 years, except for the pedals, which are a couple of months new and replaced my previous rudder pedals.
Before was a Saitek Cyborg EVO, a MSFF1 that eventually got replaced by the EVO (because it broke) and many crappy joysticks before that.
Having a separate throttle unit sure makes a difference, but Trackir is what really changed everything for me. Snap viewing with the hat switch wasn't ideal and did the job for a long long time, but nothing beats head-tracking (yet -> OR).

ATAG_Snapper
Nov-22-2013, 10:40
Tis true my friend i do fly standing up with all my gear on a counter

Dang!

You PK'd me in my Spit last night just as I was lining up a fat, juicy AI HE111 over Manston. The guys on my TS channel were laughing because I had just said that I thought I saw a 109 in the area, but, wait....no...it's a Spit. Then my screen went black. LOL

Good kill! :ind:

:)

I_B_Spectre
Nov-22-2013, 15:14
My original HOTAS back in the late 90's was all CH Products: Pro Pedals, Pro Throttle and Combat Stick. It was, of course, all gameport back then and had to be setup in a pure DOS environment which necessitated a dual boot OS after Win98. The good part about the gameport version was that the non-volatile EPROM kept the programming of keyboard assignments even if it was disconnected and stored for a lengthy time. I was amazed at the durability and reliability of the CH stuff as it was "rode hard and put up wet" for many years. With the demise of the gameport interface and mobos that no longer sported a PS2 keyboard connection, it was time to upgrade to USB-based gear. I had no hesitation in staying with CH Products and got the USB Pro Throttle, Pro Pedals and Fighterstick. The throttle and pedals have three modes which effectively triples the number of possible key/switch assignments over the actual number of buttons and switches on the stick and throttle. The CH Control Manager interface makes easy work of key/button assignments and are saved as individual profiles so that you can tailor a profile to each sim you fly and reconfigure your HOTAS in less than 30 seconds. You may be able to find some stick/throttle/pedals that are cheaper, but if you want to invest in components that will serve you for years, give CH consideration. I have no affiliation with CH Products and my opinion is that of a single user.

ATAG_EvangelusE
Nov-28-2013, 19:42
I currently use a Microsft Sidewinder 2 Force feed back. I purchased the Sidewinder force feedback 2 based on the recommedations in this thread and very pleased with it. I have two throttle units that I can use with the Sidewinder, a Saitek x45 and a X52 and both do a great job.

In the past, I have owned several Saitek products - Cyborg, X45 and both versions of the X52 (Standard and Pro).
The X45 incorporates a Paddle on the throttle assembly to operate the rudder. It wasn't for me disliking both the rudder paddle and excessive force needed for the yoke.

As far as the X52 models are concerened, I preferred the Standard model over the pro model - mainly because the rotaries are better placed. Added to that, the 3 buttons on the MFD display on the standard model could be assigned to game menu commands directly or via the SST programming software. I carried out the X52 magent Mod which is well covered on U-tube regarding improvements to the dead zone problems (which the Pro model doesn't suffer from). Stick movements is generally good and comfortable and I never noticed much difference between either.

Both X52 Yokes are fairly large and gravity, along with wear, caused the yoke to droop and hang forward - it felt very 'sloppy' after a while.

The Sidewinder yoke in comparison is smaller, looks a bit dated with fewer 'bells and whistles' but has a very positive movement and the motors feel better than any spring. The Sidewinder makes a good companion to the X52 Throttle..


I did have TrackIR 4 but now use Freetrack (freeware) for headtracking with a PS3 eye web cam and have no complaints. (There is a 'sticky' for Freetrack for anyone who is interested in a budget alternative.

deviCe
Dec-02-2013, 17:09
I have the T16000M, which I like it a lot. Only gripe was that the hand rest was loose due to its ability to modify to a left handed stick. I simply super-glued it and the stick is much more comfortable now. Before I could not rest my hand on the rest and precisely control the plane, which defeats the purpose of the rest.

How do people go about choosing rudder pedals? I want to fly the 109 more, but I feel that constantly having to twist my stick to keep from side slipping is annoying since the 109 has no rudder trim.

deviCe
Dec-02-2013, 17:12
Sidewinder ffb2 (none better imho)
CH Pro throttle
Track ir 4
Dont use pedals use twist on the stick

If you see this Meyer... Do you have to be constantly twisting the stick to fly the 109 well? I like the 109 and want to fly it, but i find twisting my stick gets annoying sometimes.

9./JG52_Meyer
Dec-04-2013, 11:26
@Gliese89 Sorry mate been very busy ,and changed squad so only just seen your question . No mate i dont really have a prob using the twist on the stick to control the rudder, Its mainly just practice after a while you wont notice the movement at all. I have used a MS FFB stick for years ,however TBH i have only started to fly this game about 4 months after flying il2 1946 for about 7/8 years . I then had a break for a year and started this one. So all those years with this stick have proven usefull
Stick with it mate you will get there
GL

HORRIDO!

ElGringo
Dec-09-2013, 10:06
Using the mighty Thrustmaster HOTAS Warthog and loving it. Excellent accuracy and ergonomy. Also, with the really powerful script editor, you can do anything you want.
Also got saïtek Rudder Pedals. They are not the best, but they do the job. And of course track IR 5 FTW.

bolox
Dec-09-2013, 10:50
This may be useless to prospective new buyers as my equipment is all no longer manufactured- and is pretty rare- but here goes:-
Stick and throttle- Tarmac Aces- 109 full size replica
Rudder pedals- Simped F16
additional buttons, trims etc -Beta Innovations Plasma lite controller (88 buttons, 8 axes- homemade)
and of course Track IR 5

http://i240.photobucket.com/albums/ff27/bolox00/pit/th_rh1.jpg (http://s240.photobucket.com/user/bolox00/media/pit/rh1.jpg.html)

Well for me immersion is what it's all about and for me having full size controls helps in this, and having a full length stick with associated long travel makes small adjustments easier than 'conventional' sticks. It is also unusual in having NO centering- to me feels more like real planes than a spring or other forms of centering I've tried.

Cons- expense:) it also does not have many buttons on stick like HOTAS type sticks - (but that's what all the other switches etc are for- to me this is more of a simulation of real WWII cockpit controls/workload but probably wouldn't suit the hyper competitive online types)

Stig1207
Dec-15-2013, 03:28
I've owned saiteks over the years but I'm sick of being sold crap that breaks or has phantom key presses and total lack of support.

I'm on a budget at the moment, so I decided to get something cheap like the Hotas-X but I saw this

http://www.speedlink.com/?p=2&cat=414&pid=21606&paus=1

great reviews, robust, paddle rudders (not twist), vibration, etc. A steal at £23.00, so I guess I'll find out on Friday when its delivered.

