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Thread: Working with skins and 3D models

  1. #1
    Supporting Member BOO's Avatar
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    Working with skins and 3D models

    Hello,

    I think i know the answer already but......

    So, at present, im using Keefy's templates tas a guide and the in game GUI to check were the paint falls and how it looks. This has limitations in both what aircraft i can skin and how well i can see the results.


    So, is there a program out there that lets you see the skin as its being worked on or am i missing something within the game itself.

    Kind Regards

    BOO
    My Rig: Samsung 40" TV, 5600X on Air, RTX3080 FE, 32GB Gskill Neo 3600 CL16 RAM, M2 Gen 4 Drives, Corsair RM850X PSU, MFG Crosswinds, TM WH Throttle, Virpil Mongoose T50CM w/100mm extension, TIR5, EDtracker pro.


    " Better a thorn on the outside than a prick on the inside"

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    Team Fusion major_setback's Avatar
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    Re: Working with skins and 3D models

    It is as you say. You need to keep checking your work in-game (working blind).

    You are probably doing this for flyable aircraft:
    Keep the game running, edit the skin a bit, save the skin in the appropriate skin folder, re-run the mission you were playing, and chose that skin for your aircraft.

    For non-flyable aircraft it is a bit more problematic. I change the skin in Full Mission Builder, save it, an then re-run the mission.
    Game crashes are not uncommon.

    Cheers, setback
    http://theairtacticalassaultgroup.com/forum/image.php?type=sigpic&userid=2673&dateline=1390351127

    Principle skinner
    .

  3. #3
    Supporting Member BOO's Avatar
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    Re: Working with skins and 3D models

    Ahhh the joys!!!

    I feel LARRY69's positional mission builders may have much merit - especially since it gives a good idea of the light in game.

    Regards

    BOO
    My Rig: Samsung 40" TV, 5600X on Air, RTX3080 FE, 32GB Gskill Neo 3600 CL16 RAM, M2 Gen 4 Drives, Corsair RM850X PSU, MFG Crosswinds, TM WH Throttle, Virpil Mongoose T50CM w/100mm extension, TIR5, EDtracker pro.


    " Better a thorn on the outside than a prick on the inside"

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    Team Fusion ATAG_yotheguy's Avatar
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    Re: Working with skins and 3D models

    Hey BD,

    You can do it with Blender, but it will take learning Blender, and how Blender translates the uv maps.

    I did a short post on it here

    [Edit] I forgot my point. lol

    major_setback is the man on skinning, and his way is the best way.
    Last edited by ATAG_yotheguy; Jul-15-2016 at 16:22.

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    Team Fusion LARRY69's Avatar
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    Re: Working with skins and 3D models

    I do it in FMB as well. but I never have to leave the "Builder", if you do it by this..



    (Edit) forgot my point. ".. and his way is the best way"

    I`m a big fan of "A man has always the choise!"
    Last edited by LARRY69; Jul-15-2016 at 17:04.
    http://i1364.photobucket.com/albums/r739/larry691/GZ-H%201_zpsdphexiii.jpg

  7. #6
    Team Fusion major_setback's Avatar
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    Re: Working with skins and 3D models

    Quote Originally Posted by ATAG_yotheguy View Post
    Hey BD,

    You can do it with Blender, but it will take learning Blender, and how Blender translates the uv maps.

    I did a short post on it here

    [Edit] I forgot my point. lol

    major_setback is the man on skinning, and his way is the best way.
    Thanks, but I think the best way is probably (your way) to use Blender or some other 3D program and paint on to the model in that program. But then you would need access to the 3D model ... and users don't have access to those. Anyway, the colours would be all wrong and would have to be adjusted to work in the game. The benefit is that you wouldn't have to search for different parts of the aircraft that are spread out all over the skin (I presume). Every part would automatically be painted the right colour (again presuming I understand the process correctly).

    I'm guessing the 3D models will probably never be made publicly available, because they take very much time to make, and could be stolen/used by other games, or by gaming companies. I might be wrong though. It's not my area of expertise.

    B.T.W. Thanks for the vote of confidence regarding my skinning! But as I don't paint directly in blender or any other 3D program, and feel quite lost when it comes to such things, then I think you yourself should be regarded as more of an expert in this field. I will stay with my 'sticky paper and glue' method, as it's what I know, and it works well enough.

    If I felt more adventurous, or had more time, I would definitely try to get familiar with the Blender method.

    Cheers, Setback
    http://theairtacticalassaultgroup.com/forum/image.php?type=sigpic&userid=2673&dateline=1390351127

    Principle skinner
    .

  8. #7
    Team Fusion major_setback's Avatar
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    Re: Working with skins and 3D models

    Quote Originally Posted by LARRY69 View Post
    I do it in FMB as well. but I never have to leave the "Builder", if you do it by this..


