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Thread: TF 4.5 effects. Need your inputs.

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    Team Fusion Kling's Avatar
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    TF 4.5 effects. Need your inputs.

    There are obviously some new effects in TF4.5 and I think they are pretty nice but we have across the forums picked up a few inputs from various players. Some similar comments are seen across the boards.

    To help us improve the experience for you please list the effects (fire/smoke etc etc) you would like to have improved and please explain why and if possible back it up with pictures...

    We will see what can be done to improve it. No garantees. There are limitations to the game engine as well as FPS. One has to walk a fine line between visuals and FPS.
    Pls list the effect that you find needs to be improved and list them 1 to 5 where nr1 is the most important... Pref like this so it is easy to read..
    Ex:

    1.
    2.
    3.
    4.
    5.

    Thx

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    Re: TF 4.5 effects. Need your inputs.

    Quote Originally Posted by Kling View Post
    There are obviously some new effects in TF4.5 and I think they are pretty nice but we have across the forums picked up a few inputs from various players. Some similar comments are seen across the boards.

    To help us improve the experience for you please list the effects (fire/smoke etc etc) you would like to have improved and please explain why and if possible back it up with pictures...

    We will see what can be done to improve it. No garantees. There are limitations to the game engine as well as FPS. One has to walk a fine line between visuals and FPS.
    Pls list the effect that you find needs to be improved and list them 1 to 5 where nr1 is the most important... Pref like this so it is easy to read..
    Ex:

    1.
    2.
    3.
    4.
    5.

    Thx
    So far I have only one.

    1. MG hit effects. Those are not only much less noticeble then before, which may be true to life, but also may look pretty bad if you are up close and constantly hitting the enemy a/c at near the same spot, which produces a constant stream of small brown puffs of dust(?).
    Will upload a video when I have time.

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    Re: TF 4.5 effects. Need your inputs.

    Quote Originally Posted by 9./JG52 Kettarian_Fox View Post
    So far I have only one.

    1. MG hit effects. Those are not only much less noticeble then before, which may be true to life, but also may look pretty bad if you are up close and constantly hitting the enemy a/c at near the same spot, which produces a constant stream of small brown puffs of dust(?).
    Will upload a video when I have time.
    Hitting a specific aircraft. Or all?

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    Supporting Member 9./JG52 Kettarian_Fox's Avatar
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    Re: TF 4.5 effects. Need your inputs.

    Quote Originally Posted by Kling View Post
    Hitting a specific aircraft. Or all?
    Hurricane, Spitfire, G50. All I've engaged so far. Not noticeable during BnZ, but dead six co-speed sometimes the effects look jarring. Will test more once I get home

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    Re: TF 4.5 effects. Need your inputs.

    Some guys are complaining about the explosions being a little too red/dark.
    Compared to this 100 octane avgas fire I think they're looking pretty good (pilot survived by the way)!

    Last edited by 69th_Zeb; Dec-25-2017 at 10:00.

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    Re: TF 4.5 effects. Need your inputs.

    The "new" effect could be done in that way for try "save" FPS, but fire and smoke don't need any change from what are in 4.312- because there or in early CloD are (IMO) the best seem in any CFS all this years.

    1 - Fire, although the more vivid color is welcomed (could just simple applied in previous effect), the "pixelized" flames looks to much that War Thunder cheese fire:

    https://s10.postimg.cc/v1f1iedex/WT_Cheese_fire.jpg

    These look like flames for a burning paper, not from fuel burning in a ~250KM+ machine. Remind 1930/1940's Hollywood plane burning effects done with maquetes.

    2- Smoke from engine, instead the consistent smoke of 4.312 or early they became a sequence of "puffs'".

    3 - Water leakage, instead that well done "spray" of 4.312 or early now looks a "steam" puffs from low moving vehicle.



    I consider IL-2:Bo'X a surprising good game, but avoid fly in then just because hate their overdone cheese effects - that if reduced in 1/3 or 1/2 will looks better (probable they too try follow War Thunder "school"), was a nasty surprise see CLoD BLITZ "Lean toward War Thunder".


    BLITZ fire explosion colors is OK, but near the explosion don't looks coming from a fuel tank, but from several 'gas ballom" before join in a big explosion, what result inferior to previous explosion.