Hi Slipstream,

How did you go with this stick? The force vibration sounds interesting, but it seems it has problems working with Windows.:salute:

dburne
Dec-15-2013, 09:43
Using the mighty Thrustmaster HOTAS Warthog and loving it. Excellent accuracy and ergonomy. Also, with the really powerful script editor, you can do anything you want.
Also got saïtek Rudder Pedals. They are not the best, but they do the job. And of course track IR 5 FTW.

Same setup here, except I have the Saitek Combat Pedals rather than the Pro.
I also just received Friday a CH Throttle Quadrant , http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16826169109&Tpk=ch%20throttle%20quadrant , I intend to use in addition to what I have to give me a few more axis than what I have on the Warthog Throttle.

AKA_Sully
Dec-15-2013, 14:37
CH Pedals and an X52 pro/Sidewinder FFB2 Frankenstick here too ...I like lot's of buttons :D

6256

Maltloaf1
Dec-15-2013, 15:03
Again, not helpful to those looking on Amazon for that perfect purchase; make your own. It's more fun, cheaper and it increases immersion lots.6257

Maltloaf

Pirabee
Jan-01-2014, 15:03
Guys/gals,

Please don't fall over laughing but I use the Logitech Attack3 joystick! Yeah, straight from the Ark! Currently I'm still trying to patch the game and to figure out the three or so million tidbits one needs to know about the game. So, I haven't much flown yet. Very importantly, I hope to find help here as I have no idea how to get the joystick connected and set up. Will welcome any tips, please, especially where the connection and set up thingie for the joystick is done.

Pirabee.

Pirabee
Jan-08-2014, 17:59
Stand down, gentlemen cos Ive had everything fixed and am flying my wig off at the moment.

I have other pressing problems though. For instance, the mixture control has foxed me to this minute in the Spit and Hurri. I tend to fly with it at 0% from takeoff to landing and often, somewhere in between these, often during combat, something usually goes bust and I lose it completely. So, any kind tips on mixture control would be most welcome.

I'm still grappling with better aircraft control, I know, but it really is a PITA not to be able to replicate those movie-like ACMs when in combat. It's an eternal fight to recover from one after another threatened stall. Meanwhile, the only time I watched an assailant shoot me down (a Bf109 - what else?) the brute curved so prettily into my six as if he'd been rehearsing the move since he was in the crib sucking dummies.

Lastly, (oh sorry, only kidding) I canna find where all my screenshots have gone. They aren't where they're supposed to be, whether on the Steam or Mod versions of my game folders. Indeed Ive opened every other file, folder and drive on my system that I can but nada! Any ideas, please?

Pirabee.

ATAG_Snapper
Jan-08-2014, 19:46
Well, here's the good news, mate: Keep your mixture at 0%. That's the equivalent of "Auto Rich". That is where I keep my mixture 100% of the time -- take off, cruising, combat, diving, landing. That is authentic to the real aircraft, BTW. Thanks to another forum member here, IvanK, the whole mixture issue got sorted out with the original developers before Team Fusion came into being. Before that it was a real mish mash of procedures varying from one Spit or Hurri type to another ........which was completely unauthentic.

The mixture lever is mechanically linked to the throttle. When you pull the throttle back (to land, for instance), the mixture lever -- if it was pushed forward into Auto Lean -- will automatically follow the throttle backwards and snick into the Auto Rich position where it belongs. Auto Lean was used by the real BoB pilots at high altitude low-load cruising such as extended patrols or convoy duty when petrol needed to be conserved. In Cliffs of Dover this is rarely the case. Some Clod pilots prefer to take reduced fuel for better performance/less weight, so Auto Lean could come in handy. I always take 100% fuel (as did the real BoB pilots), and I've never encountered a fuel shortage problem, even when overflying Occupied France.

No idea where your screenshots are going. Some other forum member will have to point the way there. Hell, I've got three contact lenses floating around behind my eyeballs unaccounted for. Think I could find errant screenshots? LOL

As for the Spitfire maneuvering stuff, we'll have to fly some sorties together so I can show you how I slip and stagger about! :D

1lokos
Jan-08-2014, 21:43
Lastly, (oh sorry, only kidding) I canna find where all my screenshots have gone. They aren't where they're supposed to be, whether on the Steam or Mod versions of my game folders. Indeed Ive opened every other file, folder and drive on my system that I can but nada! Any ideas, please?



is Printscreen key issue, assign other key for screenshot (example F11, F12...) so they are saved on

C:\Users\"User name"\Documents\1C SoftClub\il-2 sturmovik cliffs of dover - MOD\screenshots

Sokol1

zionid
Jan-09-2014, 11:26
Again, not helpful to those looking on Amazon for that perfect purchase; make your own. It's more fun, cheaper and it increases immersion lots.6257

Maltloaf

That is just beatiful. Somewhat impossible for me to make, but it sure looks fantastic!

Maltloaf1
Jan-09-2014, 12:38
Zionid,

Cheers thanks! I have just asked on another thread if people think there is a market for such things as I have considered making a batch. Not really a plan yet but would be interested in views. I can feel 109 and P51 variant coming on!

Maltloaf

TWC_SLAG
Jan-13-2014, 09:30
I've owned every highend joystick, but always go back to the Microsoft ForceFeedback 2. Its the best for putting bullets on target quickly and smoothly. Although I have my eye on a new joystick currently in production.
http://simhq.com/forum/ubbthreads.php/topics/3851676/New_Realistic_Flight_Sim_Contr#Post3851676

The Cougar throttle is the best throttle on the market. All the buttons and rotaries couldn't be better situated, and its Foxy/Target software allows for quite a number of options.

Saiteck Pro Rudder pedals with toe brakes are fine for my needs.

I also have a Logitech throttle quadrant, and button bay for CEM, engine start etc.

Track IR 5

Track IR and a decent monitor are must haves, but they will "stone age hardware" next year when the the Oculus Rift consumer version is released next year. I definitely put my search for a new monitor on hold until I see how this hardware pans out. I believe a Hotas system that includes atleast four pieces of hardware will be necessary for the best Oculus Rift experience, where its easy to find all your inputs without having to look. It will have a more realistic feel than clicking a mouse over monitor displayed systems.

Here's what I found out about the "Galactic-Pancakes" joystick, by emailing them. For $500, I'll pass. Besides, I love my FFB2.


I have a few questions, if you don’t mind:

1) Is the stick USB connected?
2) Does it have Force Feedback?
3) Compatible with Windows 7?
4) Do you have any pics of a completed unit?
5) What material is the stick made of between the box and the grip?
6) Can I assume the buttons are programmable?
7) Which flight sims has it been tried with?
8) Is there a warranty?



