Rivet layer combined with wear but Major_Setback the links are dead

[BOBC]

Hi Major Setback,

I am plucking out the part about rivet layer from another thread that I am after, but all the links are dead and that which worked hasnt the data unless I am mistaken.

I thought I could lessen the golfball rivets on the Do17Z by offsetting the highlight /shadow with its reciprocal on my skin

I see you suggest such, so I am off to a good start., if I can get at the rivet layers.

Where do I find the official CoD template with the rivet/wear layer you refer to below please.

Major_setback,
Main site page. Tutorials are in the list on the left hand side:

http://www.simmerspaintshop.com/

Templates can be found here: http://www.airwarfare.com/sow/index....-paint-schemes

The rivet layer is hard coded, so you can't change it. It can be modified a bit though. If you look in the link above for the official CoD templates from cliffsofdover.fr you will see that they are a combination of the rivet layer and the wear layer as a combined layer. These were released to aid skinners. You can use it as a layer within your template..They show where the panel lines and rivets are, and you can lighten/daken those areas where the lines/rivets are to change their appearance (to compensate a little for the hard-coded lines/rivets).

Major_Setback… You can also use the 'templates' in this download as a guide for painting camo outlines. They are from 1c and also official CoD templates.

http://www.airwarfare.com/sow/index....templates-pack

These aren't layered templates like some of those found at the Airwarfare site. They are plain jpegs. You can combine them with the ones I mentioned above, as different layers (in Photoshop or Gimp) to give you a good idea of where different parts of the aircraft are located on each skin.

Originally Posted by flare2000x
cliffsofdover.fr is down now I believe, the owner couldn't keep the site up anymore.
Yes, that is correct. That is why I re-uploaded all the skins that were there (in the past), to the Airwarfare site.

Major_Setback....They are available from the link I posted above.

The simmerspaintshop took me to a car sales site then another commercial site, 4 times I tried each time some spam site turned up.
airwarfare link is now dead, airwarfare is at M4T as skins.rar but having downloaded that, I see no files on the rivets. e.g the aircraft I wish to do first Do17Z I open the rar files within the opened Do17Z rar file and there are no layers for rivets fused with wear. Unless I am mistaken.

I would expect the rivet/wear fused together layer to be per aircraft, but is it in those folders one gets in the skins.rar file ? I didnt spot it.

Cheers
BOBC

[BOO]

Hello BOBC

Not sure if these are what you are after but I checked the layered Do17 template and it does have the at least some extracted Rivet and lines on there for you to use as a guide. Some templates have these as separate layers, some don't. This one does.

Regardless, this will only change the paint, the normal mapping which provides the 3D effect is not user accessible.

The link has templates for all the aircraft in the original game and the templates were I believe create by CheckmySix. Given the like for like matching I presume CM6 either had access to the hard coding at some stage, was able to extract it or is just a very clever guy. Its always good form to reference anybody else's work even if used as a guide BTW.

Heres the link -

https://www.sas1946.com/main/index.php?topic=16274.0


CM6's post and links is the third post in and has all the links to the templates per aircraft.

I would suggest to anyone reading this who is so inclined to perhaps upload those templates to the download section here also a you never know when things drop off the edge of the world when sites shut down.

Cheers
BOO

[major_setback]

These are the ones I uploaded previously:

https://www.dropbox.com/s/wot35qmq36...ipped.zip?dl=0

I'm not sure the link works as my dropbox is 'full' (payment required by dropbox). :-(

[Erpr.Gr.210_Mölders]

These are the ones I uploaded previously:

https://www.dropbox.com/s/wot35qmq36...ipped.zip?dl=0

I'm not sure the link works as my dropbox is 'full' (payment required by dropbox). :-(

Switch to MEGA: safe, fully free, working like a charm and easy to be used and 50 GB of space available!

[major_setback]

Switch to MEGA: safe, fully free, working like a charm and easy to be used and 50 GB of space available!

Thanks!

[BOBC]

Cheers Boo,
Already got those a while ago, I do see separate rivets layers there .

