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Thread: Blitz: Strange variation of frame rate

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    Blitz: Strange variation of frame rate

    Hi guys. I noticed a strange behavior of the simulator regarding the frame rate. What happens is that at the first start of any mission I have about 60 fps and I keep them all the time without problems. Then there are two possible situations. the first is that I decide to stop the mission voluntarily with the Esc key and the next restart of a new mission I always get 60 fps. Instead if I get knocked down (damn them) or my warbird crash, the next start of a new mission my fps drop to 45 fps approximately. I have verified that to get them back to 60 fps I have to close the Sim and reopen. This strange behavior does not happen with version 4.312.
    I looked for someone to report this problem but I did not find anything.
    Last edited by Startrek66; Apr-05-2018 at 06:18.

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    Re: Blitz: Strange variation of frame rate

    Talk with ATAG_Highseas, he had something similar although his would drop down to single digits. I think he had to reinstall Windows for some reason. Don't do anything that extreme until you get more responses though.

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    Re: Blitz: Strange variation of frame rate

    Hello...

    I did indeed have something that sounds similar during beta testing.

    Eveything would be fine 100+ fps... And then randomly would drop to sub 20 mostly around 8.

    Ifi then hit esc and then imidiately clikced on fly it would all be back at 100+. In exactly the same flight.

    Nothing i did made this stop happening and it was never diagnosed as in the end i gave up and just reinstalled my entire PC from scratch. Which cured it completely.

    As spititus says...
    Dont panic just yet.

    Try the esc / fly metiomed above and report back.

    If that doesnt work try alt tab out of the game and alt tab back in...

    Let us know how you get on. If we can rule out what haplened to me so much the better!

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    Re: Blitz: Strange variation of frame rate

    Try 'Pseudo' mode in video settings in game.

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    Re: Blitz: Strange variation of frame rate

    I have the same problem as ATAG_Highseas. I find that if I just hit exc twice it is fixed for some period of time. Faster than using the mouse key.

    Damon

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    Re: Blitz: Strange variation of frame rate

    Quote Originally Posted by 69th_Damon View Post
    I have the same problem as ATAG_Highseas. I find that if I just hit exc twice it is fixed for some period of time. Faster than using the mouse key.

    Damon
    Interesting...



    I never found the cause.

    It didnt happen in any other game than cliffs... and wasnt happening on anyone elses PC at that time.

    Reinstalling cliffs didnt change anything... neither did removing and reintsalling the graphic drivers.

    Uptaing the .net stuff didnt work either... i forget now how many goes we had at this...

    Reinstalling the machine from scratch cured it.

    Presumably it was some kind of glitch between windows and cliffs...


    Incidentally... back then i was on Windows 7... and the reinstall was also windows 7. No other windows 7 users were reporting anything like what i was experiencing.

    I'm now on 10. (new machine)... still have the old one... still on 7... and still fine with Cliffs. weird stuff.



    When did this start happening to you?

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    Re: Blitz: Strange variation of frame rate

    Hi guys. My pc is new with windows 10 so I do not even want to imagine having to redo the installation of the operating system. With version 4.312 this does not happen. However, I confirm that if the mission starts with 60 fps it keeps them always for as long as it lasts, I never have a fall of fps during. So something must happen when I decide to reload the mission below to one that is finished and not aborted by me. I will try your advice and I will tell you.
    Thanks

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    Re: Blitz: Strange variation of frame rate

    Quote Originally Posted by DRock View Post
    Try 'Pseudo' mode in video settings in game.
    what function is it?

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    Re: Blitz: Strange variation of frame rate

    In the game: Options>Video>FullScreen>Pseudo
    "If you want to fly, give up everything that weighs you down"......

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    Re: Blitz: Strange variation of frame rate

    Hi guys,
    nothing to do, the problem is not solved.
    Have any ideas?

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    Re: Blitz: Strange variation of frame rate

    Quote Originally Posted by Startrek66 View Post
    Hi guys,
    nothing to do, the problem is not solved.
    Have any ideas?
    Pseudo didn't work?