Thanks for your email.

The stick connects via USB.
There is no force feedback currently.
Yes it is compatible with Windows 7.
I don't currently have a complete unit. The "stick tube" part of the stick is proving quite difficult to have made to order.
The stick tube is/will be aluminium.
The USB interface is via Windows native joystick controller. We don't provide any additional software for programming buttons, but this is a common procedure in most all windows flight sims/games.
It's been used with DCS Black Shark, P51 and A10.
Yes there is a one year warranty covering parts and workmanship.

Thanks for your interest. Best
John Moores


badfinger

LuseKofte
Jan-14-2014, 02:37
I payed 3 times more for my yoke. It looks like quality and I would not hesitate buying it if I needed one. And I got the money to spend of course.

Everything is relative and in this case you only get subjective feelings from other.

Injerin
Jan-14-2014, 02:46
1.) Thrustmaster Warthog<-----Just spend the money, may never need another stick EVER! :)

Zisi
Jan-14-2014, 14:24
I have an old saitek st290. Which I HATED for a long time, and was looking at getting a new stick. However then I performed surgery on it, and removed the spring, and added a hair tie to hold up the centering plate. Now I quite like it, theres no resistance, and I can press down the centering plate to find the center (for takeoffs mostly) if I wish.

I also have irtrack, and the ch pro pedals. The pedals are a bit too close together, however they are very robust, I've had mine for like 10 years, a couple months ago they had stopped working. I opened them up, and noticed one of the wires had broken due to friction. So I twisted it back together and it works perfectly again! :)

kl0udypr0jects
Feb-10-2014, 23:13
Again, not helpful to those looking on Amazon for that perfect purchase; make your own. It's more fun, cheaper and it increases immersion lots.6257

Maltloaf

is that this game in the screenshot? how do i make my guages appear ona seperated screen

bolox
Feb-11-2014, 06:01
is that this game in the screenshot? how do i make my guages appear ona seperated screen

http://theairtacticalassaultgroup.com/forum/showthread.php?t=3887&page=2

Markie
Feb-11-2014, 23:03
Thrustmaster TFlight. If you don't want rudder pedals and other stuff just a joystick this is great. Never a problem, ten programmable buttons and solid. Feels like the real thing. My uncle is a qualified pilot and I set up his computer for flight simulators and bought him this because mine was so good. He gave it the tick of approval and that is good enough for me!

Mind you I don't know if they still produce this ...hmmm - may have spoken too soon.

priller26
Feb-16-2014, 16:59
Thrustmaster 16000M one of the few joysticks a lefty can use, I wish I could use the hotas with it...

Pirabee
Mar-05-2014, 12:48
Well, here's the good news, mate: Keep your mixture at 0%. That's the equivalent of "Auto Rich". That is where I keep my mixture 100% of the time -- take off, cruising, combat, diving, landing. That is authentic to the real aircraft, BTW. Thanks to another forum member here, IvanK, the whole mixture issue got sorted out with the original developers before Team Fusion came into being. Before that it was a real mish mash of procedures varying from one Spit or Hurri type to another ........which was completely unauthentic.

The mixture lever is mechanically linked to the throttle. When you pull the throttle back (to land, for instance), the mixture lever -- if it was pushed forward into Auto Lean -- will automatically follow the throttle backwards and snick into the Auto Rich position where it belongs. Auto Lean was used by the real BoB pilots at high altitude low-load cruising such as extended patrols or convoy duty when petrol needed to be conserved. In Cliffs of Dover this is rarely the case. Some Clod pilots prefer to take reduced fuel for better performance/less weight, so Auto Lean could come in handy. I always take 100% fuel (as did the real BoB pilots), and I've never encountered a fuel shortage problem, even when overflying Occupied France.

No idea where your screenshots are going. Some other forum member will have to point the way there. Hell, I've got three contact lenses floating around behind my eyeballs unaccounted for. Think I could find errant screenshots? LOL

As for the Spitfire maneuvering stuff, we'll have to fly some sorties together so I can show you how I slip and stagger about! :D

Dearest Snapper and 1lokos,

I must thank you both for going to all the trouble of responding to my worries. I'm also sorry for replying late. Snapper, I wish I could go for a spin with you except that my TS3 isn't up and running yet. But it would've been a real thrill. Will work on the TS3 and take you up on the promise.

Meantime, Ive been doing some serious swotting on stuff on this forum and my flying has marginally improved. I even shot down a 109E online yesterday with my Rotol Hurri. It was flown by one of the famous names on this forum which I dont think Ive got to mention. The feeling was way-out-of-this-world! I spent the next 20minutes or so wildly dodging my own shadow and anything that moved, fearing my quarry's wingman would swear vengeance and be out to get me.

I've also reconfigured the screenshot thingy so I'm finding my screenshots at last.

Thank you guys, you've been real sports.

Pirabee.

Doozy
Mar-05-2014, 13:36
Had a Saitek X36 for several years and It worked very well. then one day I gave it
to my brother in law and he's still using it today. I tried a CH fighterstick and was
very impressed with the quality of the stick but I never really got comfortable with
the way it felt in my hand. Then a little over 3 years ago I got the Saitek X 52 pro and
pro pedals and have been very pleased with them. The pedals have jammed up a couple
times but that was easy to fix , and my fault for stepping on one pedal too hard .

Also I use Trackir 4 Pro .......and Love it !

Doozy

1lokos
Mar-05-2014, 15:22
The feeling was way-out-of-this-world! I spent the next 20minutes or so wildly dodging my own shadow and anything that moved, fearing my quarry's wingman would swear vengeance and be out to get me

LOL! :)

WTG for the 1st kill.

Sokol1

Roblex
Mar-08-2014, 05:01
I am on a very tight budget and use a Cyborg Fly-5 which is a rebranded Saitek Cyborg X

Hat switch with four fire buttons around it (plus trigger of course)
Twin throttles (though I use the second for trim) Can be locked/unlocked together with a button push if using as twin throttles.
Four buttons under left thumb when operating throttle
Two buttons on front of base just under left ringfinger when operating throttles.
Shift button to alter all twelve buttons
Thumb wheel I use for manual undercarriage so not used much in Clod.
Twist Rudder.
Height of handle, tension of spring and angle of fire buttons/hat block can all be adjusted.
Software to allow use of macros etc.
Base folds in to take up less room when not in use.

