Current Status of TF 5.0 build

There have been some questions re. the current status of the TF 5.0 'Tobruk' build.


It has been stated many, many, times TF does not post Release dates... that is not our responsibility. TF/1C will not be changing our policy.


Regarding the overall progress, here is a brief summary:


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Aircraft


German


Bf108 Taifun Advanced Trainer - cockpit finished except for typical minor texture fixes which are done once the artist can see the aircraft in game... in the Import queue.


Bf109E-7 (DB601Aa) - cockpit finished except for typical minor texture fixes which are done once the artist can see the aircraft in game... in the Import queue.
Bf109E-7N (DB601N) - cockpit finished except for typical minor texture fixes which are done once the artist can see the aircraft in game... in the Import queue.
Bf109E-7NZ (DB601N - cockpit finished except for typical minor texture fixes which are done once the artist can see the aircraft in game... in the Import queue. GM-1 Nitrous Oxide injection Alpha has been created and is in testing.
Tropical versions - external and cockpit finished except for typical minor texture fixes which are done once the artist can see the aircraft in game... in the Import queue. Alpha for effects of dust filters on engine performance has been coded and awaiting testing.


Me109F-1 with MG/FFM - already in game with early alpha cockpit, cockpit high resolution textures almost complete except for typical minor texture fixes which are done once the artist can see the aircraft in game.
Me109F-2 with MG151/15mm (DB601N) - already in game with early alpha cockpit, cockpit high resolution textures almost complete except for typical minor texture fixes which are done once the artist can see the aircraft in game.
Me109F-2 with MG151/20mm (DB601N) - already in game with early alpha cockpit, cockpit high resolution textures almost complete except for typical minor texture fixes which are done once the artist can see the aircraft in game.
Me109F-2 with MG151/20mm Tropical (DB601N) - already in game with early alpha cockpit, cockpit high resolution textures almost complete except for typical minor texture fixes which are done once the artist can see the aircraft in game.
Me109F-4 (DB601E 1.30ata) - already in game with early alpha cockpit, cockpit high resolution textures almost complete except for typical minor texture fixes which are done once the artist can see the aircraft in game.
Me109F-4 (DB601E 1.30ata) Tropical - already in game with early alpha cockpit, cockpit high resolution textures almost complete except for typical minor texture fixes which are done once the artist can see the aircraft in game. External model 3D finished, textures underway. Alpha for effects of dust filters on engine performance has been coded and awaiting testing.
Me109F-4 (DB601E 1.42ata) Tropical - already in game with early alpha cockpit, cockpit high resolution textures almost complete except for typical minor texture fixes which are done once the artist can see the aircraft in game. External model 3D finished, textures underway. Alpha for effects of dust filters on engine performance has been coded and awaiting testing.
Me109F-4 (DB601E 1.42ata) Tropical - already in game with early alpha cockpit, cockpit high resolution textures almost complete except for typical minor texture fixes which are done once the artist can see the aircraft in game. External model 3D finished, textures underway. Alpha for effects of dust filters on engine performance has been coded and awaiting testing.
Me109F-4/R1 Flugelgondelbewaffnung mit MG 151/20 (DB601E 1.42ata, underwing 20mm gunpods) - already in game with early alpha cockpit, cockpit high resolution textures almost complete except for typical minor texture fixes which are done once the artist can see the aircraft in game. External model 3D finished, textures underway.
Me109F-4/R1 Flugelgondelbewaffnung mit MG 151/20 Tropical (DB601E 1.42ata, underwing 20mm gunpods) - already in game with early alpha cockpit, cockpit high resolution textures almost complete except for typical minor texture fixes which are done once the artist can see the aircraft in game. External model 3D finished, textures underway. Alpha for effects of dust filters on engine performance has been coded and awaiting testing.


Ju-88A-4/A-5/C-2 - Awaiting 3D modelers (who will start immediately they complete their existing work.. i.e. very soon)


Heinkel He-111H-6 Torpedo bomber - Awaiting 3D modelers (who will start immediately they complete their existing work.. i.e. very soon)


Note: Both the above are relatively minor projects... the exception being the Ju-88C-2... but even that case is not on the same level as the other major aircraft projects already completed.


