Force Feedback Effects

[Dazza]

I've been exclusively using MS FFB Sidewinder II sticks since my 1st WWII sim in the late 90's. Through 1946 and Cliffs I've used mixed stock and edited (by others) files to suit my needs, as some files were simply too strong ie 'shake' and 'cannon'. I found forum posts saying there has been some editing of Cliffs FFB in past updates, with currently re-labeled FFB files. Lately I've come to the conclusion that my effects overall in game are lesser than what I recall. Not simply one day to the next, but it just suddenly dawned on me. I recall broken engines or prop strikes violently shaking the table. Now the stick just rattles.

I have the fedit program that others have used to edit the FFB files and checked for myself. With fedit open I can play each file while holding the stick. For eg machinegun. Then in game holding the trigger I get the same effect, but much lesser. I'm sure I used to feel a quick 'bump' on bomb release (mortar file I think as it has a single pulse). Now in game nothing at all. Perhaps gear up / down too ? I can't properly recall.

Regardless all files when played in fedit are much stronger than in game. Initially I wondered if my stick was wearing out, or the USB hub / port being an issue. But with all being well outside the game I assume not. The stock files, and those I still have from 1946 all feel much weaker to not at all when in game.

I know not many of us have FFB but there are those with the MS stick and using newer FFB sticks. It's all working as usual, some FFB drop outs with bomb release / cannon and the usual fix methods. Centering and high speed is solid, slight buffet at stall. Just every effect sense is 'weak.'
Anyone else have this issue?

Daz

[Amarok]

Moin comrades,

I also use a Sidewinder FFB2.
I could observe with Me109s that when the cannons are triggered or bombs are dropped, the FFB forces are lost.
This can be remedied by pulling steeply upwards at a speed > 300 km/h. Then most of the FFB forces return.

[Dazza]

Moin comrades,

I also use a Sidewinder FFB2.
I could observe with Me109s that when the cannons are triggered or bombs are dropped, the FFB forces are lost.
This can be remedied by pulling steeply upwards at a speed > 300 km/h. Then most of the FFB forces return.

Yes this is how it's always been. But my question is how much effects force are you feeling ?

Going years back most complaints were because the cannon shake for eg was too much, so players started using modified ffb files. I remember some vibration and shake effects being drastic so I'd use modified files. Now I find even to stock files have weak effects. Again this is only in game. Testing files outside the game the effects on my stick are much stronger. Do you feel a 'bump' when dropping bombs ? I'm sure I used to.

The spring / return to center force is always present. But I find the effects of guns, damage, bombs etc is weaker than I remember. Even the machine guns would vibrate the table. Now everything feels much weaker. Is it just me ?

Thx
Daz

[ATAG_Headshot]

Does anyone know if this sim supports the newer FFB sticks like the Moza AB-9? It's game changing in other sims but I'm wondering if it would work here as well.

[ATAG_Lenny]

I can confirm the Moza AB9 works.

See my signature below.

Lenny

[Dazza]

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Well now I have a few hours at home I investigated my own question.
I have an earlier 2020 Cliffs Blitz version on a laptop drive and using Fedit compared the FFB files against the current (fresh Steam verified). The shorter sine waves show we now use, at least some, modified 'weaker' FFB files. I can understand these weapons files in particular being weakened as they caused most complaints by spoiling aim.

But still my question is does anyone feel a click or bump when releasing a bomb or landing gear locking up/down ? I'm almost certain I used to. I could be thinking 1946, but from all I know it's exactly the same FFB programming between games. I had used 1946 FFB files in Cliffs.

The only references I can find concerning official FFB tweaks was on the now defunct IL2 forum work to allow multiple FFB devices which was covered in Update 5.042 / Jan 2025. I believe this resulted in the renaming of the current FFB files.

Daz

[DerDa]

There definitely have been bumps when releasing bombs or lowering the landing gear with the Beaufighter.
I did not fly for a while, so I can't say whether they disappeared.
Dropping 500 or 1000 lbs, changing the centre of gravity and the aerodynamics really should feel, it would be a pity it it is gone.

[Lorena]

can you guys share the fedit profiles that you created so we can test also?

there is another here https://theairtacticalassaultgroup.c...highlight=40mm

[Dazza]

can you guys share the fedit profiles that you created so we can test also?

there is another here https://theairtacticalassaultgroup.c...highlight=40mm

I have FFB files from posts made on this forum accross many years. I think some were by BOO and some by Mikmak if I recall. Theyre in the downloads or linked in the threads.
I'm home for the day so perhaps I'll do some more testing if I can stay awake.

EDIT:

I removed all FFB files from the folder then replaced them singly. I get forces for everything except mortar and bomb, no matter how much I tweak and exaggerate their sine waves etc.
Others I tweaked I can feel the difference : Punch concerns ground-roll vibration. Shake is buffeting from flaps / gear / stall etc.

Bomb and Mortar I simply don't know what they are supposed to do, but accross a few different a/c I had no effect from bomb release or gear locking up/down. I'm certain I used to ? It's not a sudden thing, I've been thinking this for a long time and just looking into it.


Just observation
Daz

[Artist]

Probably superflous to mention it again, but just in case:

In PATCH 042 on January 28th, 2025, we added support for simultaneous use of multiple Force Feedback (FFB) devices, so all files were doubled:

• autocannon_0.ffe
• autocannon_1.ffe
• machinegun_0.ffe
• machinegun_1.ffe
• mortar_0.ffe
• mortar_1.ffe

and these two became obsolete:

• autocannon.ffe
• machinegun.ffe

And there are two versions of the ForceFeedback Editor circulating, both claiming to be Version 1.0 in the Help/About

• one, not buggy, File Version "05.04.00.2904" (see fedit.exe, Properties, Details, "File Version")
• And another, buggy one, File Version "1.0.0.1"

The good one is here: https://www.team-fusion-simulations....link=37#item37

[Dazza]

Probably superflous to mention it again, but just in case:

In PATCH 042 on January 28th, 2025, we added support for simultaneous use of multiple Force Feedback (FFB) devices, so all files were doubled:

• autocannon_0.ffe
• autocannon_1.ffe
• machinegun_0.ffe
• machinegun_1.ffe
• mortar_0.ffe
• mortar_1.ffe

and these two became obsolete:

• autocannon.ffe
• machinegun.ffe

And there are two versions of the ForceFeedback Editor circulating, both claiming to be Version 1.0 in the Help/About

• one, not buggy, File Version "05.04.00.2904" (see fedit.exe, Properties, Details, "File Version")
• And another, buggy one, File Version "1.0.0.1"

The good one is here: https://www.team-fusion-simulations....link=37#item37

Yes I'd read all this before and assumed the renamed files were due to changes allowing multiple FFB controllers. But not all FFB files got new names ! So maybe they're not all in use ? Punch and shake didn't get renamed but definitely are still active effects.

I have the correct fedit prog and can make changes to the files, and feel those changes in game. However I cannot get any effect from bomb or mortar files. Prior threads had noted bomb effect was related to bomb release. Playing this file outside the game it is a single, slight bump movement. But in game it does nothing .. as far as my tests go with varied aircraft. My question is it me or does everyone experience the same ?

Daz

[Dazza]

Searching further into the old IL2 forum there's a thread concerning FFB effects and from what I can figure out when the last changes were made to the FFB system to permit multiple FFB devices - thus the renaming of ffe files as stated prior, only the main FFB effects were included. Extra effects like bomb drop were omitted as they can cause issues.

So I'm not imagining things, there were tactile forces I'm no longer feeling. Nor is anyone else but I guess they haven't noticed.

And now we know. Yay.

Daz