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    Re: Blitz: Strange variation of frame rate

    Quote Originally Posted by DRock View Post
    Pseudo didn't work?
    Can you show a screenshot of you Nvidia control panel?

    Can you confirm that you have a GTX750 with only 1!!! Gb of memory!?!

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    Re: Blitz: Strange variation of frame rate

    Hi guys. I have done many tests to try to understand what may be the cause. I lowered the target of FPS to the value of 50 via the application Thundermaster and I verified that when it happens the FPS drop is always about 20 fps (50-20 = 30) as when I had set 60 fps and fell to 40 fps. I also noticed that there are some missions that have no problem, here they are: Mission 8, 6, 7. They are all missions on the channel then on the sea and with these I can close them and open them randomly with each other without problems I always keep the 50 fps.
    Even the mission 14 if I launch it first at the opening of the sim I do it with 50 fps stable. But if after one of those missions (8, 6, 7) I choose Mission 14, start with 50 fps but as soon as I arrive in the tail of the bomber, the frames fall to 30.
    Complicated? Enough! For example, Mission 3 has never given me any problems, perhaps because there is no AI?
    I tried the Pseudo way but nothing to do.
    I confirm that my gtx750 has only 1gb.
    I attach the screenshots.
    Thanks for the support.

    And I add that since when in mission the FPS go down to 30 this value I will always have also in the simple mission No. 3. To bring back the FPS to the value of 50 I have to close and restart the SIM
    Attached Images Attached Images
    Last edited by Startrek66; Apr-08-2018 at 10:02.

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    Re: Blitz: Strange variation of frame rate

    hello guys, I have done other tests on the nvidia panel and does not change anything. I also tried the black death track and the problem is the same. The first time it is performed, without having done other activities on the simulator, the fps are between 60 and 45. Subsequent visualizations result in a frame rate between 50 and 30. What may be that causes this? I do not understand what can change to degrade the performance. Thanks for support.

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    Re: Blitz: Strange variation of frame rate

    Quote Originally Posted by Startrek66 View Post
    hello guys, I have done other tests on the nvidia panel and does not change anything. I also tried the black death track and the problem is the same. The first time it is performed, without having done other activities on the simulator, the fps are between 60 and 45. Subsequent visualizations result in a frame rate between 50 and 30. What may be that causes this? I do not understand what can change to degrade the performance. Thanks for support.
    Done some limited testing, and found on my system the AVG value of the counter drops significantly at the start of the second run of said track.

    That is, unless I stop the timer (fps STOP HIDE) before I end the first run of the track, and start it again (fps START SHOW) and the start of the second run of the track. Then it runs with equal values of the first run.

    Now I do realize I am talking about the AVG value, have not really looked at the first value. And, mine drops from 125 to like 80. So, this could not be relevant at all, or it explains why it does not happen when you restart the game in between. I'd rather suspect a flaw in the counter, like a reset where it's not supposed to, probably when stopping the track? But, I am merely guessing!

    Good Luck, and Have Fun!

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    Re: Blitz: Strange variation of frame rate

    Quote Originally Posted by DD_FT View Post
    Done some limited testing, and found on my system the AVG value of the counter drops significantly at the start of the second run of said track.

    That is, unless I stop the timer (fps STOP HIDE) before I end the first run of the track, and start it again (fps START SHOW) and the start of the second run of the track. Then it runs with equal values of the first run.

    Now I do realize I am talking about the AVG value, have not really looked at the first value. And, mine drops from 125 to like 80. So, this could not be relevant at all, or it explains why it does not happen when you restart the game in between. I'd rather suspect a flaw in the counter, like a reset where it's not supposed to, probably when stopping the track? But, I am merely guessing!

    Good Luck, and Have Fun!
    Thank you for your message I hope someone from the team can solve the problem

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    Re: Blitz: Strange variation of frame rate

    My PC updated a couple of days back...

    as normal I went to cliffs and set it to full screen mode hoping it would all be fixed... but it stayed the same... and so back to pseudo mode it was...