My first had problems with noise/spikes after a few months use but they immediately sent me a new one and I have been using it for about two years without further problems (actually the first was a Cyborg X and the replacement a Fly 5 but they are identical)

7987

ATAG_Snapper
Mar-08-2014, 08:47
My Warthog joystick packed it in recently :grrr: so I fell back to my backup from the same manufacturer - Thrustmaster's TM16000. It uses a Hall sensor for its X and Y axis, so for a low cost joystick it's very precise. It can also be programmed with Thrustmaster's TARGET software, although I'm using it as strictly plug 'n play with the Warthog throttle. The only downside to the TM16000 is that its base is a little light and tends to move slightly during hard maneuvring.

I also have been using my old Microsoft Sidewinder 2 joystick which, in my experience, is indestructible. That also has Hall sensor(s) and is likewise very precise. I'm not keen on the force feedback effects as Clod renders which is a bit too off-again/on-again for my liking, otherwise a great stick.

ATAG_Deacon
Mar-08-2014, 10:04
My Warthog joystick packed it in recently :grrr: so I fell back to my backup from the same manufacturer - Thrustmaster's TM16000.

Did you contact TM? They're usually pretty responsive ...

sw1ive
Mar-17-2014, 18:25
Logitech G940 Trottle
8316


Logitech G940 Joystick
Logitech G500 gameing mouse (with 9 keys)
8317


Saitek Pro Flight Cessna Trim Wheel (Nose up Axes Nose down Axes)
Saitek Throttle Quadrant (Proppelor Pitch Axes, Water Radirator Axes, Gear up down Axes)
8318



TrackIR5 with Clip
Logitech headseat with mic and speakers only for Teas Speak
8315


Logitech Left Right speakers
Subwoofer for the sound of engine
8306
8307



Saitek Rudders Pedals
Numlock keyboard (All commands for start up)
8308



Car Bucket seat (just for relax)
8309



42" TV/Monitor Full H/D
8310



Cliffs of Dover Maps (very usefull)
8311



Base for cup of coffee (look out... do not drop it)
8313


All hardware (of cockpit)
8312








more of homemade fly cockpits link here

http://theairtacticalassaultgroup.com/forum/showthread.php?t=4645&highlight=show+cockpit

Incog
Apr-20-2014, 17:10
I have been using a microsoft sidewinder precision 2 since... Combat Flight Simulator 1 or 2 I think. ~2000 I would say. So almost 14 years I'd guess?

It still works as well as day 1. Amazing thing.

Steerpots
Apr-21-2014, 03:52
S! All

MS force feedback 2 joystick, for the rudder and wheel brakes I use CH Products pro pedals,
I use two CH Throttle Quadrants for lots of game functions, head tracking is TIR 4 and finally for anything else
I use my Nexus 7 with ROCATT PowerGrid.

Basically my mantra is to not use the keyboard or mouse clicks directly.
I find it distracting to search for keys/key combinations and pointing and clicking in the cockpit is slow and painful.

56RAF_Steerpots

Tvrdi
Apr-21-2014, 05:39
My joystick recommendation would be (from the best to the less better, bottom to the top)

1. VKB Mamba (great in combination with used xx52/pro throttle)
2. Thrustmaster Warthog
3. Saitek X55
5. CH Combat stick and CH throttle (dunno if this is discontinued already)
6. Thrustmaster Cougar (discontinued, could be bought used)
7. Saitek x52 pro
8. Saitek X52 (more or less discontinued, could be bought used)

If you want force feedback the only option is MS Sidewinder FF2 (discontinued, so it can be bought used on ebay etc). Logitech 940 etc I would not recommend, but If you want....

For low cost joystick the best option is Thrustmaster T16000M or Cobra M5


Pedals:
1) MFG Crosswind pedals (made in Croatia yeah! hehe)
2) Slaw pedals
3) Simped F16 pedals (discontinued)
4) Simped Vario usb pro pedals (discontinued)
3) Saitek Pro Flight Combat pedals

If you want low(er) cost pedals - old Saitek rudder pedals would be ok (could be bought used or maybe even new in the store)

BENTYx
Jun-03-2014, 08:38
Hello,

I'm using the Thrustmaster T-Flight Hotas X Flight Stick. I bought this one just for the price.
I don't know if it's a good joystick, but for me it seems correct...

However, I have a lot of trouble adjusting the rudder when aiming. I tried to slow the sensitivity in the settings but didn't notice any changes...

Is there maybe a software to set this or anything ?

Thanks :)

Bait
Jun-03-2014, 11:46
Hello,

I'm using the Thrustmaster T-Flight Hotas X Flight Stick. I bought this one just for the price.
I don't know if it's a good joystick, but for me it seems correct...

However, I have a lot of trouble adjusting the rudder when aiming. I tried to slow the sensitivity in the settings but didn't notice any changes...

Is there maybe a software to set this or anything ?

Thanks :)

I am using this stick. Question: Are you using the Twist for the Rudder, or the Rocker? If you press the LED button with the Home Icon, it changes from Green to Red and that duplicates the Throttle rocker to a rudder axis. I found this is MUCH more precise and easier to use than the twist.

I load no software for it, and just plugged it in.

BENTYx
Jun-03-2014, 19:32
I'm using the twist. I'm gonna try the Rocker so and see how it goes

Thanks

GunnyMac
Jun-03-2014, 22:10
Thrustmaster Cougar w/NXT Mod - CH Pro Pedals - TrackIR 4 - Speedlink surround sound headphones.

BENTYx
Jun-04-2014, 06:54
I am using this stick. Question: Are you using the Twist for the Rudder, or the Rocker? If you press the LED button with the Home Icon, it changes from Green to Red and that duplicates the Throttle rocker to a rudder axis. I found this is MUCH more precise and easier to use than the twist.

I load no software for it, and just plugged it in.


I tried with the Rocker, wow I can't fly with it :D
Too odd for me ^^

Bait
Jun-04-2014, 07:49
I tried with the Rocker, wow I can't fly with it :D
Too odd for me ^^

LOL

It takes a bit to get used to. I would imagine going from twist stick to pedals would be the same. I just find that I can make much finer moves with the rocker, whereas when I am trying to do it all on the stick, rudder movements are abrupt and I often end up accidentally twisting when I shouldn't and when i do twist, it throws off the pitch and roll.

To each their own. Do what works for best for you, and try other things. That's what I am doing :)

BENTYx
Jun-04-2014, 19:03
I think i'm gonna stick to the twist :D

Maybe look to get rudder pedals. Depends the price

RAF74_Raptor
Jun-13-2014, 15:46
MSFF2
Saitek Combat Pedals
Obutto Seat
Hotas Warthog Throttle
Razer MMO mouse

IMO MSFFB2 is one of the finest sticks ever made.

nuts
Jun-07-2015, 08:38
I have the saitek x65f, still mapping stuff out and a little confused by the deadzone in and out settings.....once I configure my stick for optimum control , lookout.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

jester_
Jun-07-2015, 19:12
Thrustmaster HOTAS Warthog Throttle and Stick. Gotta fly my jets man.

