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Thread: Question for the English and Europeans here

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    Question for the English and Europeans here

    Just read an article about an unexploded WW2 bomb buried at a building site in England. Do the governments over there regulate building sites and builders and force them to check for this sort of thing somehow before building/digging? If so what do they do/use.

    Just curious. Some sites in the US are checked for archeological and historical. stuff but only if it is a known area to have uncovered things before. I figure you guys do.... wouldn't want the excavator to hit unexploded ordnance. Bombs aren't an issue here so I got curious after reading about it.

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    Re: Question for the English and Europeans here

    Don't know about them, but down here is done like this:

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    Re: Question for the English and Europeans here

    Quote Originally Posted by 69th_Spiritus_Mortem View Post
    Just read an article about an unexploded WW2 bomb buried at a building site in England. Do the governments over there regulate building sites and builders and force them to check for this sort of thing somehow before building/digging? If so what do they do/use.

    Just curious. Some sites in the US are checked for archeological and historical. stuff but only if it is a known area to have uncovered things before. I figure you guys do.... wouldn't want the excavator to hit unexploded ordnance. Bombs aren't an issue here so I got curious after reading about it.
    I believe they very occasionally encounter bombs and shells at Civil War locations in the States.... mostly in Virginia around Petersburg where the big seige was and/or on the East coast where the Confederate forts were under attack by US warships with big guns.

    In Europe it is a fairly regular occurrence both in England (London/Coventry/etc.) and in many German cities which were targets of the Allied bombing campaign.

    They also dig up shells regularly in Flanders along the lines of the Trenches in WWI.

    It's amazing how much money was spent on ordnance and how many were fired off/dropped during both wars.

    Human beings have a willingness, (encouraged by Politicians) to spend endless amounts of money on killing each other or threatening to kill each other... the money spend on wars in Vietnam/Iraq could have solved most of the education/healthcare/poverty issues in the US several times over. Could have balanced the budget while building new infrastructure which would make the US rustbelt look like downtown Shanghai. Same goes for the money spent by the Russians on their war in Afghanistan and their armament programs during the Cold War... Communism with all its huge flaws could have been a success with all the money the Politburo would have had available. The Human race could have colonies on the Moon and Mars easily with the money spent by the US/Russia/China on Ballistic missiles.

    Rant over...

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    Re: Question for the English and Europeans here

    Finding unexploded bombs is very common in major German cities still today.
    Page one of this site
    http://www.express.de/thema/koeln/bombenfunde-in-koeln
    lists newspaper reports from 25 bomb finds in Cologne from 2014 until today.
    Usually they are found during excavation work and professionals are called in to neutralise them. Just some weeks ago several thousand people had to be evacuated for some time, can't remember where.

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    Re: Question for the English and Europeans here

    Quote Originally Posted by 69th_Spiritus_Mortem View Post
    Just read an article about an unexploded WW2 bomb buried at a building site in England. Do the governments over there regulate building sites and builders and force them to check for this sort of thing somehow before building/digging? If so what do they do/use.

    Just curious. Some sites in the US are checked for archeological and historical. stuff but only if it is a known area to have uncovered things before. I figure you guys do.... wouldn't want the excavator to hit unexploded ordnance. Bombs aren't an issue here so I got curious after reading about it.
    Construction in London pretty much always requires a UXO survey, also at strategic points along the southeast coast

    In Germany its pretty much routine in any city since they basically got carpet bombed

    I posted some stuff on this a while back. Search UXO. And ask away !

    EDIT

    the stuff on Canadian pipe mines alone is incredible...

    they put them under runways... gelignite... but gelignite breaks down if it gets wet... into... harmless stuff and ... Nitro-glycerine...

    so you have nitro-glycerine and gelignite in a pipe... under a runway... bad combination.