    Anyhooo... couple of days back I noticed that my gsync keeps switching itself off which given the cost to buy it is a bit GRRRRR....

    so last night I uninstalled all the graphics drivers with DDU... restarted the pc... downloaded Geforce experience.... installed that... downloaded the graphics drivers through Geforce experience and chose custom install... left all the boxes ticked but also ticked another on at the bottom of the screen "fresh install" (or something like that)...
    and bingo...

    I’m now able to used full screen mode... gsync has stopped turning itself off... and everything is mega smooth and spiffing !

    It’s the same driver version I already had installed by the way,... but it seems that scrubbing it all out and then custom installing as a "fresh install" (or whatever that box says) has made Cliffs all happy again.

    Yey !!

    I immediately made fresh clones of all my drives…


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    Re: Blitz: Strange variation of frame rate

    Quote Originally Posted by Startrek66 View Post
    Thank you for your message I hope someone from the team can solve the problem
    Hmm.... We never fugured it out on my rig.

    In the end i reinstalled the whole machine out of oure frustration.

    And that fixed it. The only problem with that approach is that it didn't give any clues as to what the actual cause was.

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    Re: Blitz: Strange variation of frame rate

    Quote Originally Posted by ATAG_Highseas View Post
    Hmm.... We never fugured it out on my rig.

    In the end i reinstalled the whole machine out of oure frustration.

    And that fixed it. The only problem with that approach is that it didn't give any clues as to what the actual cause was.
    It is a true enigma. however I did a lot of tests and in the end I think I found a good result even if I did not understand why the first mission of the simulator was the first flight with 60fps and the next with 40/50 Fps. however I explain what I did. all my reasoning has focused on Vsync, Nvidia pannel and thundermaster (utility of my gtx750 card). The refresh of my monitor is 60 Hz and a thundermaster I entered a target of 60 Fps. I then set in the sim vsync off and in the Nvidia pannel vsync adaptive and the triple active buffering. in this way I got a good frame rate compromise. so I recommend using adaptive vsync from the Nvidia panel.

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    varrattu
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    Re: Blitz: Strange variation of frame rate

    Please disable vertical synchronization (VSynch).

    VSynch can be good when applied to applications that have frame rates significantly higher than the monitor’s refresh rate of 60 frames/second (60Hz). Sorry to say that your hardware cannot permanently display extra content faster than the refresh rate of 60Hz. If your GTX750 graphics card is outputting lower frame rates than the monitor’s refresh rate, active VSynch effectively throttles the maximum generated frames per second of the graphics card to 30Hz, 20Hz, 15Hz and lower.

    The only way around this problem is to match the output device rate to the media rate in such a way that the device rate is evenly divisible by the media rate. Please have a look: KLICK ME

    ~V~

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    Re: Blitz: Strange variation of frame rate

    My vsynch is off... But i have a gsync monitor so its a bit of a mute point for me.

    I have all my nvidia control panel stuff set to standard except that i have fast sync enabled for cliffs... As my frame rates go above my 165hz refresh rate... And that causes issues (at the too many frames end of things!)

    Advice on nvidia settings is very dependent on setup. For example if I used the settings I do on my spare rig it would be terrible.

    Basically.... Whatever works best for you..... Do that!

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  27. #22
    varrattu
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    Re: Blitz: Strange variation of frame rate

    There is no simple solution when it comes to VSynch. Whether you enable it, disable it, use Adaptive VSync or Fast Synch, there are always some compromises involved.

    The Fast Synch method is similar to Triple Buffering in that it uses three frame buffers. However, the behavior is slightly different: the GPU is not held back in any way by the display's refresh cycle.

    I have been told, that DirectX games use internally controlled frame buffering, and forcing Triple Buffering via the graphics driver can break this internal buffer management. I don’t have such issues.


    ~V~

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    Re: Blitz: Strange variation of frame rate

    Quote Originally Posted by varrattu View Post
    Please disable vertical synchronization (VSynch).

    VSynch can be good when applied to applications that have frame rates significantly higher than the monitor’s refresh rate of 60 frames/second (60Hz). Sorry to say that your hardware cannot permanently display extra content faster than the refresh rate of 60Hz. If your GTX750 graphics card is outputting lower frame rates than the monitor’s refresh rate, active VSynch effectively throttles the maximum generated frames per second of the graphics card to 30Hz, 20Hz, 15Hz and lower.