I also have Saitek Pro rudder pedals.

I'm considering getting the Obutto desk at $360 + the Flight stick mount in the center. I'm just using a big ass table right now and it's very... unsightly.

9./JG52 Ziegler
Jun-07-2015, 19:51
Thrustmaster HOTAS Warthog Throttle and Stick. Gotta fly my jets man.

I also have Saitek Pro rudder pedals.

I'm considering getting the Obutto desk at $360 + the Flight stick mount in the center. I'm just using a big ass table right now and it's very... unsightly.


Like this except for my crosswind pedals! :thumbsup:

LuseKofte
Jun-08-2015, 04:30
My point is , I have owned sticks and yokes and sticks again. If you are new to the game but not to the genre you know the value of your hardware. I have traded up since 2002 , buying and selling and in later years donated.
This sim gets 100% better with a lot of Hotas, I made mine from a 1942 Cessna Bobcat bomber trainer and a Leo Botnhar USB controller. about 350$ and 8 hotas. If you want cheap but quality I recommend this, http://store.madcatz.com/brands/saitek/Saitek-PRO-flight-tpm-system-throttle-prop-mixture-axis-for-PC.html Saitek PRO TPM system
it gives a feel of the real thing. And feels like quality and use it in combination with a cheaper Saitek throttle quadrant.
For sticks it is all about how sure you are in terms of staying to the genre. If you stay for the long term, buy the expensive ones. Not sure buy cheap ones by advices, many of them are great

7./JG26_SMOKEJUMPER
Jun-17-2015, 20:45
I retired my new X55 Joystick in favour of a Microsoft Force Feedback 2.

I now have 4 of them already. Thhey are so awesome that I have no frankensticked mine and the handle is too small so I took a grinder to one and a hacksaw to the other.

17690


17691


Still use the Saitekm X55 throttle and I have a track IR pro.


MFG Crosswind pedals, so good.

diziet
Jun-18-2015, 13:53
So, does the force feedback work in clod?

X-Raptor
Jun-18-2015, 19:53
.....so i took a grinder to one and a hacksaw to the other.

17690


17691




arrhh! Noooo!!:(

Mad G
Jul-03-2015, 07:58
So, does the force feedback work in clod?


Huuuh and how!! With my MS FFBII the recoil of the 109´s MG FF cannons feels like a 40mm Bofors!!:D

Gh0st
Jul-09-2015, 16:02
Saitek x52 pro
Saitek rudder pedals
Track ir
X52 pro was a birthday gift from my wife. It is a few years old and the handle on the joystick us getting loose and it is loosing precision, I will try to fix that and maybe get another year out of it. The throttle works great but I violently dislike the ps2 connector between the throttle and joystick.
The double function trigger on the joystick feels is a bit long and I perceive it as lag.
Track ir is great after getting used to it.
User experience went down the tube after I upgraded the software.
I have a desk and an old chair with wheels on smooth flooring. ..which exercises my core muscles. Who knew... I get to exercise while I'm playing video games.



Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G900A using Tapatalk

Volunteer
Jul-09-2015, 17:10
Guys/gals,

Please don't fall over laughing but I use the Logitech Attack3 joystick! Yeah, straight from the Ark! Currently I'm still trying to patch the game and to figure out the three or so million tidbits one needs to know about the game. So, I haven't much flown yet. Very importantly, I hope to find help here as I have no idea how to get the joystick connected and set up. Will welcome any tips, please, especially where the connection and set up thingie for the joystick is done.

Pirabee.


If it wiggles it will do! :) :thumbsup:

Davison
Nov-02-2015, 23:17
Here's my setup:

https://i.gyazo.com/db7847ac0395c84d1a300d66d0ada98c.jpg

Joystick/Throttle: Thrustmaster HOTAS Warthog
Pedals: Saitek Combat Pro's (Pedals are Broke AF though, saving up for some crosswinds to replace them)
Primary Tower: ASUS Z97A MB, 32GB DDR3 G.Skill Ripjaws @ 1866mhz, Intel I7-4790K, 2x GTX 970's, 1x Intel 730 248GB SSD, 2x WD 2TB HDD @ 7200RPM
Other Peripherals: Razer Blackwidow Chroma, Razer Kraken 7.1 Chroma, Logitech G502 Proteus Core, Logitech G13 Gamepad.

Vortice
Jan-26-2016, 14:31
Thrustmaster Cougar in standard configuration - Thrustmaster RCS pedals - Opentrack head tracking with Sony PS3 camera and homebrew 3-point model.

I'm also in the process of building an arduino based USB game controller with six additional analogue axes and 32 buttons, because you can't have too many of those. :D

ATAG_Flare
Jan-29-2016, 10:34
Finally thinking of getting a hotas. I'm looking at the X52 Pro. Anyone have anything good or bad to say about it or an alternative in the same price range? ~$200

Stormrider
Jan-30-2016, 08:11
Finally thinking of getting a hotas. I'm looking at the X52 Pro. Anyone have anything good or bad to say about it or an alternative in the same price range? ~$200

I use a x52 pro for 2years now and had some problems with it, but I was able to solve them.This stick connected to an usb 3.0 port can give problems.It made my stick stop working and pc hang.Only a hard reset made it work again.I turned off some smart charching function for my usb 3.0 ports and it solved my problem of my stick and pc stop working.
On the thottle there is a little stick you can use as a mouse, this can give a problem with teamspeak but can be solved with some setting in teamspeak.
My trigger has already stopped once working, I was able to fix it by opening the stick.On this forum I shared pictures of it.
The connection cable between the throttle and stick is also a weak part.I made a solid connection between th throttle and stick by soldering the wire.It is not removeable anymore but that is not a problem for me.
The software can also give problems, but you need it to be able to use all the functions of that stick.With win10 you have to follow a special procedure to install the drivers because they are not certified by microsoft.
As far as I know the pro and normal version are almost the same, only with the pro version you can program that mdf for other things.For Il2-1946 one guy made it possible to readout your heading and speed on that mdf and some more things.Does this justify the higher price of the pro version?This is ofcourse a very personal thing, for me after these years I say not.
If my joystick now should break down, I won't buy this one again.And if my son of 14 now should say te me I've want to buy a x52-pro stick I will tell him to wait and save more money to buy a better one.
I hope this helps you to make the right decisionel for which hotas to buy.It is not a really bad stick, but only one with maybe some problems.In that pricerange there a not so many alternatives(none I think), therefor maybe wait and save more money.

cheers Stormrider

1lokos
Jan-30-2016, 10:27
As far as I know the pro and normal version are almost the same, only with the pro version you can program that mdf for other things.



