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Thread: Op. Sandstorm, SITREP

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    Last edited by ♣_Spiritus_♣; Sep-25-2020 at 00:33. Reason: 9/4/2020: UPDATES SHOWN IN RED

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    Re: Op. Sandstorm, SITREP

    Sounds awesome!

    Is this going to be like the channel map missions where we can call bomber raids using the tab menu?

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    Re: Op. Sandstorm, SITREP

    We need more bomber pilots on the Axis side...
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    Re: Op. Sandstorm, SITREP

    Quote Originally Posted by Biggs View Post
    Sounds awesome!

    Is this going to be like the channel map missions where we can call bomber raids using the tab menu?
    That would be something that would have to be added by the people who from ATAG who did it last time. I'm all for it though, just don't have the time to implement that.

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    Re: Op. Sandstorm, SITREP

    Quote Originally Posted by ATAG_Noofy View Post
    We need more bomber pilots on the Axis side...
    Yeah, I think the ship targets for both sides will need coordinated attacks.

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    Re: Op. Sandstorm, SITREP

    Sounds great, warming up my Hurribomber.

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    Re: Op. Sandstorm, SITREP

    This sounds like alot of fun thanks for the hard work Spiritus! S! I cant wait to get on soon!
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    Re: Op. Sandstorm, SITREP

    Quote Originally Posted by 69th_Spiritus View Post
    Yeah, I think the ship targets for both sides will need coordinated attacks.
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    Re: Op. Sandstorm, SITREP

    Quote Originally Posted by ATAG_Highseas View Post
    Co ordi

    Co oarden

    Co aud

    Ahh to hell with it.....
    That would fully qualify you for membership in FG28.
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    Re: Op. Sandstorm, SITREP

    love the recon photos, looking forward to this map, can't make any promises about not bombing the hospital ship, fog of war and all that.
    Don't let Grudges fester and poison your future happiness......get your revenge as quickly as possible.

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    Re: Op. Sandstorm, SITREP

    Please check flak settings at El Adem. My own flak was shooting at me from the moment of spawn in at El Adem 100km behind front lines Put holes in my wing.

    where can I find the NAVAIDS frequencies for the air bases?

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    Re: Op. Sandstorm, SITREP

    Checked that out, should be corrected now.

    Also added more flak/AAA. Added Halfaya as another airbase with all Allied aircraft available. Made Amseat No2 an emergency field, only Allied fighters/attack aircraft are available there. Axis now have Gambut No3 as another airbase with all Axis aircraft available. Menastir No2 is an emergency field, only fighter/attack aircraft are available there.

    Also added AAA encampments for both sides along the northern front line.

    Should be in the rotation in the next 24 hours I'd assume.

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    Re: Op. Sandstorm, SITREP

    Quote Originally Posted by 69th_Spiritus View Post
    Yeah, I think the ship targets for both sides will need coordinated attacks.

    You just need one Kayo and a DerDa to be constantly shot down and a Maru to sink all those cruisers ...

    a.jpg

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    Re: Op. Sandstorm, SITREP

    Breafing say...
    (Reconnaissance aircraft have also reported enemy submarine activity N of Ras Azzaz and NE of Tobruk.)



    I cann't find Ras Azzaz.

    Tobruk is AQ-19 but where is Raz Azzaz ???

    .

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    Re: Op. Sandstorm, SITREP

    It is at the edge of the corner north of Bardia.

    I had to look it up in Mission Builder where you can zoom in further...

    2020-09-02_011604.jpg

    2020-09-02_011138.jpg

    That puts it in quadrant AZ-18.

    To locate the submarines you can take-off from Tobruk and fly on a 070 heading for a while
    Last edited by ATAG_Noofy; Sep-01-2020 at 18:25.
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    Re: Op. Sandstorm, SITREP

    First of all thank you for this mission!
    It's great fun to fly and certainly will become one of the classics!
    Especially I love the wide variety of different targets.

    Just some obeservations we made (from the RED perspective only):

    The red submarine convoy is reported 50% damaged right after the mission starts.

    Because of the mass of flak and warships in Tobruk harbour these targets can only be attacked by a number of high flying bombers. Indeed, I find it positive that players are encouraged to try different kinds of attack, but since the blue tanker convoy also is escorted by three major warships, it seems a bit hard. We did many attempts of coordinated torpedo or low level bomber attacks (3 to 4 players) and died over and over again to rather little success.

    The airfield and the water treatment facility that are other major targets are located very far to the West. It is great fun to navigate over the desert and a big achievement to find those targets, but given the fact that you need 5 bombloads of Wellingtons to destroy an airfield and an unknown number of bombs for the freshwater facility (we did not succeed with 2 Beaufighters repeatedly) it takes an enormous amount of time and/or players to destroy these targets.

