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Thread: G.50 gunsight.

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    Ace 1lokos's Avatar
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    G.50 gunsight.

    Collimatore A Riflessione "San Giorgio, Tipo B"



    More as curiosity, as G.50 is "dead chicken".

    From some G.50 AAR posted there:

    "At 100 meters I am really close and he's perfectly in my gunsight.
    His wing-tips (Hurricane = 12.19m wingspan) are exactly on the outer dots on the 3-dotted gunsight.
    So, 100 meters, 10 meters wingspan more or less, gunsight calibrated."


    The San Giorgio dot distances:

    The center dot to adjacent dot distance is 28 mills*. External dots is 56 mills.

    * Accordto gunsight manual this distance represent the typical length of a 30's era fighter (~7 meters) at 250 meters.

    7/0,028 = 250 meters.



    Putting a Hurricane there, between the outer dot's (56 mills):

    Distance = Wingspan/(Mills/1000)
    12.19/(56/1000)
    12.19/0.056 (r - r')
    ~217 meters. <<<< Far away from the 100 meters estimated by our bravery G.50 virtual pilot. "Sum't Wong!"

    In this picture an Bf 109 (9,9m wingspan) see though CloD G.50 gunsight at distance between 170-180 meters (indicated in the label).

    upload

    The image pixels indicate that at this distance (170~180m) the Bf 109 fit in G.50 gunsight inner circle (120 mills, the outside circle is 236 mills) and not between external dot's (56 mills).

    To fit between external dot's the Bf 109 must be at almost twice the distance.

    In fact the Bf 109 filling the 120 mills circles should be much more close:

    9,9/0.120 = ~83 meters. What is wrong?

    Seems the G.50 gunsight projected circles and dot distance is 2x smaller(?) than should be...

    When making G.50 gunsight circle/dot distance, the (game) programmers confused radius with diameter... or is the "eye of the beholder"?

    Similar doubt happens in old IL-2, is conclude that a Bf 109 fitted between - better over* the external dots of Italian S.Giorgio gunsight should be at 150 meters. * If are between dots will be slight more far, or close the expected ~177 meters.

    https://s15.postimg.cc/nhna0nv7v/SC2error.jpg

    To clarify, in this IL-2:'46 version the S.Giogio Gunsight projected circles use almost all glass surface, what indicates too that in CloD they are 2x smaller...

    Finally understand why this small gunsight painted in glass - Think this was another CloD bug, like in early versions Spit gunsight, when the projected image remain with gunsigth lamp turned off. Or another "It's CloD!".

    This painted circle is the backup sight, for the case of fault gunsigth lamp.

    Lowering the arc around gunsight, with center dot on mast - see on top o glass, or the A part in drawing bellow, the pilot have a fixed sight (R) focused in same 250 meters.



    Or "Linea di mira naturale"in this drawing(C):



    BTW - Similar doubt in IL-2:BoS, with MC.202 gunsight (same "Tipo B" of G.50), a 10 meters wingspan fighter (Yak/Lagg) between inner circle (120 mills) is not at 83 meters of distance (if the above is correctly).
    Last edited by 1lokos; Jan-23-2020 at 09:39. Reason: Replaced Photobucket links

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  3. #2
    ATAG_Colander's Avatar
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    Re: G.50 gunsight.

    That explains why I can't hit the side of a barn with a G50!

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    Team Fusion Artist's Avatar
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    Re: G.50 gunsight.

    Hi 1lokos,

    may I ask you to please add this to the bugtracker?

    Cheers,
    Artist

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    Re: G.50 gunsight.

    Artist,

    I'm not sure what is wrong - if it is..

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    ATAG Member ATAG_Ribbs's Avatar
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    Re: G.50 gunsight.

    I love flying the G50.. but I can't use the reticle. I feel I have a hard time seeing past it. So I leave it off. I know it doesn't add to this conversation ..But just thought I would throw it in.

    Cheers
    Ribbs
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    By ATAG_Lewis

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    Re: G.50 gunsight.

    Quote Originally Posted by 1lokos View Post
    BTW - Similar doubt in IL-2:BoS, with MC.202 gunsight (same "Tipo B" of G.50), a 10 meters wingspan fighter (Yak/Lagg) between inner circle (120 mills) is not at 83 meters of distance.
    In BoS the Mc 202 Gunsight - same 'S. Giorgio Type "B"' was fixed:



    Notice how the circles now is twice the size of CloD G-50.

    Last edited by 1lokos; Mar-09-2018 at 00:59.

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  10. #7
    TF Leadership RAF74_Buzzsaw's Avatar
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    Re: G.50 gunsight.

    We'll definitely fix this for TF 5.0.

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    Re: G.50 gunsight.

    Quote Originally Posted by 1lokos View Post
    In BoS the Mc 202 Gunsight - same 'S. Giorgio Type "B"' (better "A")* was fixed:

    * An detail: the above measures of circles for Type "B" is wrong, because are more than one revision of S. Giorgio gunsight.

    Type "A" - calibrated for a target flying at ~360 KM/H (100 m/s), the outer circle is 118 (radius) mills - showed in the above picture in BoS MC 202 Series 8.

    Type "B" - calibrated for a target flying at ~400 KIM/H (111 m/s), the outer circle is: 129 (radius) mills.
    What seems correct for G.50 and Mc 202 Series 8.

    https://forum.il2sturmovik.com/uploa...ed15264723.jpg
    https://forum.il2sturmovik.com/uploa...9147c0c3a7.jpg

    "Aeroplane Fiat G.50 (Motore F.I.A.T. A. 74 R. C. 38)" (C.A. 381) maintenance manual don't mention type of S.Giorgio gunsight used in this plane, say only "collimatore S.Giorgio".

    Type "B" - introduced in 1939, was used in Mc 202 series 9 to 11 and probable in 8 (BoS model, what indicates that their circles radius still wrong).

    Here say: "... the Tipo A (type A) entered service in 1937 but apparently only saw limited use, mostly in some early Fiat G.50 and Macchi Mc.200. "

    http://www.aircraft-gunsights.com/italy/

    Type "A" has different shape of gunsight modeled in CloD G.50 or BoS Mc 202, has not the backup paint in lower part.

    http://www.aircraft-gunsights.com/wp...po-a-web-d.jpg
    Last edited by 1lokos; Mar-09-2018 at 13:02.

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    Supporting Member Karaya's Avatar
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    Re: G.50 gunsight.


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