    The Canadian air force was supposed to remove them al (from multiple airfields) before they left...

    the achieved about 70% decommissioning apparently before they left

    Shoreham had those still in place until 1981 !! and the MOD knew they were there... under a waterlogged GRASS runway !!! I may have mentioned the nitro-glycerine... YIKES !!

    Land softly chaps !


    Fascinating aspect of my work.
    Last edited by ATAG_Highseas; Mar-16-2017 at 16:44.

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    Re: Question for the English and Europeans here

    Thanks for the replys, very interesting.


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    Re: Question for the English and Europeans here

    Someone told me that if they ever find human remains on a build they sometimes don't even report them as they know it brings the building work to an absolute halt and no one can go to work again for a while...There's pressure to meet dead lines so they try not to bring attention to something that they know will down tools...

    I never did find out if that was true or not...Snopes cant tell you everything!
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    Re: Question for the English and Europeans here

    One of the first jobs I was involved in.



    Got a call

    "erm... we found an arm. looks human. Police are here. we had to stop works"


    an hour later

    "erm... they have two arms and a leg. The site is vacated and now a crime sceme"


    next day

    "three arms and two legs. No torsos yet"


    this carried on until there were a pile of arms and legs and no heads etc...

    Deacon of the diesis was brought in to de.. I dunno... de spookiefy it ?!


    Day after that it was revealed by the local district council historian that it was an old "hospital"... surgeon cuts off limb... bury in grounds... hence no heads or torsos...

    fascinating !

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    Re: Question for the English and Europeans here

    Quote Originally Posted by ATAG_Highseas View Post
    Day after that it was revealed by the local district council historian that it was an old "hospital"... surgeon cuts off limb... bury in grounds... hence no heads or torsos...
    So they say.....Hmmmm
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    Re: Question for the English and Europeans here

    I did a deployment to Faslane many years ago for an exercise involving a bunch of euro navies, other nations and us Aussies. Anyway on day 1 when all the planning was being done and many of the ships were alongside someone discovered an unexploded Luftwaffe bomb right in the water under the main dock-thing. So we all got the day off while they dealt with it. I think they figured out it was left over from one of the raids on Glasgow/docks area.

    Ezzie

    Well what do you know - i found a news item about it....

    And it wasnt a German bomb after all - that spoils my story a bit. Carry on.....

    http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/scotland/2119307.stm
    Last edited by ATAG_Ezzie; Mar-17-2017 at 02:37.

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    Re: Question for the English and Europeans here

    It's not only the big ones. Many people in developing areas would be surprised to know what was under their feet. 2 and 3" mortars from old infantry training ranges, 12 and 25pnd aerial bombs, Chem warfare shells... They turn up everywhere.

    Still, you could live in the pacific. Beautiful to look at but caches upon caches of grenades, mortars, aerial and artillery shells are under your feet. Mostly American and Japanese of course. Both countries have contracted cleaning programs but it will be a couple of hundred years or more before many of those islands if ever, are cleaned. Add to that the cluster munitions from the Vietnam era from "training" countries and those adjacent. There's another 1000 years of cleanup.

    Even in Australia,. It wasn't that long ago that 100tonnes of mustard gas was found under the ground in Queensland. We were forever collecting the stuff. All up and down the east coast of the country. The most populated part, there are uncovered munitions point, some identified, some not, all waiting to be discovered one day.
    https://imgur.com/VCUiXpY

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    Re: Question for the English and Europeans here

    Feeling fairly safe in NZ now...


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    Re: Question for the English and Europeans here

    Quote Originally Posted by III./ZG76_Ezzie View Post
    I did a deployment to Faslane many years ago for an exercise involving a bunch of euro navies, other nations and us Aussies. Anyway on day 1 when all the planning was being done and many of the ships were alongside someone discovered an unexploded Luftwaffe bomb right in the water under the main dock-thing. So we all got the day off while they dealt with it. I think they figured out it was left over from one of the raids on Glasgow/docks area.

    Ezzie

    Well what do you know - i found a news item about it....