    Because of this it seems quite impossible to roll the map given normal amounts of players on the server.
    If this is intended, fine by me.

    S!

    DerDa

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    Re: Op. Sandstorm, SITREP

    I love this map as well and reading even DerDa is considering to digg into the black art of level bombing shows how good this mission is.
    Can’t wait to unleash the IID on one of these support convoys in the desert!

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    Re: Op. Sandstorm, SITREP

    Thanks for the mission, Spiritus! I‘ve flown it a couple of times now and feel I can post my impressions.

    DerDa is spot on regarding distances and targets. Adding to his comments, the action seems to be thus pretty much concentrated over the forward Blue airfield with Reds coming in from Amseat in droves. The mission tends to develop into a low level furball over the airfield or between it and Amseat. Basically turning a nice mission into something more akin of a simple dogfight server. And the later hours makes the mission playable with full daylight for around just the first half of the mission time.

    As there is little coordinated flying and if, then with usually less than maybe four players, the intended targets get ignored.

    I believe missions should try to bring players into coordinating larger formations to attack specific targets and destroy them. And your mission goes in this direction, which I like!

    So if I am allowed to make a general suggestion: limit the amount of targets per side (say like 4), leave two closer to the frontline (for example the ships now), and the other two farther behind (but not too far). These farther out need less bomb loads to destroy (say 6 - 12 bomb loads of a 110 / Blenny / Beau or 4 - 8 of a Welly / Ju 88 / He 111 so it takes around three to six flights of two, which is more common). Place the active airfields some in between the front and the forward targets and some farther behind, in front and behind the rear targets. With a little symmetry for both sides.

    For example, on the Blue side I think the middle field (Tobruk?) is already too far away from the front. For me that would be the forward-rear field.

    And maybe set the mission two hours earlier, so it doesn‘t get dark. I see players leaving or not joining when it is past 8 pm on the mission. These go somewhere else and don‘t come back, leaving the server half empty.
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    Re: Op. Sandstorm, SITREP

    Yep.
    Great fun mission.
    Huuuge map. Love the long navigations.
    Would appreciate 2-3 radio nav aids to try alternative non-direct routes to target
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    Re: Op. Sandstorm, SITREP

    Quote Originally Posted by ATAG_Noofy View Post
    Yep.
    Great fun mission.
    Huuuge map. Love the long navigations.
    Would appreciate 2-3 radio nav aids to try alternative non-direct routes to target
    I agree.
    NAVAIDS and a
    rear Axis base for bombers
    add an allied storage depot as a target with large concentrations of vehicles, fuel tankers huge secondary explosions w/collateral damage...yay

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    Re: Op. Sandstorm, SITREP

    While the major objectives require a determined effort in repeated long range navigation - not quite everyones' thing, I really like the addition of the vehicle convoys. A simple, yet very real aspect of desert warfare. Shame there's only one per side.
    I'd even suggest seeing more ground targets both mobile and static concentrations as additional 'lesser value' objectives. The only issue is players don't always pay attention to who's side the convoys are on. Every Red convoy I've seen destroyed has succumbed to friendly strafing !
    Strafe-able ground targets could serve the dual purpose of helping bridge the gap between players who enjoy the more 'strategic' aspects of the map and those who are happy being furball combatants. Plus giving some valuable 'life' to an otherwise barren desert battleground.

    Cheers
    Dazza
    Last edited by Dazza; Sep-04-2020 at 02:23.

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    Re: Op. Sandstorm, SITREP

    Quote Originally Posted by J-HAT View Post
    Thanks for the mission, Spiritus! I‘ve flown it a couple of times now and feel I can post my impressions.

    DerDa is spot on regarding distances and targets. Adding to his comments, the action seems to be thus pretty much concentrated over the forward Blue airfield with Reds coming in from Amseat in droves. The mission tends to develop into a low level furball over the airfield or between it and Amseat. Basically turning a nice mission into something more akin of a simple dogfight server. And the later hours makes the mission playable with full daylight for around just the first half of the mission time.

    As there is little coordinated flying and if, then with usually less than maybe four players, the intended targets get ignored.

    I believe missions should try to bring players into coordinating larger formations to attack specific targets and destroy them. And your mission goes in this direction, which I like!