Saitek X-52 PRO has more:

Dual spring system - to give more progressive resistance, the sliding cone is in metal (1 spring and plastic cone in X-52).
Two HALL sensor per axis in X and Y axis - to improved the X-52 "vanila" poor linearity*
HAT's, trigger in metal
Bigger MFD with more functions.
A better look - less "Tie Fighter". :)

* This can be improved in both versions with the "magnet mod":

https://forum.warthunder.com/index.php?/topic/10004-x-52-pro-profile-and-guide-by-glodark7/#entry89607

BTW - Printed plate to increase spring pressure:

http://www.thingiverse.com/thing:19253

Some people do the inverse, tie spring with zip-ties to reduce the resistance... (The X-55 try please both).

http://pitblog.radsy.com/2009/08/x52-spring-mod/

Bonditaria
Jan-30-2016, 10:39
I got myself a Saitek Pro Flight X-55 Rhino H.O.T.A.S. which cost €209 locally while the X-52 is €199, so not much more... Here is how I have the thing set up, this week

http://theairtacticalassaultgroup.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=20495&d=1454167007

http://theairtacticalassaultgroup.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=20496&d=1454167023

http://theairtacticalassaultgroup.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=20497&d=1454167040

http://theairtacticalassaultgroup.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=20498&d=1454167060

I like the fact the spring can be changed, I'm using the red spring (softest).

I don't like the fact the joystick has a twist for rudder which cannot be physically locked. I have MFG Crosswind pedals, so the twist rudder is turned off in the Saitek software (rudder deadband 1000). In normal operations the stick is not inclined to twist in use at all, but just sometimes under duress it does get twisted which of course sends no signal to the aircraft but it must alter the feel of the stick and thus brings chance of pilot error. Very good hotas, doesn't make one a good pilot though!

Once I thought I'd broken the stick flying very badly in an intense dogfight, and I was cursing my choice of plastic consumer-rip-off. Flight controller? Shite controller!.. but back on the ground I found a huge hole in my wing! This gear seems very sturdy and I expect it to last. I used my old X-45 for about 8 years!

1lokos
Jan-30-2016, 10:46
Good controls setup.

BTW - You can spare 2 switches as magnetos in CLoD is only "what if", has no practical effect in engine start. :D

Bonditaria
Jan-30-2016, 10:59
Good controls setup.

BTW - You can spare 2 switches as magnetos in CLoD is only "what if", has no practical effect in engine start. :D

I know for a fact I can start my engine without toggling magnetos, but that fact makes me sad, so I ignore that fact and use the switches anyway! lol:thumbsup:

Michael88
Mar-31-2016, 12:20
Thrustmaster Cougar in standard configuration - Thrustmaster RCS pedals - Opentrack head tracking with Sony PS3 camera and homebrew 3-point model.

I'm also in the process of building an arduino based USB game controller with six additional analogue axes and 32 buttons, because you can't have too many of those. :D
I´ve done exactly this, its great and works perfect in combination with the allegroA1302 for all axis but it ruins my nerves because of the amount of wiring&soldering.

Sparky IBEW 353
Jul-15-2016, 18:50
Anyone using the CH Fighterstick and Throttle without pedals? Does the thumbstick on the throttle work ok for controlling the rudder? I'm considering this setup, but it seems like the short throw of the mini stick would make precise adjustments difficult.

1lokos
Jul-15-2016, 19:00
Yes, you can use the mini-stick in throttle to control rudder, as this device is axis with spring to return to center, give proportional control and always return to center.

How good?

At least for taxi, takeoff will work OK, for use as gunsight correction think will need some practice.

BTW - Hand fingers react more fast to brain inputs than foots. Scientific fact. :D

Beeps
Aug-23-2016, 05:15
Hi All.

I have the old X-52, Saitek Combat Pedals and TIR 5.

The X-52 is getting a bit worn, but still hanging on for now.

Reconlcpl
Aug-26-2016, 00:27
Logitec extreme 3d pro,. got all i need for now. FYI,. i just downloaded ol-2 clod n all the patches,. my joystick doesnt respond at all? in fast nothing does keyboard etc,.. ??? help ? Allworks fine on il-2 1946

BOO
Aug-26-2016, 08:41
Logitec extreme 3d pro,. got all i need for now. FYI,. i just downloaded ol-2 clod n all the patches,. my joystick doesnt respond at all? in fast nothing does keyboard etc,.. ??? help ? Allworks fine on il-2 1946

you may need to assign axis and keys in the game controls menu - have a look at Chuck owls guide for the main things to do. If you have anything else Win10 recognises as a controller its also important to keep them lugged in in exactly the same order every time.

If the problem persists, post in the technical forum along with as much info as you can provide.

S

BOO

farley
Aug-26-2016, 10:06
Anyone using the CH Fighterstick and Throttle without pedals? Does the thumbstick on the throttle work ok for controlling the rudder? I'm considering this setup, but it seems like the short throw of the mini stick would make precise adjustments difficult.


I have not done this as i have rudder pedals.
Out of curiosity (more to see if the thumbstick worked), I did try it for trim. The problem is that it returns to the center position when you let it go, and therefore your trim goes back to neutral as well.
You could certainly try it for the rudder, where it is most often in the neutral position anyhow. I can't comment on it's precision Sparky.
Not sure what else it might be used for in the sim.

mestoth
Oct-08-2016, 01:59
I thought I was the only one that flew with a old Microsoft joystick. Fairly rugged old peices of kit!

ATAG_Pattle
Oct-08-2016, 05:17
You are most certainly not the only one mate.

As mentioned earlier, the cannon recoil is unreal!

BOO
Oct-08-2016, 05:52
You are most certainly not the only one mate.

As mentioned earlier, the cannon recoil is unreal!

But can be tamed with a tweak if its affecting your aim.

Ruski
Jan-03-2017, 07:55
Right now I'm usuing a Logitech #D pro with a Nostromo keypad..Also got a FF2 in the closet.could use the keypad with it.Got away from it because of the lack of buttons..
Any opinions on which setup would work better,,i liked the FF2 great precision...My X-52 died awhile back and I fly EAW on-line the keypad shuts out my stick,,I'm working on setting all commands to one keystroke,,Going to see if the keypad works with CLOD Thanks for any advice

Nightdare
Jan-13-2017, 01:01
Right now I'm usuing a Logitech #D pro with a Nostromo keypad..Also got a FF2 in the closet.could use the keypad with it.Got away from it because of the lack of buttons..
Any opinions on which setup would work better,,i liked the FF2 great precision...My X-52 died awhile back and I fly EAW on-line the keypad shuts out my stick,,I'm working on setting all commands to one keystroke,,Going to see if the keypad works with CLOD Thanks for any advice

Most commands can be keybound, only a few are Axis-only.
It depends a little on what you are flying. In a Spitfire, that Nostromo would be well capable of most used commands in itself (especially when adding shift/alt/ctrl modifiers)
I fly with an X55, but most commands are bound to my throttle, My stick simply has Fire/Brake/Reset TrackIR/Push-to-talk, because I don't want to be multitasking with my stick in a dogfight
Just for fun I bound open/close Canopy to my spacebar and Bailout to CTRL+Numlock 0 to my keyboard, since IRL they'd require to 'take hands off the controls'

Giruts
Mar-23-2017, 23:52
Hi all.

