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Thread: Flight modelling twin engine aircrafts

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    Novice Pilot Bussard's Avatar
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    Flight modelling twin engine aircrafts

    I have a remark about the flight modelling for twin engine aircrafts. When running on 1 engine it is very difficult to keep the aircraft in the air.
    In almost all cases resulting in a crash.

    This should not be the case, these aircrafts were designed to fly on 1 engine. Lately I saw a video of a factory flying test of a He111 which had no problem flying on 1 engine. When I saw that I realised that in sim this is totally different.

    Also the AI is affected by this, the AI He111 for example is always crashing with one engine running. In fact most of the kills on He111s I make is shooting up one engine and after a while the bomber will crash,
    this would probably be no kill in real life.

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    TF Leadership RAF74_Buzzsaw's Avatar
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    Re: Flight modelling twin engine aircrafts

    Hello Bussard

    Twin engined aircraft were often, but not always designed to fly with only one engine.

    Some types were capable of flying, but lost height over time.

    Any aircraft which has sustained damage will have additional drag on the airframe and that will make flying on one engine very difficult.

    If the remaining engine has taken any damage, then the chances of maintaining flight drop even more.

    Questions:

    - Are you trimming the aircraft control surfaces correctly when flying with one engine? (elevator, rudder, ailerons if they are trimmable)

    - If the propellors can be feathered, are you feathering them? Generally the German types can manually feather their propellors. (change maximum coarse pitch... below 0%)

    - Are you setting the radiators to the correct opening? Close them as much as possible... but don't overheat.

    In my own testing of the twin engined types in the game I have been able to fly all with one engine... although sometimes this is with gradual altitude loss.

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  4. #3
    Novice Pilot Bussard's Avatar
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    Re: Flight modelling twin engine aircrafts

    Any aircraft which has sustained damage will have additional drag on the airframe and that will make flying on one engine very difficult.
    If the remaining engine has taken any damage, then the chances of maintaining flight drop even more.
    Agree I should consider the additional drag.

    Questions:

    - Are you trimming the aircraft control surfaces correctly when flying with one engine? (elevator, rudder, ailerons if they are trimmable)
    Yes, I use elevator, rudder trim (Bf110) and aileron trim (He111) to control the aircraft.

    - If the propellors can be feathered, are you feathering them? Generally the German types can manually feather their propellors. (change maximum coarse pitch... below 0%)
    Yes, I feather the prop to reduce resistance.

    - Are you setting the radiators to the correct opening? Close them as much as possible... but don't overheat.
    Only close 1/4 max.

    In my own testing of the twin engined types in the game I have been able to fly all with one engine... although sometimes this is with gradual altitude loss.[/QUOTE]
    AI seems to be not capable, would be nice if they learn the trick.
    Last edited by Bussard; Sep-15-2019 at 19:03.

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    TF Leadership RAF74_Buzzsaw's Avatar
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    Re: Flight modelling twin engine aircrafts

    Quote Originally Posted by Bussard View Post
    Any aircraft which has sustained damage will have additional drag on the airframe and that will make flying on one engine very difficult.
    If the remaining engine has taken any damage, then the chances of maintaining flight drop even more.
    Agree I should consider the additional drag.

    Questions:

    - Are you trimming the aircraft control surfaces correctly when flying with one engine? (elevator, rudder, ailerons if they are trimmable)
    Yes, I use elevator, rudder trim (Bf110) and aileron trim (He111) to control the aircraft.

    - If the propellors can be feathered, are you feathering them? Generally the German types can manually feather their propellors. (change maximum coarse pitch... below 0%)
    Yes, I feather the prop to reduce resistance.

    - Are you setting the radiators to the correct opening? Close them as much as possible... but don't overheat.
    Only close 1/4 max.

    In my own testing of the twin engined types in the game I have been able to fly all with one engine... although sometimes this is with gradual altitude loss.
    AI seems to be not capable, would be nice if they learn the trick.[/QUOTE]

    Unfortunately AI are not as capable as humans... depending on their skill level.