    RE the screenshot - What is that in the drop down menu that you are clicking on? 'Play mission'? So you don't save the mission, but just play it?

    I think I used to do it this way, but abandoned doing so for some reason (probably game crashes).
    http://theairtacticalassaultgroup.com/forum/image.php?type=sigpic&userid=2673&dateline=1390351127

    Principle skinner
    .

  9. #8
    Supporting Member BOO's Avatar
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    Re: Working with skins and 3D models

    Thanks for all the suggestions

    I'll probably stick with Setbacks, paper and glue method as finding a certain bit still seems infinitely easier to Blender for a numbskull like me(and as pointed out there is no public access to the skins).

    The way i do it is simply to create a working file, copy into the relevant paint scheme folder and continue to expoert it to that folder from there on in - that way i only have to select another skin and then go back to the one im working on to see the changes. The only issue comes with the limited views and half lighting but i think by setting the AC in the mission builder at a "final fix" stage that can also be go around.

    The only other thing i then have to remeber is to render a colour that looks ok with and without any post shader plug-ins.

    ~Thanks again Chaps

    Regards

    BOO
    My Rig: Samsung 40" TV, 5600X on Air, RTX3080 FE, 32GB Gskill Neo 3600 CL16 RAM, M2 Gen 4 Drives, Corsair RM850X PSU, MFG Crosswinds, TM WH Throttle, Virpil Mongoose T50CM w/100mm extension, TIR5, EDtracker pro.


    " Better a thorn on the outside than a prick on the inside"

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    Team Fusion LARRY69's Avatar
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    Re: Working with skins and 3D models

    Quote Originally Posted by major_setback View Post
    RE the screenshot - What is that in the drop down menu that you are clicking on? 'Play mission'? So you don't save the mission, but just play it?

    I think I used to do it this way, but abandoned doing so for some reason (probably game crashes).
    Hallo Major,

    Yep, exactly! just "play mission". without saving it. That`s I wanted to say with the screenshot. i don`t have crashes because of this. But other PC`s/ systems..???

    cheers

    Larry
    http://i1364.photobucket.com/albums/r739/larry691/GZ-H%201_zpsdphexiii.jpg

  11. #10
    Veteran Combat pilot Uwe's Avatar
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    Re: Working with skins and 3D models

    I actually asked this of M.S. and he directed me to 69th_Spiritus_Mortem (US-S SM) in regard to getting the aircraft "wireframes" as I called them, I was informed that what I wanted was the UV wrapping .psd.

    He told me he is inquiring if they even have access to them. I hope to hear back soon!

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    Team Fusion ATAG_yotheguy's Avatar
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    Re: Working with skins and 3D models

    I can get you any of the uv maps you need.
    Quote Originally Posted by Uwe View Post
    I actually asked this of M.S. and he directed me to 69th_Spiritus_Mortem (US-S SM) in regard to getting the aircraft "wireframes" as I called them, I was informed that what I wanted was the UV wrapping .psd.

    He told me he is inquiring if they even have access to them. I hope to hear back soon!
    [Edit] This might be more of a pain then I thought. I have to pick apart the model in blender to find all the editable parts, and then find where they all go. So I can do it but it will take some work. If you know what model you want that would help. Right now I'm doing the bf-109 E4.

    Texturing SS.jpg
    Last edited by ATAG_yotheguy; Jul-17-2016 at 22:34.

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    Team Fusion ♣_Spiritus_♣'s Avatar
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    Re: Working with skins and 3D models

    Yup, we don't have them and the only way is to pick apart the models which takes an insane amount of time that we don't have. The skin.jpgs do have pretty good lines to follow, there is always an overlap with the paint though regardless.

    Some objects of the UV are indeed easier to ID with the unwrap only but having the paint makes certain things much easier. For instance, it would be hard to ID the Martlet's engine components with just the unwrap unless you were the one who unwrapped it, in this case the jpg would show you that indeed it is the engine... if that makes sense because you could see the paint colors and the cylinders textures, so on.

    In short, TF doesn't have them, we would have to make them as shown by Yo above but it just takes a ton of time.


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    Team Fusion ATAG_yotheguy's Avatar
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    Re: Working with skins and 3D models

    Yeah sorry I thought I could do it faster, but like SM said its going to take to much time and I need to be working on TF stuff right now.

    This is just the wing.

    Texturing SS_02.jpg

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    Veteran Combat pilot Uwe's Avatar
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    Re: Working with skins and 3D models

    Well shoot, thanks regardless for looking guys!

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    Combat pilot KeefyBoy's Avatar
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    Re: Working with skins and 3D models

    Quote Originally Posted by Boosterdog View Post
    Hello,

    I think i know the answer already but......