Italian


Fiat CR-42 - already in game with full rez cockpit, except for typical minor texture fixes which are done once the artist can see the aircraft in game. External work for FB underway. Keep watching for next Update. ;)


Macchi C-202 Series III (hopefully) - 3D external model complete, texturing, damage underway. Cockpit model 3D underway... keep watching for next Update... ;)
Macchi C-202 Series VIII (hopefully) - see above


French


Dewoitine D.520 (Hispano 12Y45 engine) - already in game with complete external, full rez cockpit, except for typical minor texture fixes which are done once the artist can see the aircraft in game. Watch for upcoming Update. ;)
Dewoitine D.520 (Hispano 12Y49 high altitude) - See above


British


Gladiator II (with Tropical filter) - already in game with complete external, full rez cockpit, everything complete. Alpha for effects of dust filters on engine performance has been coded and awaiting testing.


Spitfire IIB (IIA with two 20mm cannon, four .303) - already in game with complete external, full rez cockpit, everything complete except for addition of two button firing control for cannon and MG's.

Spitfire VA (eight .303 +12 boost) - already in game with complete external, full rez cockpit, everything complete. Watch for upcoming update. ;)
Spitfire VB (+12 boost) - All 3D, damage and textures finished for both external and cockpit, except for typical minor texture fixes which are done once the artist can see the aircraft in game. Currently being imported.
Spitfire VB (+16 boost) - All 3D, damage and textures finished for both external and cockpit, except for typical minor texture fixes which are done once the artist can see the aircraft in game. Currently being imported.
Spitfire VB (Merlin 46 High Altitude) - All 3D, damage and textures finished for both external and cockpit, except for typical minor texture fixes which are done once the artist can see the aircraft in game. Currently being imported.
Spitfire VB Tropical (+16 boost) - All 3D, damage and textures finished for both external and cockpit, except for typical minor texture fixes which are done once the artist can see the aircraft in game. Currently being imported. Alpha for effects of dust filters on engine performance has been coded and awaiting testing.
Spitfire VB Tropical (Merlin 46 High Altitude) - All 3D, damage and textures finished for both external and cockpit, except for typical minor texture fixes which are done once the artist can see the aircraft in game. Currently being imported. Alpha for effects of dust filters on engine performance has been coded and awaiting testing.


Hurricane IIA (eight .303) - All 3D, damage and textures finished for both external and cockpit, except for typical minor texture fixes which are done once the artist can see the aircraft in game. Currently being imported.
Hurricane IIB (twelve .303) - All 3D, damage and textures finished for both external and cockpit, except for typical minor texture fixes which are done once the artist can see the aircraft in game. Currently being imported.
Hurricane IIB Fighter-Bomber - All 3D, damage and textures finished for both external and cockpit, except for typical minor texture fixes which are done once the artist can see the aircraft in game. Currently being imported.
Hurricane IIC (four 20mm) - All 3D, damage and textures finished for both external and cockpit, except for typical minor texture fixes which are done once the artist can see the aircraft in game. In Import queue.
Hurricane IIC Light Fighter - 3D work and textures underway.
Hurricane IID Tankbuster - 3D work and textures underway.
Tropical versions of all except IIC Light Fighter and IID - Complete and finalized... In Import queue. Alpha for effects of dust filters on engine performance has been coded and awaiting testing.


Beaufighter Mk IF - Late (with Hercules XI) - All 3D, damage and textures finished for both external and cockpit, except for typical minor texture fixes which are done once the artist can see the aircraft in game. Currently being imported.
Beaufighter Mk IC (with Hercules XI, bombs) - All 3D, damage and textures finished for both external and cockpit, except for typical minor texture fixes which are done once the artist can see the aircraft in game. Currently being imported.
Versions with Tropical filters) - See above. Alpha for effects of dust filters on engine performance has been coded and awaiting testing.


Wellington IA - All 3D, damage and textures finished for both external and cockpit, except for typical minor texture fixes which are done once the artist can see the aircraft in game. In Import queue.
Wellington IC (with waist gun positions) - All 3D, damage and textures finished for cockpits, except for typical minor texture fixes which are done once the artist can see the aircraft in game. External model waist gunner position 3D work to be assigned.
(and versions with Tropical filters)- See above.