Please what joystick do you recommend?

A Microsoft Sidewinder Precision 2 Used or a Thrustmaster T16000M brand new but 3 times more expensive?

I'm most concerned about the precision and durability.. And wish to know if the Sidewinder works fine with Win10.

Thanks!!

RAF74_Buzzsaw
Mar-24-2017, 01:42
Hi all.

Please what joystick do you recommend?

A Microsoft Sidewinder Precision 2 Used or a Thrustmaster T16000M brand new but 3 times more expensive?

I'm most concerned about the precision and durability.. And wish to know if the Sidewinder works fine with Win10.

Thanks!!

Depends if the Microsoft is Force Feedback type... if it is, I would prefer it... but if not, then the Thrustmaster.

Having a good force feedback stick in CLIFFS OF DOVER, especially if you are a guy who really likes to hang it out there in a close and personal knife fight, to throw your aircraft around, and you like to fight near the edge of the stall.... it's GOLD. ;)

However, the Microsoft Sidewinder sticks will eventually wear out... the pots get corroded, switches die.

You can replace them, there are replacement switches and pots on the market, but if you are not into home repairs, then stay with the new stick.

Also, if you are a pilot who religiously sticks to boom and zoom tactics, then a force feedback stick is not as necessary.

ATAG_Lewis
Mar-24-2017, 07:40
Hi all.

Please what joystick do you recommend?

A Microsoft Sidewinder Precision 2 Used or a Thrustmaster T16000M brand new but 3 times more expensive?

I'm most concerned about the precision and durability.. And wish to know if the Sidewinder works fine with Win10.

Thanks!!

I'd go used Microsoft Sidewinder 2 (make sure its the 2) every time...The hardware is top quality and I've said many times the ones you get from eBay are hardly used...Folks who stick with flight sims don't sell them...probably keep them as a solid backup...so any you find used on eBay probably hardly used...I went though a spell of buying them...I got over 10 of them...Everyone of them worked perfectly and none looked like they had been used much...I put a liitle blob of plastic grease in the gimbal of the non-FFB version and thats it...

They are as competitive as the best sticks out there...The hardware is Microsoft good quality...They have the well deserved reputation for being bullet proof by those that use them...You don't need any software with them as all Windows recognise them as plug and play devices...

I can't speak for any expensive sticks with bells and whistles...but I haven't felt the need to change for anything other than the MSSW2 for over 10 years flight simming...

I would buy one of the non-feedback versions just as a backup anyway...I have seen them on eBay yesterday for $10...

If you read through this thread you will see what folks use...

1lokos
Mar-24-2017, 10:45
A Microsoft Sidewinder Precision 2 Used or a Thrustmaster T16000M brand new but 3 times more expensive?

Microsfot Sidewinder Precision 2 USB is old hardware, Sidewinder's production end in 2003 (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Microsoft_SideWinder).
As standard for time use potentiometers in all axes - what has finite useful live - although Microsoft use the best potentiometer seem in joysticks until today.
Precision 2 overall construction is on par with CH sticks, made to last.

Thrusmaster T.16000M is typical "low cost" product of today, with all cuts possible to make production cost low, e.g. don't use mechanical switches but rubber membranes under buttons,
their (only*) advantage is use contact less HALL sensor (same Melexis 3D MLX90333 (http://www.thrustmaster.com/press/heart-hall-effect-accurate-technology-unique-3d-technological-innovation-built-new-thrustmaste) of Tm Warthog) in X, Y axes, what assure noise free signal and theoretically "infinite" useful life.
A detail that all joystick buyer should pay attention when buy a brand new joystick.

But for 1/3 of T.16000M prices (50/60$) not wrong with Precision 2, if fail the loss will be little.

bob101x
Mar-24-2017, 17:26
t

9./JG52 Sturm
Mar-25-2017, 06:18
I've been through several joysticks but personally I'm happy with the VKB Gladiator I have currently. Think you know you're onto a winner when you don't find yourself looking at other joysticks with a view to an upgrade. Not the easiest to get mind. Heard lots of good things about the T1600M, especially if you don't want to break the bank.

Perfesser
Mar-25-2017, 09:58
I have both the MSFFB2 and a CH Fighterstick, still have the X52 as throttle and the stick for extra buttons. I use the FFB2 in CloD, but hate the stick shake from a nose over, damaged or cold engine. The silky smooth center is unique and makes up for any of the other shortfalls(poor button layout and not enough of them).
It's easier to shoot at long ranges(like attacking bombers) with the MS but hanging on the edge of a stall in a fight the CH stick feels better to me and I put more rounds on target.
In DCS I prefer the CH stick, it's more precise and has a more stable feel to it.

1lokos
Mar-25-2017, 10:16
I have both the MSFFB2 and a CH Fighterstick,

Get a used (can be gameport) CH Combatstick, better for WWII planes that Fightestick because the left side "shoulder" thumb button instead HAT = perfect for fire cannons
and fit in MSFFB2 base. "Better of two worlds". :D

http://imageshack.com/a/img922/9086/Zx4mN8.jpg

Perfesser
Mar-25-2017, 21:59
I've seen that mod before - I like it. Would you possibly have a link with more info?

That pic is actually a fighterstick, the thumb is a hat switch, I use that for zoom view in/out. The combat stick has the single fire button there.
I use the pinky button to fire MG only, trigger for MG and cannon both.
That grip and the Sidewinder base would be my ideal setup for CloD.

1lokos
Mar-25-2017, 23:23
Yes, this MOD linked is FighterStick, but are are some with CombatStick.

You have two approach for do this.

Wire CombatStick in MSFFB2 circuit, in this case leave the left HAT left and right buttons unconnected, because CombatStick has 10 buttons (+POV HAT) and MSFFB2 has only 8 (+POV HAT).

Or place a Arduino PRO Micro (~6$) inside CH grip and wire buttons there, in this case Windows/Games will see the MOD as two joysticks, one for axes, other for buttons.
Option more appropriated for use FighterStick since this mas more buttons = 16 + POV HAT.