    So, at present, im using Keefy's templates tas a guide and the in game GUI to check were the paint falls and how it looks. This has limitations in both what aircraft i can skin and how well i can see the results.


    So, is there a program out there that lets you see the skin as its being worked on or am i missing something within the game itself.

    Kind Regards

    BOO
    Hi BOO
    I have found the absolute quickest way to view changes to skin is to go to FMB INSERT plane type for skin then select the skin you are working on in the drop down
    menu now minimise CLoD DO NOT EXIT FMB go into Gimp\Photoshop make your changes save the skin then back to FMB and in the drop down skin menu click on the skin either above or below the one you are working on then
    click back to your skin and the changes are applied. takes seconds.
    Let me know how you get on Buddy.
    Good Luck
    Regards
    Keith
    Last edited by KeefyBoy; Jul-20-2016 at 05:01.

  20. #16
    Supporting Member BOO's Avatar
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    Re: Working with skins and 3D models

    Hi Keith

    Ive been doing similar with but using the plane selection gui in game. The FMB route is definitely the way forward i think!

    And thanks for sharing the templates BTW, Id be lost without them!!!

    Kind Regards

    BOO
    My Rig: Samsung 40" TV, 5600X on Air, RTX3080 FE, 32GB Gskill Neo 3600 CL16 RAM, M2 Gen 4 Drives, Corsair RM850X PSU, MFG Crosswinds, TM WH Throttle, Virpil Mongoose T50CM w/100mm extension, TIR5, EDtracker pro.


    " Better a thorn on the outside than a prick on the inside"

  21. #17
    Combat pilot KeefyBoy's Avatar
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    Re: Working with skins and 3D models

    Your welcome Buddy
    Let me know how you get on or if you have any problems
    Regards
    Keith

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  23. #18
    ATAG_Colander's Avatar
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    Re: Working with skins and 3D models

    Here you go (109, spit and hurri).
    Don't ask me to ID each part please

    UVMaps.zip

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  25. #19
    Supporting Member BOO's Avatar
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    Re: Working with skins and 3D models

    i think i recognised a wheel somewhere...........and a pit wheel.............oooo..........and an elephant
    My Rig: Samsung 40" TV, 5600X on Air, RTX3080 FE, 32GB Gskill Neo 3600 CL16 RAM, M2 Gen 4 Drives, Corsair RM850X PSU, MFG Crosswinds, TM WH Throttle, Virpil Mongoose T50CM w/100mm extension, TIR5, EDtracker pro.


    " Better a thorn on the outside than a prick on the inside"

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    Veteran Combat pilot Uwe's Avatar
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    Re: Working with skins and 3D models

    Colander THANK YOU!!!
    I'm most o the way toward making a mask layer to clean up the Hurri templates out there.
    I added up all the 2048 UV layers and they mapped it all out PERFECTLY!!!
    again, thank you SO MUCH!!!

  27. #21
    Veteran Combat pilot Uwe's Avatar
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    Re: Working with skins and 3D models

    Ok Here's what I made up for the hurri based on this:
    A mask layer that makes the skin look very clean, and fills in any unpainted layers with the proper RAF blueish-green color for unpainted metal parts and the UV wireframe that shows where every part goes:

    http://www.mediafire.com/download/4r...k-wireframe.7z

    Hope its useful!
    Attached Images Attached Images

  28. #22
    ATAG_Colander's Avatar
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    Re: Working with skins and 3D models

    Glad it helped.

  29. #23
    Veteran Combat pilot Uwe's Avatar
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    Re: Working with skins and 3D models

    Immensly!

  30. #24
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    Re: Working with skins and 3D models

    3 more:
    Beau, JU87 and JU88
    Beaufighter.zip
    JU87.zip
    JU88.zip

  31. #25
    Veteran Combat pilot Uwe's Avatar
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    Re: Working with skins and 3D models

    Heres the same treatment for the spitfire: A masking layer to clean up the template, a map of all the objects on the template, and a combination of both.
    http://www.mediafire.com/download/v5...Mask+Layer.psd
    http://www.mediafire.com/download/42...itfire+UVW.psd
    http://www.mediafire.com/download/l0...re+Outline.psd

    All in .psd format since PS users cant seem to open XCF files.

    Thanks a bunch colander, Ill get right on them this weekend!

  32. #26
    Veteran Combat pilot Uwe's Avatar
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    Re: Working with skins and 3D models

    BF-109E: A Mask layer for the skin template, a complete UVW map, and combined.
    http://www.mediafire.com/download/11...-109E+Mask.psd
    http://www.mediafire.com/download/73...F-109E+UVW.psd
    http://www.mediafire.com/download/dt...UVW%2BMask.psd

    Ill get on the 87, 88 and Beau this weekend
    Last edited by Uwe; Jul-29-2016 at 22:24.

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