Blenheim IV/IF with Tropical filters External model Tropical filters to be assigned. (very minor work... uses the same filters as Gladiator... already done)


American


P-40C (Tomahawk IIB) - 3D and damage modeling complete for external, texuring underway. Cockpit 3D modeling nearly complete.
P-40E (Kittyhawk IA) - 3D and damage modeling complete for both cockpit and external, texuring nearly complete. Expected to enter the Import queue shortly.

Early and late versions of both these aircraft... different boost levels... no difference to modeling... FM's already in place.


Martlet III - 3D and damage modeling complete for both cockpit and external, texuring nearly complete. Expected to enter the Import queue shortly. 


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Tobruk Map - Original map v1 was created manually by writing code into the game... since TF received the Source Code we have gotten access to the original 1C/Maddox Map Tool. This allows members who are not coders to create and modify maps. After a re-coding of the tool to solve some issues with water placement, coastal depth, etc. it is now functional and in use by our expanded map team. Terrain bump map from original Tobruk map v1 version has been imported into Map Tool and the team are in the process of texturing, road creation, airfield creation, object placement, etc. for v2. We will release an update on the map v2 in the near future.... when it is ready for viewing. ;)


BoB Map - Changes will be limited to bug fixes, airfield flattening, etc.

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Effects - Audio: Alpha v2 beginning testing Oct 15.


Effects - Visual: Alpha v2 beginning testing Oct 15.

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FM/DM - FM/DM Alphas already done, tweaking and detailing ongoing as aircraft complete import and become flyable. As mentioned previously, many coding changes already incorporated, including such things as split radiators for 109's, new propellor/governor types for the new aircraft, dust filter effects, as for example, open/closed pilot option for those aircraft types which had this option, loss of power due to filter, and potential damage effects when a pilot leaves a filter bypassed when taking off in a desert map. Also new overheat system, new damage modeling for oxygen bottles exploding when hit, new damage modeling for ammunition trays exploding when hit, new drop tank implementation, new GM-1 Nitrous Oxide injection, etc. etc.


AI - Alpha v2 ready for internal testing Oct 8.

Whew! This is a huge near-completed shopping list. Kudos to Team Fusion Simulations for the huge amount of work done so far!

Exciting times. :thumbsup:

:salute:

WOW! Feels like an early.....

Attachment 37109

Thanks all!

:thumbsup:

(Oh, I don't mean this to suggest that it will be ready for Xmas:D)

Thanks Buzz,

And I'm thinking these works are the tip of the tip of the iceberg of the full work being completed.

Thanks to all. :salute:

Pattle

Thanks Buzz for the update and info! Man that's a long list of new aircraft and variants! S!

ITS GOING TO BE EPIC!:salute:

good to hear keep us in the loop.

Lots of typing in that one and I love to hear all of that info.:thumbsup: :salute:

Sounds superb !

Thanks for posting and keeping us so well informed .

So looking forward to flying the Gladiator and the P40 .... can almost taste it .:thumbsup:

Thanks for the progress update Buzzsaw.

A lot of work done, but seemingly still a lot of work still to do before 5.0 is ready.

Thank you all at TFS for your continued hard work on our behalf.

I am sure that when we get our hands on the Tobruk map, and all the new aircraft, it will be well worth the wait.

I am just looking forward to getting cannon armed Spits and Hurricanes :shoot:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by ATAG_Laser

I am just looking forward to getting cannon armed Spits and Hurricanes :shoot:

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mmm ... cannon armed spits

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v3...37240064_n.jpg

Thank you for the comprehensive update Buzz. It is very much appreciated.

The amount of work the TFS team are putting in to bring us 5.0 is phenomenal.

Looking forward to flying all these different aircraft and using the new maps.

'The Dream' is well and truly alive. A big thanks to all involved. :thumbsup:

o7 :salute:

Great post Buzz! :thumbsup:

Has been anything done about the two newly introduced issues in blitz? :recon:
I'm still worried about these issues in Blitz because it makes the feeling of the planes very flat compared to 4.312

1.) About the engine rpm bug of the german/italian planes?