    At this stage the AI code does not allow them to feather props.

    Unlikely we will be able to change this for TF 5.0. When we add auto feathering for human controlled aircraft in TF 6.0, we may add it for AI.

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    Re: Flight modelling twin engine aircrafts

    Quote Originally Posted by RAF74_Buzzsaw View Post
    Any aircraft which has sustained damage will have additional drag on the airframe and that will make flying on one engine very difficult.
    I suggest to check the Bf 110 about this aspect too ( airframe damage ).
    I have noted, in fact, that also if you have only very small holes in the wing\s ( also just one hole is enough ) the Bf 110 drag toward the ground seems to increase a bit too much and the aircraft immediately have the tendency to " point the nose down " very hard despite the small damage received.
    In addition the tail section of the aircraft seems a little bit too much prone to get cut, also by 303 caliber rounds ( and this becomes very evident, IMHO, when hit by the 20mm cannons of the Beaufighter that are very devastating also when the enemy attacking " spray and pray " from very long distances ).
    Some days ago, while having some training flight, I was attacked by a Beaufighter that hit my tail section with no more than 2-3 20mm rounds fired from an exstimated distance of 600-700 meters and my tail and rudder surfaces got completely destroyed and cut ( and I've had the feeling that the shells were provoking damage also just passing close to the tail section surfaces but this is something still to be tested well before making an " official " statement about this )
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    Re: Flight modelling twin engine aircrafts

    Quote Originally Posted by SKG 210_Mölders View Post
    I suggest to check the Bf 110 about this aspect too ( airframe damage ).
    I have noted, in fact, that also if you have only very small holes in the wing\s ( also just one hole is enough ) the Bf 110 drag toward the ground seems to increase a bit too much and the aircraft immediately have the tendency to " point the nose down " very hard despite the small damage received.
    In addition the tail section of the aircraft seems a little bit too much prone to get cut, also by 303 caliber rounds ( and this becomes very evident, IMHO, when hit by the 20mm cannons of the Beaufighter that are very devastating also when the enemy attacking " spray and pray " from very long distances ).
    Some days ago, while having some training flight, I was attacked by a Beaufighter that hit my tail section with no more than 2-3 20mm rounds fired from an exstimated distance of 600-700 meters and my tail and rudder surfaces got completely destroyed and cut ( and I've had the feeling that the shells were provoking damage also just passing close to the tail section surfaces but this is something still to be tested well before making an " official " statement about this )
    Damage modeling will see a complete revision for TF 5.0.

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    Manual Creation Group ATAG_Ezzie's Avatar
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    Re: Flight modelling twin engine aircrafts

    Quote Originally Posted by Bussard View Post
    I have a remark about the flight modelling for twin engine aircrafts. When running on 1 engine it is very difficult to keep the aircraft in the air.
    In almost all cases resulting in a crash.

    This should not be the case, these aircrafts were designed to fly on 1 engine. Lately I saw a video of a factory flying test of a He111 which had no problem flying on 1 engine. When I saw that I realised that in sim this is totally different.

    Also the AI is affected by this, the AI He111 for example is always crashing with one engine running. In fact most of the kills on He111s I make is shooting up one engine and after a while the bomber will crash,
    this would probably be no kill in real life.
    Hi Bussard,

    With practice the -110 and -111 are relatively easy to fly on 1 engine. In the -110 its also possible to climb - just - on 1 engine. I think Buzz has mentioned all the important stuff but here's an old thread in case you want to review your procedure. Its now possible to feather the prop which makes a big difference.

    https://theairtacticalassaultgroup.c...hlight=Feather

    Its still posdible with some airframe damage but it u get too much it becomes very tricky. I havent figured out how to tell the gunner to jump to reduce weight yet though.

    Ezzie

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    Re: Flight modelling twin engine aircrafts

    Quote Originally Posted by ATAG_Ezzie View Post
    Hi Bussard,

    With practice the -110 and -111 are relatively easy to fly on 1 engine.
    Same for the Blenheim and the Beaufighter.

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