    Opera Resume: Clod 4.312 or early fires, smoke, leakage, explosions are very good don't requiring change and the effort/work spend on change then - with dubious results - could be used in other more demanding areas.
    Last edited by 1lokos; Nov-08-2018 at 10:24.

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    Re: TF 4.5 effects. Need your inputs.

    Just some of mine..

    1. Scratches in cockpit glass
    2. More realistic looking gun sights (love BOS/BOX ones)
    3. Aircraft on fire effect - tone it down
    4. Cockpit shake while flying - would have to think that those WW2 engines caused massive cockpit vibrations/shaking even while flying in clear skies
    5. NO WIND NOISE IN A CLOSED COCKPIT
    6. A little squiggle in tracers - like old WW2 gun camera footage. May not be accurate but sure looks cool. B-17 The Mighty Eighth did this REALLY good!
    7. Bigger, taller, puffier clouds - more sky variety
    8. More ocean/channel variety - calm seas, stormy seas - color variety
    9. More pronounced cloud shadows
    10. More blinding effect from the sun. Sun glare played a HUGE role in tactics yet it doesn't seem to offer anything in its current format.

    Mind you these are NOT complaints, only a wish list. Love the game and all the work that went into it.

    Oh, one more thing. Not really an 'effect' but a working oxygen system complete with a damage model. THAT would be awesome! You would have to manually remember to turn it on. If it got damaged you would have to drop down in altitude..ah the possibilities!

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    Re: TF 4.5 effects. Need your inputs.

    Actually, for no oxygen above 15k, it would be funny to make the gauges do weird stuff, have the cool black-out screen start showing after ten minutes, and make contacts invisible. No shroom psychadelia though. haha

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    Re: TF 4.5 effects. Need your inputs.

    Quote Originally Posted by 69th_Zeb View Post
    Actually, for no oxygen above 15k, it would be funny to make the gauges do weird stuff, have the cool black-out screen start showing after ten minutes, and make contacts invisible. No shroom psychadelia though. haha
    I like this idea. Forget to switch on oxygen and things suddenly dont make sense... as well as losing the possibility to see contacts... followed by black out until plane dives to a lower altitude... same if oxygen is hit and pressure is lost.

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    Re: TF 4.5 effects. Need your inputs.

    Quote Originally Posted by 69th_Zeb View Post
    No shroom psychadelia though. haha
    Too real for ya huh?

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    Re: TF 4.5 effects. Need your inputs.

    Quote Originally Posted by 9./JG52 Kettarian_Fox View Post
    Hurricane, Spitfire, G50. All I've engaged so far. Not noticeable during BnZ, but dead six co-speed sometimes the effects look jarring. Will test more once I get home
    I partially rescind this - could not repro the uglyness, might be part of a different issue I'm having.
    Partially 'cause I'd like the impacts to be more visible.

    Also a vote for fire and smoke effects for burning aircraft - they are indeed overdone and look somewhat cheesy and warthunderish.
    4.312 looked a lot more natural.
    Sry whoever done the work, I'm sure you had best of intentions

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    Re: TF 4.5 effects. Need your inputs.

    My only problem is with the searchlights cutting out. I created a night mission with an air defence zone about 20x40 km. with searchlights and flak. Then I run a few Blenheim and Wellingtons over the area to attack some tank farms and go in with my Bf100 E-4NJG.

    The only problem is that sometimes the searchlights all cut out like there was a master switch somewhere. When this happens my gunsight also cuts out. I've found that if I glance away (using trackir) and look out of the corner of my eye the lights are still on.

    It's all pretty spectacular and I was able to intercept quite easily when the searchlights found bombers. Using the old program I never made a single air contact in hours of trying.

    I also see terrible frame rates when flying close to the burning tank farms. Less than one fps.

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    Re: TF 4.5 effects. Need your inputs.

    Quote Originally Posted by Oskar View Post
    My only problem is with the searchlights cutting out. I created a night mission with an air defence zone about 20x40 km. with searchlights and flak. Then I run a few Blenheim and Wellingtons over the area to attack some tank farms and go in with my Bf100 E-4NJG.

    The only problem is that sometimes the searchlights all cut out like there was a master switch somewhere. When this happens my gunsight also cuts out. I've found that if I glance away (using trackir) and look out of the corner of my eye the lights are still on.