Max rated rpm with max rated manifold schould do max power and low rpm should mean lower power at the same throttle/manifold pressure.

Currently in Blitz you get max power at low rpm aswell (with enough boost available).

There should be a rpm power curve, but in Blitz theres no rpm power curve for german/italian planes anymore.

1800/2400 = 3/4 1800 would be about 75% of the available 100% power

But you are only loosing 5 - 10 km/h by the slow running effect i.e less efficient magneto/engine-fireing when running very low at 1800

Not to talk about that this was simple math - of course there could be even worse efficiency with advanced math and different rpm power curve characteristics of engines.

Note: It's the reason of the very strong torque and wings touching ground on take off and reason of very hardly getting out of stall because of too high torque.


2.) Has been anything done - effecting generally all planes - about boost not reacting anymore to changing rpm from high to low and vice versa without changing the throttle state?
Means at 80% throttle at seelevel - you go from low rpm to high rpm, the manifold should go down a bit and vice versa?

Note: Because of this issue planes need alot more time to slow down and this keeps the plane way too long in the air making landing alot harder.




Other than that great to hear your progress. :salute:

https://proxy.duckduckgo.com/iu/?u=h...7A3F496%2F&f=1


Click on the link if you like tropical Spitfires with canons..:salute:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Tibsun

Great post Buzz! :thumbsup:

Has been anything done about the two newly introduced issues in blitz? :recon:
I'm still worried about these issues in Blitz because it makes the feeling of the planes very flat compared to 4.312

1.) About the engine rpm bug of the german/italian planes?

Max rated rpm with max rated manifold schould do max power and low rpm should mean lower power at the same throttle/manifold pressure.

Currently in Blitz you get max power at low rpm aswell (with enough boost available).

There should be a rpm power curve, but in Blitz theres no rpm power curve for german/italian planes anymore.

1800/2400 = 3/4 1800 would be about 75% of the available 100% power

But you are only loosing 5 - 10 km/h by the slow running effect i.e less efficient magneto/engine-fireing when running very low at 1800

Not to talk about that this was simple math - of course there could be even worse efficiency with advanced math and different rpm power curve characteristics of engines.

Note: It's the reason of the very strong torque and wings touching ground on take off and reason of very hardly getting out of stall because of too high torque.


2.) Has been anything done - effecting generally all planes - about boost not reacting anymore to changing rpm from high to low and vice versa without changing the throttle state?
Means at 80% throttle at sea level - you go from low rpm to high rpm, the manifold should go down a bit and vice versa?

Note: Because of this issue planes need alot more time to slow down and this keeps the plane way too long in the air making landing a lot harder.

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We believe the game's modeling of power generation and torque is more accurate. In real life these aircraft engines had enormous torque at low speeds, and adding full throttle in an almost stalled state could flip an aircraft on its back.

Re. boost, we also believe the modeling is more accurate. Maximum boost does not require maximum rpm at less than Full Throttle Height.

Thanks for the update, Buzz.

Exciting stuff indeed!

:salute:

Respect!:salute:

Unbelievable checklist! and I know that ain't exhaustive!

Quote:

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Originally Posted by RAF74_Buzzsaw

We believe the game's modeling of power generation and torque is more accurate. In real life these aircraft engines had enormous torque at low speeds, and adding full throttle in an almost stalled state could flip an aircraft on its back.

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The torque at max rpm, max boost and max generated power wasn't in question and isn't the issue I'm talking about.

I see theres a little language barrier.

Please don't confuse the the words Boost, RPM, Power and Torque alltogether. They are all very well chosen.


The issue is that a 109 at 1800 rpm + 1.3 ata generates full power in Blitz, means the 109 can reach top speed with a rpm of 1800 and 1.3 ata

Please see 1:50 https://youtu.be/MdmrOlDc_Ow?t=110

1700 RPM at 1.3 ata does 460 in this video. The RPM is the bug

I say it again, the RPM-power-curve, is the issue in question, was working in 4.312.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by RAF74_Buzzsaw

Re. boost, we also believe the modeling is more accurate. Maximum boost does not require maximum rpm at less than Full Throttle Height.