    So if I am allowed to make a general suggestion: limit the amount of targets per side (say like 4), leave two closer to the frontline (for example the ships now), and the other two farther behind (but not too far). These farther out need less bomb loads to destroy (say 6 - 12 bomb loads of a 110 / Blenny / Beau or 4 - 8 of a Welly / Ju 88 / He 111 so it takes around three to six flights of two, which is more common). Place the active airfields some in between the front and the forward targets and some farther behind, in front and behind the rear targets. With a little symmetry for both sides.

    For example, on the Blue side I think the middle field (Tobruk?) is already too far away from the front. For me that would be the forward-rear field.

    And maybe set the mission two hours earlier, so it doesn‘t get dark. I see players leaving or not joining when it is past 8 pm on the mission. These go somewhere else and don‘t come back, leaving the server half empty.
    Totally agree!

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    Re: Op. Sandstorm, SITREP

    - one "snag rep" after patch 004.

    If one spawn in a gun /AA at some base, you have to restart mission to get back in a plane.

    Server says you are in a plane and you can even start it, but you are still "out in the fields".

    -I know, its a flight sim..

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    Re: Op. Sandstorm, SITREP

    Changed the target airfields from 100% damage to "destroy" to 50%. Also changed all hard targets from 80% to 50% to "destroy" them.

    Moved the time back by 10 minutes. There is still about 15 minutes of decent daylight when the mission turns. Players need to be willing to try new things and while the visibility isn't perfect, it isn't bad either towards the end of the mission.

    Added two more spawn points for each side. Blue: Sidi Rezegh, all aircraft available. Red: Gasr el Abid, all aircraft available.

    Changed the ship skill levels to average and rookie for both sides.

    Added two trucking convoys for both sides which are now counted as mission objectives. See updated briefing on rough location and direction of travel.

    Changed how the mission can be won. Each side needs to accumulate 5 points to win the map, each target is worth a point with the exception of the Axis's shipping convoy, if the Allied side sinks those ships it is worth two points.

    So not all targets need to be destroyed now, the two trucking convoys that have been added to both sides play a role now, so each side has 7 targets and only 5 need to be destroyed to win.

    Also added some NAVAIDs.

    SEE POST #1 BRIEFING TO READ CHANGES

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    Re: Op. Sandstorm, SITREP

    Quote Originally Posted by 69th_Spiritus View Post

    Also added some NAVAIDs.

    SEE POST #1 BRIEFING TO READ CHANGES


    skud
    Last edited by ATAG_SKUD; Sep-05-2020 at 03:19.
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    Re: Op. Sandstorm, SITREP

    Thank you

    Quote Originally Posted by 69th_Spiritus View Post
    Also added some NAVAIDs.
    Whohoo

    NAVAIDs: Derna 304, Gazala 306, Tobruk 308, Bardia 310
    I am sure Rommel would have also requested an additional beacon to be placed more to the south, like in Almiyah al’Khafiah for example...
    Last edited by ATAG_Noofy; Sep-05-2020 at 02:28.
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    Re: Op. Sandstorm, SITREP

    where is Alam el Neiyat?????
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    Re: Op. Sandstorm, SITREP

    Quote Originally Posted by 69th_Spiritus View Post
    Changed the target airfields from 100% damage to "destroy" to 50%. Also changed all hard targets from 80% to 50% to "destroy" them.

    Moved the time back by 10 minutes. There is still about 15 minutes of decent daylight when the mission turns. Players need to be willing to try new things and while the visibility isn't perfect, it isn't bad either towards the end of the mission.

    Added two more spawn points for each side. Blue: Sidi Rezegh, all aircraft available. Red: Gasr el Abid, all aircraft available.

    Changed the ship skill levels to average and rookie for both sides.

    Added two trucking convoys for both sides which are now counted as mission objectives. See updated briefing on rough location and direction of travel.

    Changed how the mission can be won. Each side needs to accumulate 5 points to win the map, each target is worth a point with the exception of the Axis's shipping convoy, if the Allied side sinks those ships it is worth two points.

    So not all targets need to be destroyed now, the two trucking convoys that have been added to both sides play a role now, so each side has 7 targets and only 5 need to be destroyed to win.

    Also added some NAVAIDs.

    SEE POST #1 BRIEFING TO READ CHANGES
    Great news!
    Thanky ou very much indeed!
    Can't wait to give it a try.

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    Re: Op. Sandstorm, SITREP

    Quote Originally Posted by III./ZG76_Saipan View Post
    where is Alam el Neiyat?????
    It is a small town at the crossroads about 19 km to the NE of Fort Maddalena (near Scegga No1 airfield)
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    Re: Op. Sandstorm, SITREP

    Attack on Bir el-Hakim

    a.jpg

    b.jpg

    Those smoke effects are simply awesome!

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