This huge collision bug will be adressed in 4.5?

[=AN=Lobo]

The prop blades have no collision mesh and the nose of aircraft is really hard against other aircraft parts.

[ATAG_Colander]

Try using bullets to shoot down planes instead

[BOO]

I NEED that spitfire!!

[=AN=Lobo]

Try using bullets to shoot down planes instead

I do this, but what I don't like is when someone ram with me and one explode and the other goes away intact...

Any work in this area? Really spinning props don't have collision mesh? This bug impact a lot gameplay...

[Maru]

This happened to me many times and one of them yesterday,
where I was with a 109 and we rammed eachother but I exploded and the 109 just kept flying,
then in the chat appeared that I shot myself down, but the guy in the 109 got the kill


Also, when I was practicing for the Gatwick race I found out that without the propellor you can still "roll forward" like if you had them,
sometimes when I rammed smb and I had no propellor at all I could still fly like if nothing happened, this was in the SU-26, I dont know about the other planes.

[DerDa]

Try using bullets to shoot down planes instead

Now this is an interesting concept!
Somebody should have told me ...

[RAF74_Buzzsaw]

The complaint about online collisions and one aircraft going down while the other is unaffected is a function of online lag and nothing to do with CoD.

You are not seeing the same thing as your opponent because his connection to the internet and the game is at a different speed than yours.

There can be as much as 1/2 a second in extreme cases between what your game sees and what the other player sees. More typically the lag is around .15 of a second.

So what you see as a collision may not be seen as a collision by the other player's machine.

It doesn't matter to the other player's machine if your machine sees a collision, it only acts on what it is drawing.

There is lag in every single online massive multiplayer game in existence... but it particularly affects Flight Sims because aircraft are moving at such high speeds. An aircraft can cover a lot of airspace in .15 of a second when it is travelling at 400mph/600kmh.

[=AN=Lobo]

The complaint about online collisions and one aircraft going down while the other is unaffected is a function of online lag and nothing to do with CoD.

You are not seeing the same thing as your opponent because his connection to the internet and the game is at a different speed than yours.

There can be as much as 1/2 a second in extreme cases between what your game sees and what the other player sees. More typically the lag is around .15 of a second.

So what you see as a collision may not be seen as a collision by the other player's machine.

It doesn't matter to the other player's machine if your machine sees a collision, it only acts on what it is drawing.

There is lag in every single online massive multiplayer game in existence... but it particularly affects Flight Sims because aircraft are moving at such high speeds. An aircraft can cover a lot of airspace in .15 of a second when it is travelling at 400mph/600kmh.

No, isn't related with online gameplay. It's a myth.

I recorded this video offline, SP.

Prop blades don't have collision mesh, at least regards other aircraft. We have some problems with collision detection even offline.

And if the collisions are detected by the server, (I believe works this way) so, If you hit HtH with another aircraft and one explodes, it' server sided detection. Yesterday I hit one squad mate and my Spitfire shakes like in an earthquake, front collision, and both keep flying like nothing happens...

This issue need to be adressed.

[Akula93]

The complaint about online collisions and one aircraft going down while the other is unaffected is a function of online lag and nothing to do with CoD.

You are not seeing the same thing as your opponent because his connection to the internet and the game is at a different speed than yours.

There can be as much as 1/2 a second in extreme cases between what your game sees and what the other player sees. More typically the lag is around .15 of a second.

So what you see as a collision may not be seen as a collision by the other player's machine.

It doesn't matter to the other player's machine if your machine sees a collision, it only acts on what it is drawing.

There is lag in every single online massive multiplayer game in existence... but it particularly affects Flight Sims because aircraft are moving at such high speeds. An aircraft can cover a lot of airspace in .15 of a second when it is travelling at 400mph/600kmh.

But same things are happening offline with AI many times!
I just took Hurricane in FMB and placed 109 AI infront of me low, and i just dived and ramed it directly from its 6. First time 109 exploded totaly, and i flew away without engine, second time my Huricane exploded and AI 109 flew away with no damage, this is easy to test dont know why its belived its only online problem, this is not online problem only its game problem. That video on first post dosent look like its recorded online to me.

[=AN=Lobo]

But same things are happening offline with AI many times!
I just took Hurricane in FMB and placed 109 AI infront of me low, and i just dived and ramed it directly from its 6. First time 109 exploded totaly, and i flew away without engine, second time my Huricane exploded and AI 109 flew away with no damage, this is easy to test dont know why its belived its only online problem, this is not online problem only its game problem. That video on first post dosent look like its recorded online to me.

Yes, I recorded offline. And when I hit multiple times the tail of the Do with my prop, the relative velocity was near zero.

I don't know if collision detection in Cliffs MP is client/server/hybrid, but works like charm even with full speed frontal collisions, the detection is made in all aircraft involved, but the damage is bugged.

And it's a HUGE bug.

[1lokos]

Several wishes and complains in UbiZ00 hay days contributed to CloD disaster.

Example, the dumb down CloD track record to try avoid use as exploit in MP COOP wars.

Or the lack of IL-2:46 style COOP in CloD because some want "take any aircraft at any time".

Or CloD "imortal" parachutist - some want this for BoS, for preserve their online score.

I believe that collision is due MP complains against "Taran" in IL2:46, the same people complain again in BoS.

Probable this collision "disaster" is due they try coding penalizing only the plane that cause the collision (major speed maybe?) and as "CloD is CLoD" result that mess.

[RAF74_Buzzsaw]

We will look at this to see if it is an issue... but not for 4.5.