    The only way around this problem is to match the output device rate to the media rate in such a way that the device rate is evenly divisible by the media rate. Please have a look: KLICK ME

    ~V~
    Thank you for the suggestion. I tried to do as you recommend and the frame rate stops at 30 Fps. But you can get 40-50 fps if you disable the vsync of cod and enable adaptive vsync in the Nvidia control panel. Try it. Regarding the performance of the gtx750 I confirm that at the start of the simulator the first mission of any complexity I do it with 60 Fps stable. While the successive different or the same I do with 40-50 of fps. This is what I do not understand and nobody has been able to explain. Good day

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  30. #24
    varrattu
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    Re: Blitz: Strange variation of frame rate

    Adaptive VSync is a good choice, because it reduces tearing, prevents framerate spikes, prevents unnecessary GPU power usage and reduces temperatures, without reducing performance.

    If your framerate falls to a level at or below half your refresh rate, and as long as you don't mind some tearing, then enabling Adaptive (half refresh rate) is usually best, as it provides a smoother experience.

    ~V~

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    Re: Blitz: Strange variation of frame rate

    Quote Originally Posted by varrattu View Post
    Adaptive VSync is a good choice, because it reduces tearing, prevents framerate spikes, prevents unnecessary GPU power usage and reduces temperatures, without reducing performance.

    If your framerate falls to a level at or below half your refresh rate, and as long as you don't mind some tearing, then enabling Adaptive (half refresh rate) is usually best, as it provides a smoother experience.

    ~V~
    I activated the VSync adaptive half rate and I set a limit on the graphics card to 30 fps on Thundermaster,
    I would say that the behavior is great, better than having 40/50 fps with some stutter.
    Thank's

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  33. #26
    varrattu
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    Re: Blitz: Strange variation of frame rate

    why
    Quote Originally Posted by Startrek66 View Post
    I set a limit on the graphics card to 30 fps on Thundermaster ...
    Thundermaster (Palit's OC and monitoring utility) offers an option called “Frame Rate Target”. The option will essentially try and cap the frame rate to whatever you set it to, e.g. 30 FPS. The clock speeds on the card will automatically dynamically adjust based on what is needed to maintain that frame rate at any given time. So if the demand is lower, then the card will downclock because that's all that it needs to maintain that FPS, or vice versa boost the clocks to maintain that frame rate under a more 3D intensive scene, for example. The feature is useful for saving power and also for older games/applications which don't demand super high frame rates.

    The NVIDIA CONTROL PANEL (NVCP) "Adaptive (half refresh rate)" option functions in exactly the same manner as regular “Adaptive”, except that it uses half your refresh rate as the framerate target for switching VSynch on or off.

    In your case “Adaptive (half refresh rate)” mostly turns “OFF” because the “Frame Rate Target” 30 FPS.

    ~V~
    Last edited by varrattu; Apr-30-2018 at 05:03. Reason: addendum

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    Re: Blitz: Strange variation of frame rate

    Quote Originally Posted by varrattu View Post
    why


    Thundermaster (Palit's OC and monitoring utility) offers an option called “Frame Rate Target”. The option will essentially try and cap the frame rate to whatever you set it to, e.g. 30 FPS. The clock speeds on the card will automatically dynamically adjust based on what is needed to maintain that frame rate at any given time. So if the demand is lower, then the card will downclock because that's all that it needs to maintain that FPS, or vice versa boost the clocks to maintain that frame rate under a more 3D intensive scene, for example. The feature is useful for saving power and also for older games/applications which don't demand super high frame rates.

    The NVIDIA CONTROL PANEL (NVCP) "Adaptive (half refresh rate)" option functions in exactly the same manner as regular “Adaptive”, except that it uses half your refresh rate as the framerate target for switching VSynch on or off.

    In your case “Adaptive (half refresh rate)” mostly turns “OFF” because the “Frame Rate Target” 30 FPS.

    ~V~
    I could then put a fps target at 40 + vsync adaptive half refresh
    Thanks

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