    And it wasnt a German bomb after all - that spoils my story a bit. Carry on.....

    http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/scotland/2119307.stm
    "Commander Bertie Armstrong, of the royal navy"

    Hahahaah !!

    What an great name !

    Bertie Wooster.. erm... I mean Armstrong...

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    Re: Question for the English and Europeans here

    Lecter the historian?...

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    Re: Question for the English and Europeans here

    Thanks for the question.

    I live in The Netherlands, which was bombed by Germany, UK and USA.

    This link leads to a slow-loading map with information about unexploded aircraft bombs which have been made safe in recent years in this country. Zoom in to see more dots. Left-click on a dot to see a popup with the date of the bomb's removal.

    http://www.arcgis.com/home/webmap/vi...er/0&source=sd

    They blew one up near my house on September 11th 2006. I was sitting at home watching a TV documentary about '9/11-was-five-years-ago-today', when the bomb went off unexpectedly about 500 meters away.

    Only unexpectedly for me of course!

    Ruimrapport: 2006-09-11
    Id 39,029
    WO_NR_REPA 20,061,375
    DATAANVG 2006-09-11
    OMSCH_WO
    CAT_WO A
    NMUITVRD EOD/KL
    Kolom2
    OMSLIGPE_1 Loyd Kwartier.
    extra_colu
    PLNMLPEX Rotterdam
    GEMNAAM Rotterdam
    PROVINCIE Zuid-Holland

    I'd felt quite indignant at the time that 'the powers that be' would explode a bomb next to me on the anniversary 9/11, and mentioned this event to a few people in my network who had not been aware that any bomb had been removed. Some of them had doubts that such an explosion in the city had occurred and dismissed my report as me lying for effect on 9/11 because I wouldn't shut up about Building 7. But because you ask this question I went and searched out this map with bombs, and i found exactly the explosion my 'friends' said i imagined because truther.

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    Re: Question for the English and Europeans here

    Interesting stories! The clean up of all those tiny islands spread across the Pacific will take forever.

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    Re: Question for the English and Europeans here

    War, huh, yeah
    What is it good for
    Absolutely nothing
    Say it again....

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    Re: Question for the English and Europeans here

    Reading this thread made me think that you guys might be interested in this story.

    There is currently a major new bypass being constructed to the north of my home city of Norwich in the UK.

    The route of this new road passes close to two former airbases used by the US 8th air force during the war, Rackheath, and Horsham st Faith, both of these stations were home to B24 Liberator bombers.

    Last year, remains of a P51 Mustang fighter, which crashed whilst performing a low level barrel roll in April 1945, and a ww1 vintage mustard gas mine, planted during ww2, probably as an "area denial" device to thwart an invasion, were found during the construction of this bypass.

    Here is a link that I have found giving more details about these finds

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...9m-bypass.html

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    Supporting Member Pans's Avatar
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    Re: Question for the English and Europeans here

    Quote Originally Posted by ATAG_Highseas View Post
    War, huh, yeah
    What is it good for
    Absolutely nothing
    Say it again....
    The Temptations clearly never got to play Cliffs of Dover!

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    Re: Question for the English and Europeans here

    I know, old thread, but I just read that on May 7th 53,200 people in Hannover will have to be evacuated.
    In a planned building area the Explosive Ordnance Disposal specialists expect at least 14 unexploded bombs.

    Newspaper article in German:

    http://www.spiegel.de/panorama/gesel...a-1142185.html

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    Re: Question for the English and Europeans here

    Wow.

    Scary stuff. I'm just about to take receipt of a UXO survey on Shoreham Airfield proper.

    Goes with the one for the area just to the west. Very interested to see if there is much difference.

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    Re: Question for the English and Europeans here

    Quote Originally Posted by Panser View Post
    The Temptations clearly never got to play Cliffs of Dover!
    Can you imagine that? coloured suits and afros lined up with their monitors? wowee - 70s versions of the redtails. incidentally, I saw Edwin star perform it the week before he pegged out. I bet he thought i'm glad marshy saw this...