[=AN=Lobo]

Several wishes and complains in UbiZ00 hay days contributed to CloD disaster.

Example, the dumb down CloD track record to try avoid use as exploit in MP COOP wars.

Or the lack of IL-2:46 style COOP in CloD because some want "take any aircraft at any time".

I believe that is collision is due MP complains against "Taram" in 46, the same people complain again in BoS.

Or CloD "imortal" parachutist - some want this for BoS, for preserve their online score.

Probable this collision "disaster" is due they try code penalizing only the plane that cause the collision (major speed maybe?) and as "CloD is CLoD" result that mess.

No, it's a bug. And a bug that makes really easy "Taran style"... Prop blades are invisible to collision detection.

And if you hit hard with your nose, the enemy explodes and you keep flying like nothing happens...

And yes, it's a MASSIVE issue. No doubt about It. Just do the testings to see. Maybe a future hotfix, because this kind of bug cripple the great feature of tree collisions.

I need to test if prop blades hit static objects. Imagine you flying through a forest with intact propeller?

I believe that now TF is aware of the issue, the team that made possible tree collision will solve easily this "invisible prop missile fighter" question.

[=AN=Lobo]

More videos and info...

This happens online yesterday, please go to 6:20 to see the collision, my plane yaws hard to right due impact, and nothing more happens to ours planes:



The online collision in track playback:



More "taran" offline:



For sure collisions don't work well in Cliffs of Dover and need some work.

[Akula93]

Thanks for posting more videos showing this bug Lobo, and good news to see TF will investigate this bug in more detailed way.

[Woop]

I thought this issue was common knowledge...

[=AN=Lobo]

I thought this issue was common knowledge...

A lot of people believe this is a "feature" or If play a lot online, credit strange thing to connection issues. I never paid much attention to It myself, but after lot of strange things and this collision when my plane clearly detect a frontal collision, yaws like Crazy, and I flew intact...

I think this will be solved fast with SC access. The software can detect bullets hit in HtH. So, this is just another of many bugs of Cliffs.

In the future we will see bullets hit in propellers blades

[Woop]

A lot of people believe this is a "feature" or If play a lot online, credit strange thing to connection issues. I never paid much attention to It myself, but after lot of strange things and this collision when my plane clearly detect a frontal collision, yaws like Crazy, and I flew intact...

I think this will be solved fast with SC access. The software can detect bullets hit in HtH. So, this is just another of many bugs of Cliffs.

In the future we will see bullets hit in propellers blades

I would be content with the noses falling off like that 109 in the video for all planes tbh.

The silly exploding with little or no damage done to the other plane is just rediculous. I understand the network issues, desync and lag involved in online play, and how these affect the collisions. I also understand the limitations of the damage model when it comes to deforming etc. the fuselage. However that being said, I'm frankly a bit dissappointed that TF haven't looked into this already, as it's one of the oldest 'oddities' of flying in CloD and arguably one of the most annoying.

[=AN=Lobo]

I would be content with the noses falling off like that 109 in the video for all planes tbh.

The silly exploding with little or no damage done to the other plane is just rediculous. I understand the network issues, desync and lag involved in online play, and how these affect the collisions. I also understand the limitations of the damage model when it comes to deforming etc. the fuselage. However that being said, I'm frankly a bit dissappointed that TF haven't looked into this already, as it's one of the oldest 'oddities' of flying in CloD and arguably one of the most annoying.

In a collision with high relative velocity, if the 109 hits with nose perpendicularly to the "exploding box" of target, it can be a cool indestructive missile too!

[=AN=Lobo]

One more video...



The propellers blades interact with ground, as all can see, but don't with other objects.

I believe it's one of the biggest bugs possible in a prop planes sim.

Other issues, like the online collision I posted, or even offline, with one plane striking another and one exploding and no damage computed to the other, or both flying intact, the fact that 109's noses are held with Silver Tape and Spits noses with heavy helding... all need to be investigated. And it's not simple a netcode issue, I guess... All IL2 series had great netcode. Collisions works nice in IL2 1946.

But please, put some priority in this, don't wait for 5.0 release, it's really a major bug.

Thanks! Enough testing for me! Will fly a little!

[RAF74_Buzzsaw]

I'm going to comment one more time and close the thread.

One of the members of the FM team did some testing and it is clear the prop does have the potential to do damage without sustaining any.

However:

#1. It is VERY difficult to inflict damage this way without also incurring damage from contact with the nose of the aircraft or the wings. You need to have a docile target sitting there waiting for you to creep up behind. Which doesn't happen. In almost all situations the colliding aircraft is going to be moving faster than the the target and will contact with its other parts and thus be destroyed. The videos shown here were done very carefully and in slow motion to achieve the results shown but even so I have no doubt there were a lot of other attempts even in slow motion when the 'attacking' plane was also destroyed.

#2. I have talked to experienced pilots about collisions in CoD and whether they perceive them to be a 'huge' issue. Most do not.

#3. Internet Lag is still the major factor in whether or not one pilot escapes without damage when his aircraft hits another.

#4. Collisions did not work perfectly in IL-2 1946, there were many many complaints on the same issue... with that being due to internet lag.

We will look at this when we have the time. It will not be addressed for TF 4.5.

[RAF74_Buzzsaw]

I want to say thankyou to =AN=Lobo for pointing out this bug.

I appreciate he wants this problem fixed right away, but it is unlikely that will happen if it would cause delays in the release of TF 4.5.

We will definitely look at it for TF 5.0.