Please please create a mod that allows aileron trim in Spits and Hurricanes

[scpelly]

Dear Team Fusion

I'm new to IL2 Cliffs of Dover and I'm really excited at the potential of the game. However, I've noticed the Spits and Hurricanes have an awful sharp right bank tendency on starting the game. My joystick is calibrated and I can sort of correct the problem with rudder trim but then I end up flying in a slip (yep, that's how much rudder is needed). PLEASE could you enable aileron trim for these aircraft as that will solve the problem perfectly. I know these planes didn't have aileron trim in real life but I must say this problem is so irritating that I've stopped playing the game. Would this be difficult to enable?

Many thanks
Steve

[Mysticpuma]

Hi Steve. I'm not going to say it isn't possible but you sort of answered your own question with "I know these planes didn't have aileron trim in real life".

Team Fusion have a huge list of things to fix, create, update, improve and add BUT this is a Flight Simulator and as such the aircraft and features are designed to be historic (as much as possible) and if an aircraft didn't have trim then that's exactly how it's modelled. Moving forward in real life aircraft for WW2, it was realised trim was important, that's why new aircraft had that feature included.

We are building new aircraft and as such these will include the features they had in real life, but adding features to aircraft to make them.easier to.fly isn't what a Simulation is about, it's about simulating the difficulty had by the fledgling aviators of WW2 and as such this isn't a bug but a simulated feature.

Sorry to be negative but it's better to be honest than raise false hope for an historical inaccurate feature.

Cheers, MP

[scpelly]

Hi MP

I hear you when it comes to keeping it real but that's just the point, a sharp bank to the right with all trims neutral and stick centred isn't realistic. If anything, the aircraft should be rolling left counter to the propeller. Here's a thought, as far as I know aileron trim could be adjusted by the ground crew (on the ground obviously), so the pilot could give feedback as to whether he felt the plane was rolling one way or another at a set speed (cruising speed usually). With a bit of trial and error, the ground crew could eventually set up aileron trim to his liking. Something like that could be built into the game and adjusted under an aircraft setup menu?

Steve

[Continu0]

Hi MP

I hear you when it comes to keeping it real but that's just the point, a sharp bank to the right with all trims neutral and stick centred isn't realistic. If anything, the aircraft should be rolling left counter to the propeller. Here's a thought, as far as I know aileron trim could be adjusted by the ground crew (on the ground obviously), so the pilot could give feedback as to whether he felt the plane was rolling one way or another at a set speed (cruising speed usually). With a bit of trial and error, the ground crew could eventually set up aileron trim to his liking. Something like that could be built into the game and adjusted under an aircraft setup menu?

Steve

Hey Steve

What you are mentioning about the ground crew might be right, but trim is in close relationsship with speed. So at a certain speed, even in the game as it is now, the plane will fly quite straight. Your suggested solution would probably just shift the proble to another speed-range.

But something else: Please have a look at the aileron-positions in the game (look at your virtual wing). I had some strange bugs lately where my joystick was calibrated perfectly but the game didn't seem to read the joystick-position correctly, resulting in a rolling that was way too hard. I then discovered that the ailerons were slightly off on my virtual wing. Restarting the PC/Game did solve that.

I hope I was able to help,
Conti

[1lokos]

scpelly

You problem is:

The aileron trim is adjusted - by ground crew - for cruise speed, at specific RPM, in that speed Spit fly straight all day,
but when you go full throttle or near you need compensate with control column.

Anyway, if you want a "cheat" with these programming soft for HOTAS - TARGET, CH Manager ... you can set curves that "trim" Spit (or any plane, in any game) aileron at any speed.

[scpelly]

Guys thanks for all the feedback, but I feel we're missing the main point here - my aircraft rolls strongly to the right. If anything, it should roll to the left with trims neutral and the stick centred, as the prop is spinning clockwise (viewed from the cockpit).

Is this not a "bug" in the game? I'm also not sure if everybody is experiencing this same thing. I thought it may be my joystick but it seems the Logitek Extreme 3D pro is quite popular.

[scpelly]

Conti, I think you may be on the button here. With my joystick calibrated and centred, I see that I have some aileron for right bank on my wings. If I give a small push to the left, the ailerons neutralise and the banking stops. Unfortunately however mine is consistent, restarting the game and pc doesn't help at all. Do you think it may be the Logitek Extreme 3D Pro joystick being incompatible?