    It's all pretty spectacular and I was able to intercept quite easily when the searchlights found bombers. Using the old program I never made a single air contact in hours of trying.

    I also see terrible frame rates when flying close to the burning tank farms. Less than one fps.
    What system do you have?

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    Re: TF 4.5 effects. Need your inputs.

    After watching a bunch of RL gun cam footage I really don't think the game effects are far overdone personally. It also feels like planes are a ton less prone to explode while ditching but maybe I'm imagining that.

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    Re: TF 4.5 effects. Need your inputs.

    1. MG17 hit effects. In my opinion, the new hit effects are not so noticeable as desirable for a gameplay. Maybe the effect is more realistic now, but our vision is also limited in this game, we don´t have VR or a similar realistic 3D vision. So I think, we need a compensation and a more rewarding feeling, if we hit a plane.
    2. Bombs detonations. The old effect was more spectacular.

    Overall you did a great job!
    Last edited by JG4_Qetzalcoatl; Dec-25-2017 at 15:56.

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    Re: TF 4.5 effects. Need your inputs.

    Quote Originally Posted by Kling View Post
    I like this idea. Forget to switch on oxygen and things suddenly dont make sense... as well as losing the possibility to see contacts... followed by black out until plane dives to a lower altitude... same if oxygen is hit and pressure is lost.
    My former boss ferried a captured, high altitude Ju-88 during the war for high altitude testing of their oxygen demand systems. His stories were pretty interesting.
    Here's a link if anyone's interested (scroll down half-way for the altitude testing): http://airportjournals.com/forrest-b...-circumstance/

    ~S~

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    Re: TF 4.5 effects. Need your inputs.

    1. Aircraft fire

    This new effect is very overdone. The main problem is the size. The flames flicker around like a massive campfire. The 4.3 effect was much better, the colour of the new one is alright, maybe a bit too red, but the 4.3 might have been a bit too yellow. The 4.3 fire effect was much less "cheesy" and looked more like a big fire from a fast-moving aircraft rather than from a campfire. The new one is too jagged, pixelated, and jumpy. In my opinion Battle of Stalingrad does great fire effects, the actual flame isn't that big, and the smoke looks great. Which brings me to #2...

    2. Smoke trails and vapour trails

    Basically these look nothing like what I've seen in guncams. (I can't post pictures now because I'm on mobile, but Sokol's comparison between the old and new venting effects says it all.) The new one looks far too "puffy". The 4.3 effect was much better, and smoother. On size, I actually think that the venting effects are much too small compared to guncam videos that I've seen. The fuel leaks and oil leaks are especially tiny. Again, I think Battle of Stalingrad has some great vapour trail and smoke effects. (Not saying "just make it like BoX" but they could be used as inspiration).

    3. Clouds

    CloD clouds don't look that bad, but it would sure be nice to have a bit more variety in terms of types of clouds. Instead of just puffy individual cumulus, there could be low overcast cloud banks, bigger clouds, basically more variety. Don't hurt me for saying this, but the last time I played War Thunder I was actually impressed by the quality and variety of clouds they had. I was climbing in a Spitty and passed through a few different layers of clouds, all beautifully lit by the sun.

    4. Tracers

    CloD tracers always looked a little basic to me. This isn't just a 4.5 thing, but has been like this since vanilla CloD. The regular tracers are plain, and straight. In guncams they always seem to wobble a bit, I guess because of the spinning of the bullets. The MG-FF smoke tracers look great, however, and I also have to ask - why don't the .303 tracers leave smoke trails like they did in real life? I've asked this before and never got a response. The standard RAF tracer was a phosphorous tracer that left smoke just like the MG-FF tracers. The effect is already in game, so why isn't it used?

    5. Explosions

    5.1 - Bomb explosions. 4.3 had awesome bomb explosions, they kicked up a ton of dirt as real explosions do. They were quite fantastic. The 4.5 ones are much more firey and less dirty, they look more like a fuel tank explosion than a bomb.

    5.2 - Plane crash explosions. Minor gripe, but I can too easily tell that they're made of 2D sprites and not a real volumetric effect. Also it would be really cool if the explosion moved along with the direction you were going when you crashed, like BoX does.


    TL; DR

    Make the fire smaller and smoother and less red.