Sample: https://forums.eagle.ru/showpost.php?p=2234478&postcount=66

Perfesser
Mar-26-2017, 09:54
Great! Thanks.
Now the problem will be to find a broken/dead Fighterstick.... I think they were only USB and even after 5 years mine is as solid as a tank.

1lokos
Mar-26-2017, 10:27
Since CH sticks are "vintage" products you find gameport version made in 1998~1999, that excluding the USB controller is the same of actual joystick.

CH use Japanese OMROM switches - and not copper membrane like Warthog's - for buttons, this things is made to last.

I have a perfect functional with thousand of hours in "dogfights" 1998 CH Combatstick gameport.
Just replace the gameport circuit with 10 bit USB controller.

If you find one gameport in eBay they grip are perfect for this kind of MOD and will cost less than USB versions.

7./JG26_SMOKEJUMPER
Mar-27-2017, 18:24
Nice posts. I've got 5 MSFFB2 sticks and two of them need repairs.

Time to start chopping and soldering.

Nightdare
Jun-25-2017, 11:12
Time to start chopping and soldering.


What I'm wondering, is that I got an unused Logitech G940 here, of which I loved it's FFB
and I currently USE the X55, but really miss the FFB
I wonder if it's possible to get the stick from the X55 on the Logitech body, and how much work this may entail

AKA_Sully
Jun-25-2017, 11:34
I did one awhile ago ..X52 pro/MFFB2..got a warthog since then but this one still works ...

https://theairtacticalassaultgroup.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=6256&d=1387136213

sw1ive
Jun-25-2017, 15:41
Buy a little used SideWinder2 (look-out number 2)

More SideWinder2 Modifys
28959 28960 28961 28962
28963 28964 28965 28966


and the best of SideWinder2 Modify
28967

Nightdare
Jul-02-2017, 15:25
Nice!

Love the MSSW with spade grip

DOWNEAST
Jul-03-2017, 08:49
For what it is worth, I'm very new to SIMs in general (in the .etc age category) and a newbie here only since January. I searched and joined to find the best taildragger flight experience in order to relive my piloting past. Not knowing anything and obtaining all my experience so far from this forum, I chose my set up from advise here. My set up is totally CH and it works for me. The only complaint I have is with the rudder pedals. I think I will eventual try something different because the pedals are a little too close together for my liking.

29126

29127

ATAG_Laser
Jul-30-2017, 08:32
I have the Microsoft precision 2 Joystick (non FFB) which I bought on Lewis's recommendation and I can't really add any more to what he has said about this stick.
Very good, robust and competitive stick, I am more than happy with mine.

I also have the Saitek Pro flight Yoke and 3 lever quadrant which I sometimes use when flying bombers to get more of a bomber feel to my sim flying.

Again, nice piece of kit. Mainly using the MS Sidewinder joystick as I mostly fly RAF fighters, although I have started using the 3 lever quadrant with both set ups.

I am using a set of Saitek pro flight rudder pedals, and I have found these to be adequate for my flying needs. However, I have heard reports from others that the toe brakes are prone to failure with these pedals, although mine have been fine so far. However, as I fly RAF I don't usually use the toe brakes anyway.

There are much better pedals on the market, but be prepared to shell out a lot more money for them. Would recommend the saiteks if you are on a budget though.

Finally to Head tracking. I use Ed Tracker, which is a good, and much cheaper alternative to Track IR. Although you only get 3 DOF with Ed Tracker as opposed to 7DOF with Track IR, there are work arounds using opentrack to enable the "Lean out of the cockpit to check 6" facility, and Ed Tracker is not affected by light in the same way as Track IR
29763297622976429765

DarrenMc
Feb-12-2019, 23:10
Any stick with a working profile,stay away from CH products because they don’t have any ,not for the Spitfire anyway.

OlavV
Feb-13-2019, 06:10
Logitech Extreme 3D Pro.

Captain Leonard
Jul-03-2019, 06:16
any advice on what joystick would be suitable for a older pilot with a shaky hand pls.

1lokos
Jul-03-2019, 12:10
Leonard

Depends if you want spent $100 or $500+. :D

Up to $100 the best option is VKB Gladiator Mk.II (contactless sensor in X, Y and twist axes), secondly Thrustmaster T.16000M (contacless sensor in X, Y axes).
Avoid other models in this price range, all use cheap potentiometers = worm out with use, spikes and headache.

Between $100 and ~$200 options are:

CH Fighterstick PRO (an vintage 1999 product), Saitek X-52 and X-52 PRO HOTAS.

Between $200 and 300

Warthog stick standalone* (~$210 in Amazon), Saitek X-56.

* Warthog and CH Fighterstick, require a rudder pedals or a throttle with rudder control, e.g. TWCS, so their real cost is more.

Above $300 - the "high end":

VKB Gunfigher with KG-12 grip or Kosmosima or MCG/MCG PRO grips. Customizable CAM gimbal. Prices $360 to $460, depends on grip option.

- Kosmosima grip has embed "twist axis" for rudder control.

VPC WarBRD with WarBRD grip, Delta grip or T50/T50 CM grip, V.F.X. (F-14) grip. Customizable CAM gimbal. Prices slight above VKB, depends on grip option.

VPC T50CM with WarBRD grip, Delta grip or T50/T50 CM grip, V.F.X. (F-14) grip. Customizable CAM gimbal. Prices slight above VKB, depends on grip option.

- VPC Delta, WarBRD, V.F.X. (F-14), Alpha ("Alien") grips has embed "twist axis" for rudder control.


Since none of "high end" options include throttle solution add at least $90 (Thrustmaster TWCS throttle) in their cost, or $ 360 for VirPil throttle, the best "universal" throttle around.
If you fly only propeller planes GVL224 and Kanttorini custom throttles are best option, with similar price.

Then, before all, answer: "Ho much I want spend?" :D

III./ZG76_Saipan
Jul-03-2019, 12:56
https://www.amazon.com/Saitek-PS28-Flight-Control-System/dp/B00030GSJY/ref=sr_1_2?brr=1&qid=1562172883&rd=1&s=electronics&sr=1-2

good mid range value..and good pedals if so desired

Bussard
Oct-01-2019, 00:58
I can recommend this one, VKB-Sim Gladiator Mk.II Joystick. Now using it for 1/2 year, stable, responsive and solid. Best I ever had, apart from MS Sidewinder FF2.
It comes for € 94. Before this one I had the Thrustmaster T-16000M, comes for € 60 now, but the VKB is worth the extra price. VKB has a metal plate keeping it on it's place, and the feather is better.


https://flightsimcontrols.com/product/vkb-sim-gladiator-mk-ii-joystick/