Steve

Hey Steve

What you are mentioning about the ground crew might be right, but trim is in close relationsship with speed. So at a certain speed, even in the game as it is now, the plane will fly quite straight. Your suggested solution would probably just shift the proble to another speed-range.

But something else: Please have a look at the aileron-positions in the game (look at your virtual wing). I had some strange bugs lately where my joystick was calibrated perfectly but the game didn't seem to read the joystick-position correctly, resulting in a rolling that was way too hard. I then discovered that the ailerons were slightly off on my virtual wing. Restarting the PC/Game did solve that.

I hope I was able to help,
Conti

[Continu0]

Conti, I think you may be on the button here. With my joystick calibrated and centred, I see that I have some aileron for right bank on my wings. If I give a small push to the left, the ailerons neutralise and the banking stops. Unfortunately however mine is consistent, restarting the game and pc doesn't help at all. Do you think it may be the Logitek Extreme 3D Pro joystick being incompatible?

Steve

No, you should be fine with that joystick. 2 Things:

-Could you maybe post 2 Screenshots of your ailerons? I am looking forward to seeing it!

- Try setting up a minimal deadzone in the middle... probably 10% at maximum. I remember that I fixed it that way...

If that solves the problem, your complaint will be the key to solving a hughe problem. We really had a lot of people complaining about the really strong rolling, but the community always was like "no, it is realistic, it is how it is..." (which to some degree is true). But as I experienced the way too strong rolling out of a sudden myself, I fear that many of these complaints were justified and the community was wrong with helping...

[Baffin]

Hi Steve. I'm not going to say it isn't possible but you sort of answered your own question with "I know these planes didn't have aileron trim in real life".

Team Fusion have a huge list of things to fix, create, update, improve and add BUT this is a Flight Simulator and as such the aircraft and features are designed to be historic (as much as possible) and if an aircraft didn't have trim then that's exactly how it's modelled. Moving forward in real life aircraft for WW2, it was realised trim was important, that's why new aircraft had that feature included.

We are building new aircraft and as such these will include the features they had in real life, but adding features to aircraft to make them.easier to.fly isn't what a Simulation is about, it's about simulating the difficulty had by the fledgling aviators of WW2 and as such this isn't a bug but a simulated feature.

Sorry to be negative but it's better to be honest than raise false hope for an historical inaccurate feature.

Cheers, MP

That's not negative! That's the reason we enjoy CLoD so much... Realism!

[arnesw]

That's not negative! That's the reason we enjoy CLoD so much... Realism!

For my part - that's why I don't enjoy CLoD at all. There are options to switch off just about any other realism feature, including torque effects, but this one - that clearly annoys a lot of potential users - is apparently a 'realism' feature that is too important to sacrifice for the sake of playability.

I have no right to demand a fix, of course. If this is how you feel it should be - that's fine. To me, this single issue is the deal breaker.

[Tibsun]

Please check out your callibration, for general controllers on W7 go to your device, right mouse then controller settings and open your callibration with control + shift + left mouse at properties and recalibrate it there if it is off.

To fly hands free, fly as slow and center your "ball" with rudder (important to stop slip an roll too!) until your handsfree with your power settings. Your gonna need to climb anyway.
If it's still a problem you might get an weaker stick or take out the spring.

[SIA_Sp00k]

For my part - that's why I don't enjoy CLoD at all. There are options to switch off just about any other realism feature, including torque effects, but this one - that clearly annoys a lot of potential users - is apparently a 'realism' feature that is too important to sacrifice for the sake of playability.

I have no right to demand a fix, of course. If this is how you feel it should be - that's fine. To me, this single issue is the deal breaker.

There is a flip side to that story. While I accept what you say broadens the player base for offline play, it's the difficulty online, which levels the playing field in multiplayer that keeps me there. Every aircraft has its own nuances. Every player has to deal with and learn from them, using their strengths and avoiding their weaknesses. As a result, there a players I fear, not because they are better than me, but because they know their aircraft and its strengths better than I know my own. This challenge inspires me to learn more and continually seek to best my previous efforts. Some I may never beat and in that I shall always have a game with an element of fear in the air. All those little settings add up to my gaming experience and keeps me coming back.

I know there are players that will only ever play offline. Often, I see other offline pilots posts which say, I am not ready yet for online play. If the options are there which allow easy play, many will never challenge themselves to be better than they have to be for AI aircraft. Improvement through adversity, sounds good to me.

Hope you take the plunge and join us online.