Working on these meanwhile, and now thanks Major_Setback I have your dropbox as well, and it worked., so will study those next.
In the dropbox ones, the s120 is do17Z lines and internals and 3D combined, and s121 is Do215.
I am stunned by how CheckMySix has extracted the 3D and lines layers as separate entities from this, all the subtle grey shades are extracted., its as if he had access to the unfused original layers., in fact he must have had. How he established the opacity values is also intriguing.

I see in CM6's works, the Do17Z has a 3D elements layer at 84% opacity and a Lines and Internals layer also with rivets on it, the 3D layer adds darkness around the other rivets.

I am not sure if both these layers are hard coded or if its the 3D elements only, with the Lines and Internals being the work of CheckMySix. The layers dont say so. There is no ReadMe with them.

Does anyone know how the game applies the hard coded 3D rivets, is it simply 84% opacity onto a users skin or the default skin, or is it using a blending mode such as Photoshops multiply ?

Knowing this I can maybe neutralise the effect before creating my correct scale rivets.

I have found that duplicating the 3D elements layer, then inverting (black becomes white) and applying opacity 21% sees the 3d elements rivets disappear as much as is possible, IF the other rivet layer 'Lines and Internals' which has unshaded rivets on, is not turned on.

However the rivets on the Lines and Internals when turned on lessen the effect, I need to know if these are also default., CM6 has that layer at 40%.

I would like to know how 84% and 40% have been chosen.

here is the effect assuming a normal blend and the 84% and 40% are the hard coded opacity amounts in use.

Effect of 3D elements inverted and 21% opacity Do17Z.jpg

Maybe if I also dupe the Lines and Internals layer and apply a suitable opacity I can nuke those rivets as well. Unless sim uses something other than normal blend and opacity to apply them. I am sure it isnt going to use Photoshop methods ! There again the simple method would be opacity only.

I will have to deal with any lines I wish to alter in a similar way but different opacity. If the original is too dark it might not be possible. The rivets are my main target.

Should I start a new thread with this handling of hard coded rivets ?

Boo...I would suggest to anyone reading this who is so inclined to perhaps upload those templates to the download section here also a you never know when things drop off the edge of the world when sites shut down.

looked there cant see how to upload to it and what category would suit, or maybe skins ?
Given the link here can someone fathom that out and do so ?

BOBC

[major_setback]

The rivet layer will be with the panel lines. But it might well be that the rivet/panels are also pre-combined (from the original game) with a weathering layer. This is the case with the Bf 109 anyway; I couldn't improve the rivets/text for that reason.

You would need to make a lightly weathered skin, with all the basic wear shown on the aircraft (exhaust, dirt etc.), and combine this with the rivets/panels otherwise it will be too new looking. You would need to redo all warning texts and triangles too.
I think it is more complicated than you think. Everything would need to be redone from scratch. You would need to make a new bump map too if you alter the rivets, as the size would be too big on the bumps.

[BOBC]

The rivet layer will be with the panel lines. But it might well be that the rivet/panels are also pre-combined (from the original game) with a weathering layer. This is the case with the Bf 109 anyway; I couldn't improve the rivets/text for that reason.

You would need to make a lightly weathered skin, with all the basic wear shown on the aircraft (exhaust, dirt etc.), and combine this with the rivets/panels otherwise it will be too new looking. You would need to redo all warning texts and triangles too.

Hi,
I can redo weathering etc. so rather than user drag weathering slider they would leave it at 0 and choose pre-weathered skins, I would create a choice of 3 or 4 levels of weathering., otherwise if user likes heavy weathering, as soon as they drag weathering slider, it would add in the original unwanted rivets, seems a bit odd that rivets get to appear as weathering is increased but ....Its CoD as 1Lokos says !

I think it is more complicated than you think. Everything would need to be redone from scratch.

bit more work then, only by trying will I see the extent of the task.

You would need to make a new bump map too if you alter the rivets, as the size would be too big on the bumps.

.... new bump map, now this is mystery territory, where can I find out what that involves etc ?

Is a bump map hard coded, how do I get at the original and get my version into the sim ?

Cheers

BOBC

[BOO]

.... new bump map, now this is mystery territory, where can I find out what that involves etc ?

Is a bump map hard coded, how do I get at the original and get my version into the sim ?