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    Re: Question for the English and Europeans here

    Lincoln was bombed once during the 2nd world war but as far as I know no unexploded bombs have ever been found however, the city does have quite a bit of archaeology interests and hopefully some-one may correct me if I am wrong but, if say a housing estate is being built and they discover anything of archaeology interest then all building work has to stop and also they have to pay for the time the archaeologists are there so it can be very costly to the company.

    Regards
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    Re: Question for the English and Europeans here

    Had a few where works were stopped. Only for a few weeks at most. It's uncommon....and you don't have archeologgists on every site. It's not that common. (Depending on location)

    Had a few subject to watching briefs too.

    I'm all for it.

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    Re: Question for the English and Europeans here

    Today, in the German town of Darmstadt, a little girl brought some strange thing to her daycare.
    It turned out to be a stick-type incendiary bomb she found in the woods.

    http://www.spiegel.de/lebenundlernen...a-1156084.html

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    Re: Question for the English and Europeans here

    Never was particularly interested in this sort of thing but unexploded ordnance is very often found in the european part of Russia, as you can imagine.
    The very first google request unearthed this story - https://www.warhistoryonline.com/war...ld-cup-stadium

    Granted that's Volgograd as in former Stalingrad as in the site of one of the greatest, and quite possibly the greatest battle in history, but still.
    11 bombs, one stadium.
    Last edited by 9./JG52 Kettarian_Fox; Jul-05-2017 at 13:42. Reason: Fixed the link

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    Re: Question for the English and Europeans here

    In Norway they just stop digging and the military comes along and picks up the bomb and blows it up somewhere safe.
    In my hometown they demolished a building built sometime after the war and found a bomb during clean up after the demolition.
    Good thing that didnt blow up when there was people living there! I think it was a 50kg bomb dropped from a ju88/87 during april 1940.

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    Re: Question for the English and Europeans here

    This was a recent one in Birmingham, UK

    http://www.birminghammail.co.uk/news...-bomb-13038731

    And this is the explosion after bomb disposal experts decided it was too unsafe to move so covered it in (lots) of sand and detonated it:

    http://www.birminghammail.co.uk/news...olice-13045375

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    Re: Question for the English and Europeans here

    Today the biggest evacuation since the war is going on in Frankfurt/Main.
    60.000 to 70.000 people had to leave the city because of an unexploded British HC-4000 mine.


    In English:
    https://www.theguardian.com/world/20...war-bomb-found

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    Re: Question for the English and Europeans here

    Quote Originally Posted by DerDa View Post
    Today the biggest evacuation since the war is going on in Frankfurt/Main.
    60.000 to 70.000 people had to leave the city because of an unexploded British HC-4000 mine.


    In English:
    https://www.theguardian.com/world/20...war-bomb-found

    Pretty scary stuff. teh article notes that over 2,000 tonnes of munitions and boms are foudn in Germany every year... and then...


    In July, a kindergarten was evacuated after teachers discovered an unexploded second world war bomb on a shelf among some toys.

    thats terrifying.

    - ASUS ROG MAXIMUS Z790 HERO - i9-13900k - ASUS ROG STRIX RTX 4090 OC - 32GB Corsair Dominator Platinum DDR5 5600MHz -
    - CORSAIR 1200w HX Series PSU - Corsair H100x Hydro Series CPU Cooler -
    - Big Screen Beyond -

    - Virpil T50 Mongoos Flight Stick -
    - TM Warthog Throttle -
    - Slaw Device 109 Cam Rudder Pedals -

    Highseas Peripherals
    - Engine Switch Panel - Munitions Switch Panel - Throttle Quadrant Trim Box - Helicopter Collective - Analogue Brake Lever -


    Operated by a 1972 Standard Issue Talking Monkey

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