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Regarding boost - the max manifold available at altitude depending on rpm is very very correctly modeled and is not in question.
Please see here:

Blitz, bugged: - https://youtu.be/opz8EnYYBYM

4.312 works: - https://youtu.be/9uCwOIUSAIo

Realistic - see minute 5:20 - https://youtu.be/wR8SOB1Fmbg?t=320 see how rpm drops on landing and manifold goes up towards 1.0 ata

Now the issue is that the manifold isn't dropping in extremes like throttle 0%, changing the rpm of idle 600 up to 2500 which would make the boost drop much lower, now this is bugged and creates troubles on slowing down with engine brake.

Could the Tobruk patch be released without the Macchi C-202s if they're going to take a long time to complete? Have them added in a small patch later on.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Tibsun

The torque at max rpm, max boost and max generated power wasn't in question and isn't the issue I'm talking about.

I see theres a little language barrier.

Please don't confuse the the words Boost, RPM, Power and Torque alltogether. They are all very well chosen.


The issue is that a 109 at 1800 rpm + 1.3 ata generates full power in Blitz, means the 109 can reach top speed with a rpm of 1800 and 1.3 ata

Please see 1:50 https://youtu.be/MdmrOlDc_Ow?t=110

1700 RPM at 1.3 ata does 460 in this video. The RPM is the bug

I say it again, the RPM-power-curve, is the issue in question, was working in 4.312.




Regarding boost - the max manifold available at altitude depending on rpm is very very correctly modeled and is not in question.
Please see here:

Blitz, bugged: - https://youtu.be/opz8EnYYBYM

4.312 works: - https://youtu.be/9uCwOIUSAIo

Realistic - see minute 5:20 - https://youtu.be/wR8SOB1Fmbg?t=320 see how rpm drops on landing and manifold goes up towards 1.0 ata

Now the issue is that the manifold isn't dropping in extremes like throttle 0%, changing the rpm of idle 600 up to 2500 which would make the boost drop much lower, now this is bugged and creates troubles on slowing down with engine brake.

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This man is not upvoted enough.
I honestly have no idea if the RPM should affect other engine parameters as much as I am in no way a specialist on internal combustion engines (however it stands to reason since an aircraft engine can be regarded as a closed non discrete system wherein every parameter is interconnected with others), but if it should I want it back as in 4.312 this added another perceived layer of complexity to actually managing your performance

Hello Tibsun

I am happy to look at whether this is an issue, but I need more information.

It is not true that you can get full speed from the aircraft at high boost, low rpm.... for example the 109's have a top speed of around 500 kmh, you are showing 460 kmh at most.

I would also say these are engine boost/rpm settings which no player would normally use when playing the game. No one would use 1800 rpm and max throttle.

We are also planning to introduce new overheat changes which will make the engine more likely to overheat and suffer damage at these types of settings... which they would in real life.

Other effects you show I cannot replicate.

I will need a detailed walk through of how you got your results.

I would also ask you to make sure you have deleted the cache file in your "Documents/1C SoftClub/il-2 sturmovik cliffs of dover" prior to any tests... and make sure you don't have multiple versions of the game installed and used concurrently.

Please send me a detailed PM explaining the following in the videos you have shown:

- Aircraft type

- Prop pitch settings

- Throttle and rpm settings

Any additional videos you provide, please show in the video an information window with throttle and prop pitch displays. (0-100%)

Do not post here, this is a thread detailing the progress of the mods for TF 5.0. If you want to post publicly, do it in the Bugtracker.

Thanks

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Tibsun

The torque at max rpm, max boost and max generated power wasn't in question and isn't the issue I'm talking about.

I see theres a little language barrier.

Please don't confuse the the words Boost, RPM, Power and Torque alltogether. They are all very well chosen.


The issue is that a 109 at 1800 rpm + 1.3 ata generates full power in Blitz, means the 109 can reach top speed with a rpm of 1800 and 1.3 ata

Please see 1:50 https://youtu.be/MdmrOlDc_Ow?t=110

1700 RPM at 1.3 ata does 460 in this video. The RPM is the bug

I say it again, the RPM-power-curve, is the issue in question, was working in 4.312.