Cheers

BOBC

Hard coded and not readily, if at all, accessable by users. In this regard the game does not offer some of the skinning options you may find on some DCS modules or in BOS and theres been no indication from TFS that this is likely to change at any point soon.

So you are left soley with the paint layer under which all the lumps, bumps and i imagne lines will be 2048x2048 unalterable renders that you see in the game today. And as these go OVER your work it could prove to be a frustrating process.

[major_setback]

Hi,
I can redo weathering etc. so rather than user drag weathering slider they would leave it at 0 and choose pre-weathered skins, I would create a choice of 3 or 4 levels of weathering., otherwise if user likes heavy weathering, as soon as they drag weathering slider, it would add in the original unwanted rivets, seems a bit odd that rivets get to appear as weathering is increased but ....Its CoD as 1Lokos says !



bit more work then, only by trying will I see the extent of the task.



.... new bump map, now this is mystery territory, where can I find out what that involves etc ?

Is a bump map hard coded, how do I get at the original and get my version into the sim ?

Cheers

BOBC

I would urge you not to spend time on this. You will get no help from TFS as we are busy doing more urgent work. The present Do17 rivets are 1 pixel in size so I can't see how you can make them smaller .... even though you can reduce the shading surrounding them a little.

We are busy working on aircraft for North Africa. Only one (1) Do17 was used in North Africa (as a liason aircraft) as far as I know, so it is not work needed for the desert release.

If you can find and replace the hidden layers yourself then feel welcome to try. You will need to be able to do this anyway to view the result of your work, and how it affects the colours of the skin (which it will do). It will no doubt take very much work.
Good luck with it though.

[BOBC]

The present Do17 rivets are 1 pixel in size so I can't see how you can make them smaller .... even though you can reduce the shading surrounding them a little.

Hi, I have to see if I can sort out the golf ball 'impact mark' per rivet on the Do17Z. Primarily for my own enjoyment as I cant have it looking like this , spoiling my enjoyment and my stills, He111 far better as you can see, Ju88 not far behind. Hope to get a FMB of the 18th August Kenley raid and need the Do17Z looking right. There might be a chance for a CoD user to display the raid at Kenley this year so look out for a separate thread I may post later on for anyone interested, an idea at best at the moment though it was done with Rowan a few years ago for the veterans meeting there, able to view their airfield from on high as it were, imagine having a veteran flying your CoD set up ! Add in an RGB projector and it starts getting even more exciting, I want an Occulus Rift !!!

We are busy working on aircraft for North Africa. Only one (1) Do17 was used in North Africa (as a liason aircraft) as far as I know, so it is not work needed for the desert release.

Sorry (though not sure why I apologise as BoB is still big interest in UK in aviation circles, also in collecting anything BoB is far more expensive than rest of war) but I am a 100% BoB devotee and this sim is a life times waiting, so for me and friends who have also waited that long, and any other BoB devotees out there, I do this as we have got so close to the finishing line after all this time , I first ran sims with aircraft 30 pixels (guess) in length, spent ages creating first skins for Rowan BoB, flew EAW, CoD is first to give me photo realistic, and can deliver the goods if skins and other errors I spot are correct, so I correct them for myself and anyone else interested, I never gave up on an accurate BoB representation and I will hone my version as best I can. I will make available to all any work that I do. I understand all efforts are on non BoB now, sorry to have come along too late to manage time to get involved for when BoB was being corrected. Even now I struggle to find the time I want on it. I am sure though there will always be newcomers buying it for BoB as well as non BoB. If I post asking for help on something and get no reply from the team then I understand.

If you can find and replace the hidden layers yourself then feel welcome to try. You will need to be able to do this anyway to view the result of your work, and how it affects the colours of the skin (which it will do). It will no doubt take very much work.
Good luck with it though.

Thank you. I will do my best.

Some of my work, e.g improving rivets on aircraft that did fly in North Africa such as Ju88 might be of use to CoD non BoB. Gunsight MG15 is relevant. Crew flying gear likewise, even groundcrew. Some subject matter carries across to other theatres.

Sounds certainly do, I will do my best to source legally 10% admissable true sounds then BoB and non BoB is at it should be experienced.

BOBC