    Make the smoke and vapour trails smooth and not puffy, and a little bigger, especially the oil and fuel leaks.

    Add some cool clouds!

    Give me my RAF smoke tracers!

    Bombs should look dirty, not firey, when they explode.

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    Re: TF 4.5 effects. Need your inputs.

    1. Animated oil leaks on windshield.
    2. Chance of blood splatters on windshield when pilot/aircrew are injured.
    3. Bombs detonations. The old effect was better IMHO.
    4. Aircraft fire effect overdone (just my person opinion).
    5. Better clouds.
    6. Tracers spiral effect.
    7. Animated rain.

    On the plus side:
    1. I like the subdued windshield sun-flash effect.
    2. Like the sun glare.

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    say also what are BLITZ - progress / downgrades

    progress
    1. i bow they care, develop
    2. average feeling is realistic much more like BoS
    3. sounds are better
    4. graphic upgrate of whole menu
    5. new planes

    downgrade

    1. its like when you in movie privat ryan, includes an mickeymouse> the new flames of damaged plane. whole game is realistic , and then out of nothing they adopt this kids-hollywood flames from BoS.
    that means: flames are too big and roundet, thats absurd because in such windblow are flames copying the wind... so they should look like some kind of lines, stripes , not roundet.

    2. machine guns are unrealistic effective. (therefore were cannons used, because with guns was immpossible to shot down a plane)

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    Re: TF 4.5 effects. Need your inputs.

    Added the question on the TFS Facebook page:

    https://m.facebook.com/story.php?sto...09271202476395
    "The needs of the Flight Sim Community outweigh the needs of the one or the few"

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    Re: TF 4.5 effects. Need your inputs.

    Thank you for being open and to ask our impression.

    I also agree about the flame looking too fake but it might be a personal taste.

    I would like to ear more rate of fire for the 303's we have 8 gun's that sound like 1

    o7
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    Re: TF 4.5 effects. Need your inputs.

    Quote Originally Posted by ATAG_((dB)) View Post
    Thank you for being open and to ask our impression.

    I also agree about the flame looking too fake but it might be a personal taste.

    I would like to ear more rate of fire for the 303's we have 8 gun's that sound like 1

    o7
    I agree on the Brownings noise.

    Doesnt sound like 8 guns. (As far ad i imagine them... I dont habe a whole lot of 1940's combat experience to compare it with)

    Loving it though all the same. There are so many things to list as positives. Too many to list.

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    Re: TF 4.5 effects. Need your inputs.

    Hi all
    If this thread is for graphics only stuff then i have posted in the wrong place and apologise.
    I am happy with and can live wirh it all as it is. I have no worries over smoke, explosions etc etc. It has come a million miles from what it was.
    The only thing i want to see improved/implemented is the sound bug of flying along with canopy open and hearing planes approaching from dead 6 at distances of up to 500m. This for me is a massive flaw that i am hoping gets fixed. Other than that i love 4.5 as it is now well done TF

    Hals und beinbruch
    Last edited by 9./JG52_Meyer; Dec-26-2017 at 07:06.
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    Re: TF 4.5 effects. Need your inputs.

    Quote Originally Posted by 9./JG52 Meyer View Post
    Hi all
    I am happy with and can live wirh it all as it is. I have no worries over smoke, explosions etc etc. It has come a million miles from what it was.
    The only thing i want to see improved/implemented is the sound bug of flying along with canopy open and hearing planes approaching from dead 6 at distances of up to 500m. This for me is a massive flaw that i am hoping gets fixed. Other than that i love 4.5 as it is now well done TF

    Hals und beinbruch
    It was stated on few occasion that pilots opened their canopy exactly for that Meyer. You will ear another aircraft on your six. We can ear opposite direction aircraft at 1000' above in a cockpit of an airliner with a closed cockpit
    Last edited by ATAG_((dB)); Dec-26-2017 at 07:13.
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    Re: TF 4.5 effects. Need your inputs.

    1. Review the key mapping. Make the names alphabetical and put them in sensible iikeminded sections
    2. Ability to capture film. Never was fond of the track file system. Too fiddle to create a simple film with editing. Help us sell it for you.
    3. Menu overhaul in general from plane selection to weapon load out to accessing arenas
    4. Audio is immersive and highly atmospheric. I would love to see the ability to turn down engine noise (or up). Useful to communicate by voice and hear every weapon hit
    5. Ingame voice, like ARMA. Squaddie channel, Global channel etc.