[ATAG_Highseas]

Often, I see other offline pilots posts which say, I am not ready yet for online play. If the options are there which allow easy play, many will never challenge themselves to be better than they have to be for AI aircraft. Improvement through adversity, sounds good to me.

Hope you take the plunge and join us online.

Absolutely agree.

Jump in and fly the plane...

the only hostility you will find will be from the guy on your six... and he will most likely salute you...

the water is warm... dip your toes in...

[Scott_HH]

My first interest is to fly a hurricane, however I should say I have A2A's Spitfire in FSX. Realism is a KO criterion and the graphics of CLOD are fantastic. Yes I did buy the original, but bugs and my slow PC stopped the fun.

I have a new PC and am giving it another go, real thanks to TF (I can hardly imagine how you have done it). There does seem to be a problem in the program with the rolling of British aeroplanes and a measure of denial.

The background to the story.

Elements of a society have taken to wage yet another (world) war. It invests everything in building up its armed forces and in particular with the weapon of the age - Aeroplanes. They are two years from bankrupcy having done this. The rest of the "free" world want peace in our time and their weapons are outdated. All to late a response is made. A single decker version of the Hart biplane, with retractable undercaridge and enclosed cockpit is thrown into production. This is fitted with a new engine from a private venture (PV100). Another more new streamlined aeroplane (version 1A) with complicated wings those production is painfully slow. A beauitiful plane, but a warbird? Up against them we have an aeroplane with fanatstic performance and much improved upon (version E), a true warbird, through combat complete with experienced crew.

So as a beginner I am expecting to be shot down with my less than 10 hours in Spits. I may be accompanied by people from all countries and walks of life. What I am hoping is that the fantastic handling of this aeroplane and a lot of luck is going to see me through my first sortie. There is little chivalry in sneaking up behind a beginner and killing him before he even sees the experienced pilot coming. This is clincial murder.

My first task is to trim the aircraft. Sorry but the Spitfire is a wonderfully balanced aircraft. So good you can read a map even. Since only the upper part of the column moves (cramped cockpit innovation) it has to be. Yes the Spit has no aileron trim, but it does not need it.

We do not have an enigma here. Yes that had 4 rotating wheels .., and was uncrackable (greetings to all the Poles flying). There is a program issue. It is that simple.

Greetings to any pilots about to save my skin: The disposed, the French (good supercharger to come), the Eagles, the commonwealth, the crazy. The odds were never good, but at least the crate flew straight.

I too would like to have a "real" stick, but my one also has a dam big spring in it centering it all the time. It could be that the doc stops me flying with shot up wrists.

MfG zu meine Gegner. Aber was soll dass? Können wir nicht zugeben, dass wir ein Problem haben? Ja hat es ein bischen gedauert aber wir machen das jetzt. Ihre wolle es nicht zu leicht haben oder?

[Tonester]

In a spit i can trim out in a climb and just about walk away t make a coffee!...in a hurricane, constant attention...just my 2c worth!

[ATAG_Dave]

For my part - that's why I don't enjoy CLoD at all. There are options to switch off just about any other realism feature, including torque effects, but this one - that clearly annoys a lot of potential users - is apparently a 'realism' feature that is too important to sacrifice for the sake of playability.

I have no right to demand a fix, of course. If this is how you feel it should be - that's fine. To me, this single issue is the deal breaker.

If you have the very affordable and very good Thrustmaster T16000M joystick (or a warthog for that matter but that would be a bit pointless if not playing at full real settings) you can very easily have aileron trim in any plane you like in CLOD using the (free) Thrustmaster TARGET software

[ATAG_Paranoid_Glitch]

Dear Team Fusion

I'm new to IL2 Cliffs of Dover and I'm really excited at the potential of the game. However, I've noticed the Spits and Hurricanes have an awful sharp right bank tendency on starting the game. My joystick is calibrated and I can sort of correct the problem with rudder trim but then I end up flying in a slip (yep, that's how much rudder is needed). PLEASE could you enable aileron trim for these aircraft as that will solve the problem perfectly. I know these planes didn't have aileron trim in real life but I must say this problem is so irritating that I've stopped playing the game. Would this be difficult to enable?

Many thanks
Steve

Hi Steve

I think you may find that after a week or so your hand and mind have adjusted and you automatically fly with a bit of pressure on the stick for aileron adjustment all the time without thinking about it anymore.

That has been my experience.

[Kendy for the State]

I am far from being a great pilot, but I have to say the only time my Spitfire rolls "violently to the right" Is after a 109 has graciously removed my starboard wing with the aid of its canon.

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