Regarding boost - the max manifold available at altitude depending on rpm is very very correctly modeled and is not in question.
Please see here:

Blitz, bugged: - https://youtu.be/opz8EnYYBYM

4.312 works: - https://youtu.be/9uCwOIUSAIo

Realistic - see minute 5:20 - https://youtu.be/wR8SOB1Fmbg?t=320 see how rpm drops on landing and manifold goes up towards 1.0 ata

Now the issue is that the manifold isn't dropping in extremes like throttle 0%, changing the rpm of idle 600 up to 2500 which would make the boost drop much lower, now this is bugged and creates troubles on slowing down with engine brake.

---

Quote:

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Originally Posted by RAF74_Buzzsaw

No one would use 1800 rpm and max throttle.

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Actually when I (and some pilots I know) fly Bf-109 and the mission is to escort bombers deep in England (on servers like TWC Campaign), always flying with 1800 RPM and max throttle, because fuel economy is incredible.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Rostic

Actually when I (and some pilots I know) fly Bf-109 and the mission is to escort bombers deep in England (on servers like TWC Campaign), always flying with 1800 RPM and max throttle, because fuel economy is incredible.

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Hi all,

Putting my mechanic's hat on for a sec. Both of you are correct. Like Buzz said, detonation damage isn't modeled yet at those settings. Pilots ferrying to North Africa would use that technique¹, often damaging their engines in the process. They would run high throttle at low RPM for fuel efficiency. That is a big no-no IRL.

I would love to get more in depth on the DB6XX series engines as I don't know much about them. The "bugged" Spitfire video having its prop swinged at full throttle is (nonintuitively) behaving correctly.

We have an in depth discussion on Merlin boost here if anyone's interested. Especially the discussion dealing with why boost stays high with full throttle and low RPM. Would love a new discussion (or reopening of one) for the DB series.

Regards,

-Z



¹The Decisive Campaigns of the Desert Air Force 1942-1945 Pg. 12

I am (really) sorry not to understand the technical details.

What a 'pilot only' player would greatly appreciate would be a kind of manual how to get the best speed out of different types and sub-types at different altitude.

I repeatedly did some testing pre-Blitz and with Blitz when I found the time and told the results to my squad mates, but I still feel it should be possible to get more out of some planes.
For example I cannot find any difference in speed between a Spit Ia (100 oct) and a Spit II at sea level. I just know that the Ia should be a bit fasgter. So, obviously I am missing something.

For the Beaufighter for example, we all are still relying on this very first, pre-release video from ATAG-Lewis.

With 5.0 on the horizon I am looking forward to test fly all the new aircraft but it would be very, very nice to have some information about what to expect and how to achieve it.

Would it be a good idea to have some special threads here in the forum, discussing such things, publishing test results etc?
I' am sure quite a lot of people would contribute about their favourite planes.


S!

DerDa

We hope to have the aircraft manuals better organized and with more detail for TF 5.0. :salute:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by DerDa

I am (really) sorry not to understand the technical details.

What a 'pilot only' player would greatly appreciate would be a kind of manual how to get the best speed out of different types and sub-types at different altitude.

I repeatedly did some testing pre-Blitz and with Blitz when I found the time and told the results to my squad mates, but I still feel it should be possible to get more out of some planes.
For example I cannot find any difference in speed between a Spit Ia (100 oct) and a Spit II at sea level. I just know that the Ia should be a bit fasgter. So, obviously I am missing something.

For the Beaufighter for example, we all are still relying on this very first, pre-release video from ATAG-Lewis.

With 5.0 on the horizon I am looking forward to test fly all the new aircraft but it would be very, very nice to have some information about what to expect and how to achieve it.

Would it be a good idea to have some special threads here in the forum, discussing such things, publishing test results etc?
I' am sure quite a lot of people would contribute about their favourite planes.


S!

DerDa

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I'm really excited about the new AI. That, better communications, working SP Loadouts and maybe a decent dynamic campaign and I'd be in SP-heaven :D

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Eisenfaust

I'm really excited about the new AI. That, better communications, working SP Loadouts and maybe a decent dynamic campaign and I'd be in SP-heaven :D

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"SP Loadouts"!!!!!!!!!!