    Leave everything else as it is and I am a happy man. Good job all.
    https://imgur.com/VCUiXpY

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    Supporting Member 9./JG52_Meyer's Avatar
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    Re: TF 4.5 effects. Need your inputs.

    With all respect my friend i have never read any BOB accounts by RAF pilots stating they flew with canopies open at 5k plus listening for 109 or any other aircraft engines . With that famous V12 Merlin banging away in front and the wind blasting past your face and ears which is covered by a flying helmet i find it hard to get my head around.I have read that the concept of night fighter pilots like cat eyes cunningham could see better because they ate carrots was put out as a joke . But to hear an engine half a km away behind with all that roaring noise from having canopy open blasting past and away is a bit too much.
    Btw have a great new year Db long time no see dude

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    Re: TF 4.5 effects. Need your inputs.

    Quote Originally Posted by 9./JG52 Meyer View Post
    Btw have a great new year Db long time no see dude

    Hals und beinbruch
    You too mon ami all the best

    One book come in mind real quick The Hardest Day. There was another one can't recall now but I'll tell when I do. Thrust me you would ear it, especially if it's from a different frequency then yours. ie different engine type or power settings.
    Last edited by ATAG_((dB)); Dec-26-2017 at 07:34.
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    Supporting Member BOO's Avatar
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    Re: TF 4.5 effects. Need your inputs.

    Fire and flame is marmite for me - sometimes I like sometimes I don't - can stay or go for me. Ive not flown a lot in 4.5 so these are based on the Beta testing (late) and the assumption they aint changed since.

    1) Contrails are annoying. Too often they turn into hard edged 2D versions (even up close) making you feel like your flying through an audio track on a digital mixer's display not condensed air. The effect was much subtler and less prone to this in 4.312. Ok so the trails didnt last as long which brings me to point...

    2) Lingering contrails develop flat spots especially in the vertical. Ruins the whole effect and the point of them lasting longer.

    3) Oil trails turning into 2D which can be seen from the aircraft cockpit.

    4) Diminished view distance and intensity of shadows from the clouds, especially over sea.

    S!

    BOO
    Last edited by BOO; Dec-26-2017 at 10:30. Reason: spullink
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  39. #29
    Supporting Member 9./JG52 Kettarian_Fox's Avatar
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    Re: TF 4.5 effects. Need your inputs.

    +1 vote for cloud shadows.

    And since people already talking about sounds:
    1. 109 MGs - great sound for a single mg fired on the ground, however sounds way too clear for incockpit, and the rate of fire seems a bit too low. Hard to differentiate between 2 and 4 firing in 109E1.
    Don't know if the 4.312 mg sounds were accurate but they sure did not sound like mgs fired on the ground and that's a good thing.
    2. 109 cannon sounds - I like them, but they are way too quiet, need to amp the sound like 1.5 times. They are higher quality than the old ones but lack the oomph due to low volume
    3. 109E4N engine sound - I would love all normal 109s to have that sound, it's more raw and powerful. For the 109E4N I'd make another version with even more metallic/raw overtones. Overall, a step in the right direction, I envied the Merlin sounds in 4.312 which sounded like a 1000hp engine.
    4. Hurricane in cockpit 303 sounds are too quiet. Spitfire seems about right.
    5. Like the new 303s but more of a firerate would be better.
    6. Seems like in 4.5 engine tone and volume depends on RPMs only, in 4.312 boost also subtly changed the way the engines sounded (at least Merlin, the lack of change is noticeable primarily in British a/c), I miss that.

  40. #30
    Supporting Member QB.Creep's Avatar
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    Re: TF 4.5 effects. Need your inputs.

    Quote Originally Posted by 69th_Zeb View Post
    My former boss ferried a captured, high altitude Ju-88 during the war for high altitude testing of their oxygen demand systems. His stories were pretty interesting.
    Here's a link if anyone's interested (scroll down half-way for the altitude testing): http://airportjournals.com/forrest-b...-circumstance/

    ~S~
    What a fascinating read - thank you for sharing! I particularly liked the bit about him purchasing surpluss P-38's for $300 each!!!

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