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Thread: How can a fuselage skimming across ground devoid of fuel tanks and wings explode ?

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    How can a fuselage skimming across ground devoid of fuel tanks and wings explode ?

    Hi,
    I am unaware of the Me110 fuselage having fuel tanks yet having feathered both engines, then shed both wings at same time via trees, the fuselage carrying on for a short while, it then explodes, all that is visible is flames and a small crater, not an ounce of wreckage, wings and engines exist just beyond trees, yet I/we should have walked away from that one though. Mein kamerad ist Todt. moi aussi (ok its french !)

    Is this sort of behaviour being addressed in T5 ?

    We can but dream that one day CoD is animated so we see crew climb out and inspect aircraft, and maybe then torch it !

    I want to recreate force landings having created FMB for the known raid and outcome, but with aircraft exploding thats going to be impossible, what tricks are there to do this ?

    BOBC

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    Re: How can a fuselage skimming across ground devoid of fuel tanks and wings explode

    Might be caused by the 3D collision model acting up, AFAIK it's been ingame since the original 2011 release. Shed both wings on the Bf 110 or Blenheim while on the ground and you will start rolling and breakdancing like crazy, either for perpetuity or until you hit Esc and explode. It might happen to a degree for all aircraft (109 demonstrated below)



    Of course we have to thank JG4 for their rigorous testing of this


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    Re: How can a fuselage skimming across ground devoid of fuel tanks and wings explode

    CLIFFS OF DOVER has the most complex damage system of any flight sim out there.

    But even this sim has its limits.

    Even so, seeing an aircraft explode when it hits the ground is not unusual... especially if the wings have been torn off and fuel is streaming out. Aluminum is flammable, ammunition can explode, etc. etc.

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    ATAG Member ATAG_Flare's Avatar
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    Re: How can a fuselage skimming across ground devoid of fuel tanks and wings explode

    Basically the sim gets to a point where the damage is so severe that there's no point in simulating it all in the damage model, so it just does an explosion. It happens when you crash into the ground at a high enough angle or speed and can also occur when crashing into other planes - sometimes one plane will get away with just a scratch like an elevtaor missing but the other one just explodes 100%. Not the most realistic behvaiour but it's a limitation of the sim. In 95% of the cases the damage model is pretty darn good enough - let's be honest - when you're in a 110 with no wings crashing along the ground, it doesn't make much difference to the gameplay whether the plane ends up as a bundle of messed up metal or as a smoking crater. Visually there's the difference of course and it would be a nice feature to have more detail in crashes but I don't see it as a priority.

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    Re: How can a fuselage skimming across ground devoid of fuel tanks and wings explode

    To explain accurately what Flare is speculating about:

    In CoD, the plane will explode when the cockpit is torn apart... because the pilot is essentially dead at that point... no one survives being ejected or torn apart at 100+ miles per hour.

    Yeah, the game could include some kind of complex damage modeling which involves the pilot figure being torn to pieces as it exits or hits the ground or gets impaled on some ground object, but why load the game down with huge number of variables which need to be tracked and monitored by the game engine and which take up netcode when you can just explode the aircraft.

    Most sims do the same thing much earlier... aircraft explode in a ball of flame after very little damage... CoD has much more complex damage... more in the way of damaged parts being separated/removed before the explosion happens.

    You can hit the ground in CoD and have a lot of parts separate and tear away and still survive... because the cockpit will only tear apart at certain speeds and impacts.

    Try belly landing an aircraft... if you do it at low enough speeds and the aircraft slides upright, you see parts separate from the body, but the cabin survives along with the pilot. Do it at high enough speed or if the aircraft tumbles or rolls over and it will explode because the cockpit is being impacted or destroyed.
    Last edited by RAF74_Buzzsaw; Feb-05-2019 at 22:31.

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    Re: How can a fuselage skimming across ground devoid of fuel tanks and wings explode

    Quote Originally Posted by RAF74_Buzzsaw View Post
    Try belly landing an aircraft... if you do it at low enough speeds and the aircraft slides upright, you see parts separate from the body, but the cabin survives along with the pilot.
    That was my 110, but...My 110 saw wings torn off and the fuselage carried on, upright, sliding across grass, both crew alive, probably a few bruises from straps, then as it stopped, boom, crater. nothing left.
    fuel tanks left behind with wings and engines, so technically there is nothing to catch fire in the fuselage.

    Quote Originally Posted by RAF74_Buzzsaw View Post
    Do it at high enough speed or if the aircraft tumbles or rolls over and it will explode because the cockpit is being impacted or destroyed.
    accepted it wants to destroy the aircraft. but in reality a bent and bashed cockpit for an aircraft with no fuel in the fuselage really should not ignite.

    I will try for a few more force landings and see what happens. It would be nice to be able to match actual force landings and walk away from them.

    BOBC

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    Re: How can a fuselage skimming across ground devoid of fuel tanks and wings explode

    This is one area where CloD is behind the original IL2-46. Crashes in that were very realistic, and if you happened to survive one your pilot could leave the aircraft and run away from it before being ground strafed. With some of the bombers you'd get a whole stream of crew running in all directions.

    David

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    Re: How can a fuselage skimming across ground devoid of fuel tanks and wings explode

    Quote Originally Posted by DavePro View Post
    This is one area where CloD is behind the original IL2-46. Crashes in that were very realistic, and if you happened to survive one your pilot could leave the aircraft and run away from it before being ground strafed. With some of the bombers you'd get a whole stream of crew running in all directions.

    David
    The damage model in IL-2 1946 is far simpler and less accurate than CLIFFS OF DOVER. But CoD has its limits.

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    Re: How can a fuselage skimming across ground devoid of fuel tanks and wings explode

    Quote Originally Posted by BOBC View Post
    That was my 110, but...My 110 saw wings torn off and the fuselage carried on, upright, sliding across grass, both crew alive, probably a few bruises from straps, then as it stopped, boom, crater. nothing left.
    fuel tanks left behind with wings and engines, so technically there is nothing to catch fire in the fuselage.


    accepted it wants to destroy the aircraft. but in reality a bent and bashed cockpit for an aircraft with no fuel in the fuselage really should not ignite.

    I will try for a few more force landings and see what happens. It would be nice to be able to match actual force landings and walk away from them.

    BOBC
    You are missing the point again... when the cockpit explodes, the game is representing the moment at which that cockpit is being torn apart or the pilot is being ejected or impacted to the point of death.

    Rather than create a whole series of very complicated animations and effects which would take a huge amount of time for our 3D artists to create, (and which would be different for every plane) the game simply causes the cockpit to explode.

    The result is the same... the pilot/player is dead.

    What you are asking for is simply not worthwhile creating... we'd be taking years to do the 3D work for an aircraft.

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    Re: How can a fuselage skimming across ground devoid of fuel tanks and wings explode

    Yep.

    It would be a huge waste of resources putting any TFS time on that !


    Probably the easiest solution if you are after these sorts of effects is to draw your own flick book.

    One for each plane and then at the critical point pick up the relevenat flick book and render your own effect at whatever frame rate your thumbs can handle.

    It's both creative and interactive.

    Last edited by ATAG_Highseas; Feb-14-2019 at 18:24.


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    Re: How can a fuselage skimming across ground devoid of fuel tanks and wings explode

    Please, don't say 1946 Damage model is more complex than Cliffs...Even the 'internals' are modelled in Cliffs...


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